Finally Pursuing My Dream! Applied to BA Maritime Studies Program at UWF!

[BeginAgain]

Hello BeginAgain, congrats on pursueing your dreams. You are enbarking on an adventure that i wish I had done 20yrs ago. I'm so happy for you.

Thanks man! It's so liberating to be forced into a position to lose everything, only to turn it all around in your favor and start over doing something you were always too hesitant to try!

 

[scubatreasure]

Jake,
I have a friend that has a place for rent right on the river across from Sebastian inlet. Around $500. a month furnished. Let me know if you are interested. I to am in college and am going for radiology so that when treasure hunter's bring up a concretion that looks like it might be something I can x-ray it and see whats inside. This will also give me a paycheck to help me with my own adventures. I had my own life changing experience 6 years ago and I can totally relate to where you are coming from. I have taken under water archeology classes, in NJ, and laid out several grids and been involved in recovering artifacts. I have also done some salvage work and I admire Alexandre yet disagree with him on the statement he makes regarding the short sighted opinion that you can only do one or the other. False in my book. If that's the way your mind is wired than there is probably little anyone can do to change that. However, if you look at the cold hard facts and come to the conclusion that not all ships are that important. Their point of origin is known, their cargo is manifested and if ya wanna know how they were built Email the Spanish government and get yourself a copy of the blueprints. The clock is ticking on a lot of ships and their cargo, and unless we get off our buts and start recovering what we can they will be lost to time and tide. I also have two nieces and their friends currently enrolled in several schools in Florida and Texas with the intent of getting their degree in Archeology so we can start fighting this battle from within the ivory tower, and take it right to those big leather office chairs in Tallahassee, where I know they will serve their country by respecting the rights of it's citizens. What rights are those you might ask...The right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness...and it makes me very happy to spend my hard earned income and my valuable time looking for and identifying and salvaging treasure....Don't misunderstand me either...there are those ships that will be stumbled upon that require the white glove treatment if in fact there is anything left of it to get your little white gloves on...
Limo Bob

 

[BeginAgain]

Jake,
I have a friend that has a place for rent right on the river across from Sebastian inlet. Around $500. a month furnished. Let me know if you are interested. I to am in college and am going for radiology so that when treasure hunter's bring up a concretion that looks like it might be something I can x-ray it and see whats inside. This will also give me a paycheck to help me with my own adventures. I had my own life changing experience 6 years ago and I can totally relate to where you are coming from. I have taken under water archeology classes, in NJ, and laid out several grids and been involved in recovering artifacts. I have also done some salvage work and I admire Alexandre yet disagree with him on the statement he makes regarding the short sighted opinion that you can only do one or the other. False in my book. If that's the way your mind is wired than there is probably little anyone can do to change that. However, if you look at the cold hard facts and come to the conclusion that not all ships are that important. Their point of origin is known, their cargo is manifested and if ya wanna know how they were built Email the Spanish government and get yourself a copy of the blueprints. The clock is ticking on a lot of ships and their cargo, and unless we get off our buts and start recovering what we can they will be lost to time and tide. I also have two nieces and their friends currently enrolled in several schools in Florida and Texas with the intent of getting their degree in Archeology so we can start fighting this battle from within the ivory tower, and take it right to those big leather office chairs in Tallahassee, where I know they will serve their country by respecting the rights of it's citizens. What rights are those you might ask...The right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness...and it makes me very happy to spend my hard earned income and my valuable time looking for and identifying and salvaging treasure....Don't misunderstand me either...there are those ships that will be stumbled upon that require the white glove treatment if in fact there is anything left of it to get your little white gloves on...
Limo Bob

wow, thanks limo bob! i'm undecided between moving to the treasure coast and key west
the key west idea hinges on my attending the community college diving program there for a semester or not. Im not a certified diver and i figure that will jump start my chances of getting a job ob a salvage boat while i study online for the maritime studies degree.

 

[birdman]

Jake,it is funny .It seems you have the same dreams I grew up with and still fantasize about. Now I am ten years older then you waiting another 6 years till I can retire from the military .I have a fantastic wife and three daughters and am stuck in places I don't want to be a large part of the time. Man follow your dreams for sure . I would not trade my life or family for anything because of the experiences I have had but at the same time every where I go I still day dream of being on a boat of a beach somewhere looking for signs of the past. I grew up on the gulf coast and always want to get back there. God speed on your dreams/new career and don't loose touch with those girls. They are the best treasure out there.

 

[BeginAgain]

Jake,it is funny .It seems you have the same dreams I grew up with and still fantasize about. Now I am ten years older then you waiting another 6 years till I can retire from the military .I have a fantastic wife and three daughters and am stuck in places I don't want to be a large part of the time. Man follow your dreams for sure . I would not trade my life or family for anything because of the experiences I have had but at the same time every where I go I still day dream of being on a boat of a beach somewhere looking for signs of the past. I grew up on the gulf coast and always want to get back there. God speed on your dreams/new career and don't loose touch with those girls. They are the best treasure out there.

I appreciate that Birdman. My wife is Mexican and has been awarded full physical custody of my girls from... guess who... a Mexican court. I have joint legal custody but the girls are to remain in Mexico until they are a bit older and there's nothing I can do about it. I do not plan on living the rest of my days in Mexico, been there done that for over 5 years. I've thought about going and getting them and bringing them to the States (where they were born I'll have you know), but honestly, what can I offer them at this point in my life besides my love as their Father? Their mom is a good mom (but a terrible wife hahaha) and my in-laws are helping to take care of them daily. So that's good enough for me at the moment. Once I'm graduated, employed and stable, then I will be able to have them with me for extended periods of time. Until then, its just my anger and ego that tries to make me believe they'd be better off with me at the moment. I love them more than life itself, and that's why I know they are where they need to be at the moment.
At any rate, back to your post!
Dude, we share more in common than you think! I tried to join the service back in 2007 and 2008 as a 98G Cryptologic Linguist (Arabic and Spanish) but was rejected by the Army, USAF and Navy due to a PDQ resulting from weight-loss surgery I had in 2006. I had a year of college Arabic and wanted to get sent to the Defense Language Institute in Monterrey,CA. Test scores were VERY promising, but when they found out about my surgery, it was an immediate no-go. I even wrote to the Surgeon General's office to try to get a waiver, but there's an umbrella PDQ for all weight loss surgery recipients. What a joke.

 

[GOHO]

Jake, Sorry to hear about your family.... Just follow your calling and it will lead you to happiness....



I just read for the first time the links to Texas A&M about Treasure Hunters and it makes me sick! and to think i have considered persuing marine Archaeology myself. I think i will stick to what I'm doing and actually accomplish something worthwhile! I don't want to become a HYPOCRITE!!!

I would challenge any Marine Archaeologist or University to even come close to the standards we have set hunting the 1715 Fleet. We have developed Mapping software, conservation and excavation and remote sensing techniques that far exceed what any University has been able to do (at least what i have seen and read) and we've done it without TAX PAYER MONEY!!! It seems that all the so called "Archaeologist" look for the government to hand them grants and they really accomplish nothing with there excavations (Except for maybe teaching our students what a wreck looks like). What have they learned about 18Th century life aboard a ship that we don't all ready know? As for selling artifacts, how many silver or gold coins do you need to keep in order to understand what the coins were like?... There are literely Tens of thousand of these same exact coins discovered on the 1715 fleet so why keep them all. We use the excess to help fund our operation and that allows the public to actually own a piece of history instead of just read about it or view them thru a glass window....

Sooner or later the "Archaeologist" will have to except the fact that the Government cant afford to keep funding their excavation and they will hopefully open their eyes to working with the private sector.

Its funny to think that Archaeology started by Treasure hunting!!!!

There is a big misconception that Treasure Hunters just destroy shipwrecks which couldn't be farther from the truth at least on the 1715 fleet and the Atocha. I feel like i am saving history every time i surface with an artifact. We take special care on everything we recover. We map and photograph every artifact no matter how insignificant it may seem from a small piece of lead to Gold and Silver. We carefully clean and conserve everything that can be saved from ceramic, iron spikes, nails to large iron objects and precious metals. Our maps are so detailed that we can show where every single artifact was found for the past 25+ years and every attribute about that artifact.

Many people call us "Treasure Hunters" but really we are "Historic Shipwreck Salvors/Savers" Saving history for our future generation to enjoy.

I just have to added one more thing.... These ships that we salvage are scattered for many miles across the ocean bottom. How much money do you think a University would need to excavate one of these ships? Also, Its taken 50+ years and we are still recovering artifacts on a regular basis, What University could do that without TAX PAYER MONEY?

One of the points that Texas A&M tried to make was that we use investor money. Yes we do! Our investors give us support because they want to participate in something ADVENTUROUS and are willing to win or lose but the TAX PAYER gets nothing and no choice out of the Archaeologist when they excavate a wreck.

Thanks, Had to Vent!!!

 

[stevemc]

Well said! Honest, truthful and really the way it is. Too bad so many have drank the Kool-Aid!

 

[FISHEYE]

Greg,

The new archie students learn that when they find rat bones that they figure out what the rat had for breakfast,lunch and dinner and how the rat died and how he got on the ship in the first place.

 

[BeginAgain]

Wow! What a good post, I learned a lot that's for sure!

If all I really want to do eventually is own a salvage business, am I going about it the wrong way by getting a degree in Maritime Studies? I just don't have any other way to get into the business since I'll be new to the area (Florida) and don't have any acquaintances in the salvage business. What advice does everyone have for a newcomer?

 

[FISHEYE]

If you are going to school to become a archie,then if you do decide to go into the shipwreck biz,then you wont have to spend money to hire one for a new found wreck.You dont need to hire a archie if you are subcontracting for some one else.

 

[scubatreasure]

Well said GOHO,
You said what I could not...I only wish I had half the experience in this field that you do...We need you to RANT more often...and maybe on several different forums ...fight fire with fire and pass out a healthy dose of our own Kool Aid for these Bass Turds to drink...I can't even read the Texas A&M link because I know it will enrage me. Even through your rant your ability to maintain your professional composure is a testament to the man you are.

Limo Bob

 

[BeginAgain]

I already know I don't want to be an archaeologist per se. Like I said before, I just don't know any other way to get into the salvage business! From what I've seen and read, crew are usually family or friends of family or friends of friends, etc. I figure since I have no connections, but would love to get experience salvaging, I'd just let Uncle Sam pay for a maritime studies degree, which by the way, is not really an archaeology degree in itself. Its a much more broad degree dealing with archaeology, biology, history, law, government, and environmental science. Here's a pamphlet describing the degree from UWF in Pensacola... http://uwf.edu/cutla/ALC/Maritime_Studies_ALC.pdf
For someone to go from a BA Maritime Studies to a full fledged Archaeologist, they'd have to do a Masters or a PhD in Anthropology, which I have NO DESIRE to do!

 

[Red_desert]

Wow! What a good post, I learned a lot that's for sure!

If all I really want to do eventually is own a salvage business, am I going about it the wrong way by getting a degree in Maritime Studies? I just don't have any other way to get into the business since I'll be new to the area (Florida) and don't have any acquaintances in the salvage business. What advice does everyone have for a newcomer?

Welcome Jake!!! Florida is the right place for pursuing your dreams. Plenty of others working the leases. I'm not seeing any mention of new salvage sites being added off Florida. Most of them already are sufficiently magged, just need to get the info from someone.

 

[BeginAgain]

Wow! What a good post, I learned a lot that's for sure!

If all I really want to do eventually is own a salvage business, am I going about it the wrong way by getting a degree in Maritime Studies? I just don't have any other way to get into the business since I'll be new to the area (Florida) and don't have any acquaintances in the salvage business. What advice does everyone have for a newcomer?

Welcome Jake!!! Florida is the right place for pursuing your dreams. Plenty of others working the leases. I'm not seeing any mention of new salvage sites being added off Florida. Most of them already are sufficiently magged, just need to get the info from someone.

Thanks Red_Desert! Its good to be here. For the most part everyone has been very helpful so far in giving advice. I appreciate your comments.
Jake

 

[Archae33]

Jake, Sorry to hear about your family.... Just follow your calling and it will lead you to happiness....



I just read for the first time the links to Texas A&M about Treasure Hunters and it makes me sick! and to think i have considered persuing marine Archaeology myself. I think i will stick to what I'm doing and actually accomplish something worthwhile! I don't want to become a HYPOCRITE!!!

I would challenge any Marine Archaeologist or University to even come close to the standards we have set hunting the 1715 Fleet. We have developed Mapping software, conservation and excavation and remote sensing techniques that far exceed what any University has been able to do (at least what i have seen and read) and we've done it without TAX PAYER MONEY!!! It seems that all the so called "Archaeologist" look for the government to hand them grants and they really accomplish nothing with there excavations (Except for maybe teaching our students what a wreck looks like). What have they learned about 18Th century life aboard a ship that we don't all ready know? As for selling artifacts, how many silver or gold coins do you need to keep in order to understand what the coins were like?... There are literely Tens of thousand of these same exact coins discovered on the 1715 fleet so why keep them all. We use the excess to help fund our operation and that allows the public to actually own a piece of history instead of just read about it or view them thru a glass window....

Sooner or later the "Archaeologist" will have to except the fact that the Government cant afford to keep funding their excavation and they will hopefully open their eyes to working with the private sector.

Its funny to think that Archaeology started by Treasure hunting!!!!

There is a big misconception that Treasure Hunters just destroy shipwrecks which couldn't be farther from the truth at least on the 1715 fleet and the Atocha. I feel like i am saving history every time i surface with an artifact. We take special care on everything we recover. We map and photograph every artifact no matter how insignificant it may seem from a small piece of lead to Gold and Silver. We carefully clean and conserve everything that can be saved from ceramic, iron spikes, nails to large iron objects and precious metals. Our maps are so detailed that we can show where every single artifact was found for the past 25+ years and every attribute about that artifact.

Many people call us "Treasure Hunters" but really we are "Historic Shipwreck Salvors/Savers" Saving history for our future generation to enjoy.

I just have to added one more thing.... These ships that we salvage are scattered for many miles across the ocean bottom. How much money do you think a University would need to excavate one of these ships? Also, Its taken 50+ years and we are still recovering artifacts on a regular basis, What University could do that without TAX PAYER MONEY?

One of the points that Texas A&M tried to make was that we use investor money. Yes we do! Our investors give us support because they want to participate in something ADVENTUROUS and are willing to win or lose but the TAX PAYER gets nothing and no choice out of the Archaeologist when they excavate a wreck.

Thanks, Had to Vent!!!

I would like to point out the irony that it's tax payer dollars (including mine) that are apparently funding this fellow's education... I'm going to refrain from "venting" about how "unfair" it is that I spend about 90% of my waking time trying to thoroughly preserve artifacts and information about the past for future generations, while some of my tax dollars go to train the people who want to sell it all off to the highest bidder. I'm not angry about it... I'm a pretty laid back, sensible person... but I did want to point out that there are two sides to every coin.

I am glad to hear that artifacts from the 1715 Fleet and Atocha were so meticulously recorded (although I admit I've read contradictory statements about that). I wish more salvage teams would take such a careful approach. Unfortunately, most don't.

Archaeologists have actually been able to add a lot of information about the sites and time periods they study (both underwater and on land). However, it's also worth noting that the A&M website (while no doubt just as against 18th century shipwreck salvage teams as any other), do seem to make several references to shipwrecks of cultures that no longer exist, and for which we don't have written records. On that note, historical records are notorious for lying. The only way to really confirm them is through careful analysis of finds. Archaeologists even try to leave a part of any endangered site in place, in anticipation of more thorough recovery techniques developing in the future...

Anyways... I just wanted to toss in my 2 cents. I'm working on a research project that examines the relationship/perceptions that exist between archaeologists and collectors... My research is currently landlocked, so I'm not technically delving into salvage teams, but from what I've seen so far the reactions are pretty comparable. Despite my obvious allegiance to one side in particular, I emphasize with both sides, and varying extremes. I just wish we could find a middle ground, as they have in countries such as England.

 

[Au_Dreamers]

I honestly hope that you do become one of the archaeologists that work with private sector salvage.

" I spend about 90% of my waking time trying to thoroughly preserve artifacts and information about the past for future generations."

I personally know private sector salvors that can say the same thing. GOHO being one of them.

"while some of my tax dollars go to train the people who want to sell it all off to the highest bidder."

See, that is exactly the type of completely bias stereotyping statements that keep the "sides" apart.
Did Mel Fisher sell off "all of it" to the highest bidder? No!
Mel Fisher created a museum "to thoroughly preserve artifacts and information about the past for future generations".
This museum is the most visited museum in the Southeastern United States!

An investor in the Atocha project opened a museum almost 1300 miles away from Key West. This allows an entirely different demographic to experience those historical cultural resources.

Is "Unfortunately, most don't." bias opinion or factually based? My parents taught me stereotyping is bad and most of the time the person stereotyping is just showing their ignorance, narrow mindedness and prejudice.

Florida statute allows for the sale of historical cultural resources by the DHR that belong to the citizens of the state of Florida.

“For the purpose of the exchange, ****sale****(emphasis mine), or other transfer of objects of historical or archaeological value, the division is exempt from chapter 273.”

So if private sector salvage does the same, how is it “bad”?

“I just wish we could find a middle ground, as they have in countries such as England.”

We don’t need to find middle ground like England. We “had” it here and still do to a lesser degree because past legislations have eroded the rights of the private sector.

From the press releases it sure looks like England has a good working relationship with private sector salvage. It's the way it should be and in some cases in the U.S. still is. The finding of shipwrecks by private sector salvage and then the enlistment of a qualified Archaeologist to the project isn't something that should be looked upon with disdain it should be embraced as it is the best win win for all, private sector salvage, archaeologists and the public sector citizens.

We do have Archaeologists that work hand in hand with private sector salvage, but instead of them being used as examples they are often shown in a less than favorable position by their “academic peers”.

People should not try to box America into the politics of other countries because they do not have the same governmental structure nor the personal liberties and freedoms that we do. Of course dictators and monarchs within UNESCO believe they should have possession of their country's resources it is how their country is designed. Let's not forget that the bureaucrats of the United States are just stewards of our property. They are not the “Crown” that owns it all. When the “State of Florida” claims ownership of the historical resources within its borders it is not the entities nor individuals in Tallahassee that own it, it is EACH and EVERY citizen of the state that owns it.


"The finding of a great treasure from the days of the Spanish Main is not the cherished dream of only the United States and Florida citizens; countless peoples from other lands have shared such thoughts. It would amaze and surprise most citizens of this country, when their dream, at the greatest of costs, was realized, the agents of respective governments would, on the most flimsy grounds, lay claim to the treasure."
---Judge William O.Mehrtens
U.S. District Court of the Southern District of Florida
August 21, 1978 Ruling Against the State of Florida

 

[AGBlex]

Great post on the forum. Great story and even greater drive to do something you love. get out there get the degree and hands on time. with your widespread knowledge and vast amount of life experiences I'm sure you'd be one of the good guys out there on the boat finding all the wrecks and their treasure.