Need to know the Dangers of Opening a Tunnel

[HappyTrails55]

Okay so, I'm a old guy now (70) and have been looking for this old lost spanish mine for years now and we think we have found it but it has a rock boulder plug in it that we need to remove. It hasn't been opened for like 200 years. I want to know about the dangers with stuff like Bad Air and the devices that can detect it. I also want to know if there is any one of you professional speologists that has dealed with something like this and are available. Thanks, Darrell

 

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[1637]

sounds cool,good luck,be safe, please keep us posted,
brad

 

[Joanne]

Happy Trails, that sounds mighty exciting!

One of the real dangers of "bad air" is from rotting timbers. If the mine is dry, then that risk is diminished but not eliminated. Assuming that the location is anonymous and away from inquiring eyes, I would recommend pulling the boulder away from the adit just enough that the mine can "breath". Not necessarily even enough for someone to squeeze inside. If there are any other connections to the surface, the mine will naturally have convections that will exchange air in the mine. If not, rolling the boulder away a bit will allow natural heating and cooling, as well as barometric changes, to refresh the air in the mine. I would give it a week or two before entering.

I haven't used this company, but they rent gas meters by the day and week if you feel you need one. https://www.raecorents.com/rae-systems-qrae-3-personal-multigas-detector/

Of course, if you can find someone you trust with experience in mine work or mine exploring, it would be good for them to go with you for the initial survey of the mine. There are potential hazards that an experienced person will see that you may not.

Joanne

 

[eyemustdigtreasure]

Underground environment is NOT friendly...!
I speak with over 50yrs of caving experience.
Mines are more hazardous than caves (don't quote me!),
as puddles of water may appear to be shallow, but likely a flooded air and/or ore shaft...! DEEP!
Timbers straining under umpteen metric ton of pressure on all sides, can crumble under any influence,
trapping you - and since no map exists, it is up to you to find another way out...!
Hi-tech devices to test air quality is great to take with you. Tell someone where you will be found,
and when to expect your return....
Everything depends on Murphy's Law, where anything that can happen wrong, WILL HAPPEN, so
prepare for worst case situation...!
GL+HH!

 

[Milspec6]

There are really a lot of dangers that must be considered.

As a Confined Spaces Corodinator for several years, I can point out just a few right off the top of my head.

1. Presence of hazardous gasses
2. Wood rot weakening timbers which were likely marginally safe to begin with
3. Stagnant air is often low on oxygen and high on bacteria content....just ask the guy who opened King Tut's tomb about that one.

I think it would be a great adventure, but before you open it up, wear proper protection (PAPR system at least) and test the air quality before ever venturing inside and be prepared to pump in oxygen if necessary. I wouldn't trust any of the exisitng cribbage and would reinforce everything first.

Just go slow and do it right.

 

[FloodcityTom]

Just a thought but My Penna coal diggin ancestors used to use a small bird like a canary or a sparrow in a cage. I'd see if any bats made their home in the cave once opened before going further

 

[mrcolin2u]

Get a good blower to push some fresh air in there !!

 

[Xraywolf]

The dangers are legion, some obvious and some not - If you need to ask, I think it would be best to try to recruit someone with experience in these matters.

 

[cyzak]

Okay so, I'm a old guy now (70) and have been looking for this old lost spanish mine for years now and we think we have found it but it has a rock boulder plug in it that we need to remove. It hasn't been opened for like 200 years. I want to know about the dangers with stuff like Bad Air and the devices that can detect it. I also want to know if there is any one of you professional speologists that has dealed with something like this and are available. Thanks, Darrell

How big is this mine.

 

[HappyTrails55]

cyzak, well we know several things, the size of the spanish and indian people were on the average 5' to 5' 9" tall, the entrances were more like coyote holes for the most part and now we have pulled back the boulder and apparently the mine is buried with dirt and rocks and some of those rocks are the tailings of quartz, the underside of the boulder appears to have been hand carved FLAT see pic's

 

[cyzak]

cyzak, well we know several things, the size of the spanish and indian people were on the average 5' to 5' 9" tall, the entrances were more like coyote holes for the most part and now we have pulled back the boulder and apparently the mine is buried with dirt and rocks and some of those rocks are the tailings of quartz, the underside of the boulder appears to have been hand carved FLAT see pic'sView attachment 1853270View attachment 1853272View attachment 1853273

My interest was in if you had discovered some type of tailings left behind to actually indicate some type of digging. From your photos the area does not show that type of sign of disturbance how did you come upon the conclusion there was a mine.

 

[HappyTrails55]

cyzak well first of all I have some insider info and I will not reveal the source, 2nd is your member profile here says you know about mathematics and geometry, and 3rdly and the most important part is like what Calvin Keys calls the "yard" of where there is a god awful amount of old Spanish Monuments, so the first 3 pic's here is of the Alpha and Omega Man, then 2 pic's of a heart stone, then following it pic's of a pozo stone (air shaft covering), then a few of a sun sign, then one animal monument, then a turtle monument....I could go on and on with this, found their hacienda camp too and there's also a Map Rock and many, many more monuments and sign. It's taken me years to figure out the relationship to all of these and of course I had help too along the way of which I am not forgetting about. Picture numbers got screwed up, sorry

 

[cyzak]

You have definitely located an area that had activity you must proceed with caution though lots of false indicators to throw one off.It is in my findings that areas that were mined also held vaults that is one reason for so many types of signs.I know about time to I have one area I have been at for 8 years do not give up the reward will be worth it in the end just be real careful.

 

[William the Conqueror]

That's awesome to see all these clues! I'm glad you found a cave, that sounds so cool! If you pick up any rocks in the cave,don't bring them in the house! The rock odor will take all the oxygen out of the house! It'll be hard to breathe and you start coughing! I figured it out the hard way!

 

[augoldminer]

A O2 meter

A carbon monoxide meter and it can be one that you buy at a home store for in home use if its battery powered.

In some mines you will need a explosive gas meter. mostly coal mines.

A airflow meter is usefull. but if you know there if no explosive gasses someting that smokes will tell you if you have air movement.

the biggest thing you have to do is move the meters from floor to back as some gasses will pool down on the floor of a tunnel and if you walk through it it will be mixed with the tunnel air..

in that case you will walk in but as you try to walk out it will get you.

i use to use a old wolf safety lamp as i could set the flame to the middle ring on the glass and if the flame went down to the bottom ring i had to little O2 and if the flame went up to the top ring on the glass i knew i had explosive gasses.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2244156085...-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&toolid=10001
if it dos not have the three rings on the glass it's not a wolf safety lamp KOEHLER 209 PERMISSIBLE FLAME SAFETY LAMP it's a Friemann safety lamp

 

[Gare]

Happy Trails, that sounds mighty exciting!

One of the real dangers of "bad air" is from rotting timbers. If the mine is dry, then that risk is diminished but not eliminated. Assuming that the location is anonymous and away from inquiring eyes, I would recommend pulling the boulder away from the adit just enough that the mine can "breath". Not necessarily even enough for someone to squeeze inside. If there are any other connections to the surface, the mine will naturally have convections that will exchange air in the mine. If not, rolling the boulder away a bit will allow natural heating and cooling, as well as barometric changes, to refresh the air in the mine. I would give it a week or two before entering.

I haven't used this company, but they rent gas meters by the day and week if you feel you need one. https://www.raecorents.com/rae-systems-qrae-3-personal-multigas-detector/

Of course, if you can find someone you trust with experience in mine work or mine exploring, it would be good for them to go with you for the initial survey of the mine. There are potential hazards that an experienced person will see that you may not.

Joanne

FANTASTIC IDEAS thanks for posting and making us AWARE