No Trespassing?

[WaveHiMike]

I have found a place I want to hunt but I'm not exactly sure if I'm allowed to go there. It is an empty field owned by a real estate company that will eventually build a walmart or strip mall there. It used to be an old farm house. I think I'm going to go at night because I think during the day would be too risky. I'm mostly worried about being caught in a place that says no trespassing, which I'm not 100% sure if it says that but I think it might. Most likely I will go and not even be seen but you never know. Is this ok to do? Or am I breaking the rules. The only way I would be caught is if someone sees my light. I think tonight is the night I will do it too because it's warm enough and it was raining all day so the ground will be soft.

 

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[Honest Samuel]

Wave Hi Mike, Now for the real true answer. No trespassing means NO, or off to jail you will go. Maybe you look good in Orange. Go to the office and ask for the office manager, and info them that you like to search this site because it was a very old farmhouse. Also, tell them that you enjoy using your detector to locate old coins to add to your collection and pay for your detector and your bills. If they say No, it is nothing new for us treasure hunter. The cops may not want to walk a half mile, to take you off to jail, If they lazy like me, they may just shoot you. I hope that you can run fast. Good luck and good hunting.

 

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[Honest Samuel]

I have found a place I want to hunt but I'm not exactly sure if I'm allowed to go there. It is an empty field owned by a real estate company that will eventually build a walmart or strip mall there. It used to be an old farm house. I think I'm going to go at night because I think during the day would be too risky. I'm mostly worried about being caught in a place that says no trespassing, which I'm not 100% sure if it says that but I think it might. Most likely I will go and not even be seen but you never know. Is this ok to do? Or am I breaking the rules. The only way I would be caught is if someone sees my light. I think tonight is the night I will do it too because it's warm enough and it was raining all day so the ground will be soft.

This is number one.

I agree with the great interesting comments of Treasure_Hunter. Please take his advice.

 

[Tnmountains]

I love catching trespassers. I have to buy the rolls of a 100 at the co-op and post them on trees. Private property is private property. Permission is permission.
Now that you have posted your intentions on the world wide web ..you hunt it do not post it here or you will be banned. This site does not promote illegal activity.
Trespassing on private land to steal is illegal and not open for debate. You can be charged with trespassing and then with theft.
I cant believe I am even having to type this.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

I love catching trespassers. I have to buy the rolls of a 100 at the co-op and post them on trees. Private property is private property. Permission is permission.
Now that you have posted your intentions on the world wide web ..you hunt it do not post it here or you will be banned. This site does not promote illegal activity.
Trespassing on private land to steal is illegal and not open for debate. You can be charged with trespassing and then with theft.
I cant believe I am even having to type this.

X 2

 

[kingskid1611]

They are usually concerned about you getting hurt and then them being liable. When you ask for permission make them aware that you will carry your own insurance in regards to accidents. That is what their main concern will be.

 

[boogeyman]

How do you get permission?

Sounds like there's a real estate sign that might have a phone number on it. Call up the real estate agent and ask for permission. Make a point of letting them know you'll be cleaning up trash on your way out & won't be leaving holes etc..

Worst that can happen is you're told no. Best that can happen is you might get some leads to other spots all for picking up a few bags of trash.

Either one is better than getting arrested for trespass!

 

[flgliderpilot]

You will NEVER get permission, in fact I bet you won't even get a return phone call. The sign is for liability.

 

[Tnmountains]

They are usually concerned about you getting hurt and then them being liable. When you ask for permission make them aware that you will carry your own insurance in regards to accidents. That is what their main concern will be.

My insurance covers trespassers. If you want to cross over get permission.People call all the time when tracking a deer. No problem.
I often get turned down on places I want to go. It happens more and more. It's upsetting when you try to explain you will be a good steward but some num nuts before you snuck in and ruined it now for everyone.

 

[boogeyman]

You will NEVER get permission, in fact I bet you won't even get a return phone call. The sign is for liability.

Really!?!? I've gotten permission for three different sites over the years. The only drawback I've hit was when one guy moved to another company half way across the country- no more good leads. The trespassing signs aren't really for liability. They give a leg up for removing trespassers, as in a lot of jurisdictions the police won't do anything if it isn't posted (fact) and usually won't do a PPI (private property impound) on abandoned cars unless it's posted and have docs from a property owner or manager.

So with all that negativity you lose. Call and talk to the real estater, or better yet show up at his office with a release of liability in hand and a copy of the MDers creed. You'll never know if you don't ask.

 

[Keppy]

Automatic "No." Risk manager will shut it down. If you're a pirate, sun up to 7am. Hit it hard in prime likely spots!

Yes i am with Terry here..

 

[Keppy]

wave-hi-mike: You're asking this question on a forum where some people think you need permission to hunt city park sandboxes. So go figure the answers you'll get.

Would you ever use a short-cut path across a vacant lot ?

I am also with Tom_in_CA; here...

 

[GA_Boy]

Forget the Owner. If there is a Developer find out who the site contractor is for moving dirt, clearing trees, etc. The lower in the chain of command you get the better the chances are for getting permission.

 

[Anduril]

I understand the general thrust of your reply, and actually agree with the overall intent.
I am not condoning unlawful behavior.

However, this particular law reads "...when entry is prohibited under this Act", which is where the weirdness kicks in.

So, exactly "when" is entry prohibited?

Well, section (3) answers that very question:
It states that entry is "prohibited by notice to that effect" (i.e., a No Trespassing sign, or any of the other methods described in Section 5).
The remainder of Section 3 goes on to explain that certain properties are exempt from notice requirements; namely fenced, garden, and/or farmland properties.
As described, the vacant pre-construction Wal-Mart land would not qualify for these exemptions (although I suspect the signs are actually present, if the original poster were to go look for them).

So, the issue then is whether a property that is required to be placarded, but is not, fails to create the prohibition against trespass.
For this described property, the law is clear: Entry without trespass is prohibited CONTINGENT on the lawful placement of applicable signage.

So, "No signs, No prohibition." (i.e., no actual offence, and no legal basis for arrest for trespass.)

Still, that doesn't make it a good idea - just means that technically, in this example, without signage (or a fence, or oral notice), it's not illegal.
I would still either ask permission, or go detect elsewhere.

Not asking for permissions is bad for the hobby as a whole and makes it more difficult for others to obtain permissions!

 

[Honest Samuel]

Read # 22, and good luck.

 

[l.cutler]

I love catching trespassers. I have to buy the rolls of a 100 at the co-op and post them on trees. Private property is private property. Permission is permission.
Now that you have posted your intentions on the world wide web ..you hunt it do not post it here or you will be banned. This site does not promote illegal activity.
Trespassing on private land to steal is illegal and not open for debate. You can be charged with trespassing and then with theft.
I cant believe I am even having to type this.

I am glad this has been brought up. With every discussion on trespass, there is very little mention of the other legal issues. Unless you are planning on leaving anything you find behind, there is also theft to think about. If you were to take away something of enough value, you could be looking at a felony.

 

[Z.K.]

Asking permission is the right thing to do, and can lead to some unexpected things. I just got permission from a business which it turns out owns over 2000 acres of woodlands. I contacted them about a much smaller parcel..they allowed me access which far exceeded my original request.

 

[Tnmountains]

I am glad this has been brought up. With every discussion on trespass, there is very little mention of the other legal issues. Unless you are planning on leaving anything you find behind, there is also theft to think about. If you were to take away something of enough value, you could be looking at a felony.

Listen to this story its sad but true...... I saw an add in the paper of a guy near me that had a cannon ball for sale. I do not buy relics but thought I would check it out anyways. So I met the guy because he lived beside historic Chickamauga battlefield. He showed me the cannon ball and I saw right of way it was a Mill ball and not a cannon ball. I told him I liked to metal detect and he said he was care taker for an absentee land owner out of Fla that owned 50 acres by the park and I could hunt it if I wanted. Of course I had googled earthed his address and had my metal detector and tools with me.
So I bought the giant mill balls it seemed part of the deal and off I go across the street to my new spot with permission. The house had a for sale sign in the yard and lots of cut fields. He said he kept it mowed and to cover my holes. No problem I say. He also said to park in the carport so other people do not see my truck because then everyone will want to metal detect it and he did not want the traffic. I was in like flynn. Great spot with visions of relics! Sounds good yes?
I was hunting for about an hour dug a few horse and mule shoes and some iron when a truck pulls up the long drive and a guy jumps out with a pistol and tells me the police are on the way. I said what is going on? I have permission from the caretaker and gave him the guys name. He said he was the care taker and had been trying to catch the guy who gave me permission from trespassing and he mows the property not the other guy and he had pictures of the other guy on the property........ After a lot of explaining and showing him the mill ball and the newspaper add he realized I was telling the truth. Then the sheriff shows up and I have to explain it all over again. He ask the guy if he wants to prosecute me ,the real care taker calls the landowner who did live in Fla and explains the situation and the land owner says.... no.I felt like an idiot and I have a real estate list myself....everything had seemed so legit.
So bottom line I spent $ 35.00 on a mill ball almost go to jail and all because I thought I had permission to be where I was.
My opinion is make sure you have permission the right permission because its sure is not worth the hassle if you do not. Talk about a ruined day!
This is an embarrassing story in my metal detecting career but if it helps one person by telling it maybe it was worth it.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

....The lower in the chain of command you get the better the chances are for getting permission.

Why not ask the top guy in the company ? Are you suggesting for a moment that it's (gasp) subjective and whimsical ? Say it isn't so !!

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Tom this has nothing to do with a public city park, the land is private owned....

Which is exactly why I said "vacant lot" and not "city park". Vacant lots are privately owned, eh ?

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... So, "No signs, No prohibition." (i.e., no actual offence, and no legal basis for arrest for trespass.)

Still, that doesn't make it a good idea - just means that technically, in this example, without signage (or a fence, or oral notice), it's not illegal .....

Correct in CA law too. And, like you, NOT saying it's a "good idea" , but , just sayin'.

Consider this true story: An employee of mine's father had a small garden, in a small country town, on a corner lot. One day he pulled up to his garden JUST in time to see a truck pulling away, and the guy had just harvested a bunch of his vegetables from his garden. He was able to get the truck license #, and called the police.

The police show up, hear the man's gripe, look at the license # scribbled on the paper, and survey the situation. In the end, they told the vegetable gardener that they couldn't do anything about it. Why ? Because the gardener didn't have his site fenced or posted. So guess what the gardener did the very next day ? : PUT NO TRESPASSING SIGNS UP.

NOT because he cared if someone cut a shortcut path across it, or if someone metal detected it, etc.... But only to put teeth into it, if someone was stealing his veggies again.

Not saying that "veggie theft" is right, but ... just saying, there's merit to the legal thing that Anduril said. And by the way: I see a BIG difference in theft of someone's hard work, versus coins in the ground that no one knew or cared were there, and will just be covered with asphalt for the next 150 yrs.