Noticed Pin Point mode better than standard for searching?

[luciddream]

So I'm new to the hobby. 2 weeks now with my ace 250...I've found gold and other metal charms, plus a silver necklace already. Anyway, I say that to illustrate that I got pretty heavy into the hobby. I'm still learning my metal detector and I feel it's my best friend. I enjoy it so much. Anyway, today, I've been kind of thinking about the pin point function of the metal detector and have gotten a good feel for how it works...With that being said, I've noticed a very interesting side effect with the detector..It seems like the pin pointer mode is more sensitive than the standard swipe mode...I mean, if I pop my standard coil into the air away from any metal, hit the pin point button and then bring it near the ground, the detector seems to become a LOT more sensitive to the ground, metals, and area...Like I will not only get hits from under my coil, but I can get readings from a larger area over all...But at the same time, making it easy to pinpoint where the item is...From there, to verify it's not a false positive, you take it out of pin point mode and swipe it across to make sure you get a good pattern...Am I missing something here? Why wouldn't everyone use this mode more often? I seem to sweep a LOT faster doing it in pin pointer mode and my filter rate is a lot higher too...It really like exponentially increases my efficiency.

 

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[Irishgoldhound]

Pin point mode on the 250 is meant to be depressed once an object is found and held down to isolate the target, then released again. You can't hunt in pin point mode on the ace 250. That would mean you would have to keep your finger pushed on the button at all times. It's not like Excallibur or a Beach Hunter ID where you can hunt in pin point mode.

 

[luciddream]

I mean, I get what you're saying...But I tell you it works very well for me....In my opinion, better than the swing ding method.

 

[calisdad]

Are you saying for example, that you could locate a quarter at 8" in pinpoint mode that that you would have only found at 5" in standard mode?

I'll give it a try. At any rate learning your machine is key.

 

[FreeMindStuck]

You can actually detect items deeper in pin point mode (all metal) then discriminate mode. This is why the high end white's detectors have a mixed mode. Combination of pin point plus discriminate. I sometimes run my v3i in stereo mixed mode where I hear pin point in one ear and tonal discriminate in the other ear. The only disadvantage is that it can get extremely noisy in high junk areas.

 

[RobRieman]

Isn't a 250 all metal in the pinpoint mode?

 

[lawman0210]

I wouldn't want to hear all the buzzing in pinpoint mode and I believe using pin point mode will kill your batteries much quicker

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

[DDancer]

Pinpoint mode is all metal mode with no motion required on garret, whites and many other machiens. The reason your seeing the increase in sensitivity is because all discrimination is being turned off so you can locate your target. You can hunt in pinpoint but you wont be able to use the other bells a whistles while your at it.

 

[Diggin-N-Dumps]

I mean, I get what you're saying...But I tell you it works very well for me....In my opinion, better than the swing ding method.

So you ONLY use the Pinpoint thing?...Do you change you batteries every 2 hours..lol

Really thou...I wwouldnt see that being helpful at all. It there just to let you know abouts where to dig. Plus its good to see how large an object is.

I use it alot when i get a weak deep signal to determine whether its really a deep coin, or if its just Iron fooling me.

Because if you are trying to pinpoint a piece of iron 8" deep...it usually wont hit on anything

 

[lawman0210]

U should just run your detector wide open with no discrimination. I would thing using pinpoint all the time will certainly reduce the life span of the electronics

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

[OBN]

Lucidream
With that being said, I've noticed a very interesting side effect with the detector..It seems like the pin pointer mode is more sensitive than the standard swipe mode...I mean, if I pop my standard coil into the air away from any metal, hit the pin point button and then bring it near the ground, the detector seems to become a LOT more sensitive to the ground, metals, and area...Like I will not only get hits from under my coil, but I can get readings from a larger area over all...But at the same time, making it easy to pinpoint where the item is...From there, to verify it's not a false positive, you take it out of pin point mode and swipe it across to make sure you get a good pattern...Am I missing something here? Why wouldn't everyone use this mode more often? I seem to sweep a LOT faster doing it in pin pointer mode and my filter rate is a lot higher too...

That is Excellent detecting!!
Thinking outside of what all others do is the way to become a better hunter and getting the most from your machine. Many years ago before anyone was hunting with the Excalibur In Pin Point I was getting heckled by many for this, low and behold now it is the Hottest thing going if you own a Excalibur. Here is a note from Minelabs during that time to someone that questioned them about it...

FROM MINELAB: Bill xxxxx

I've heard this very same thing and it seems to be more perception than reality. Now in theory this might technically be true as when running in discrimination the detector is using a portion of its power to perform the discrimination which takes that away from putting it in the ground but in reality that difference is so minimal no one would see a difference outside of a lab with high end instruments. Plus, I've never been able to duplicate it through testing It never found a target in Pin Point that I haven't found in Discriminate.
Also, from a personal level, as An excel user I don't understand why someone would want to hunt in pin point as that's all metal and I for one don't want to waste my time digging junk when I could be finding good targets.

Minelab Americas | 1418 Brook Dr., Downers Grove, IL 60515 USA

Underlined........
You know the really funny part about this is he does not even know that when you turn the Excalibur on it puts out a transmit signal, no matter what your settings are it does not change, you turn the detector on, it is there. From testing a few water machines I have found this to be true of them also...Whites DF PI, AT Pro, and Garrett Infinium LS PI...

 

[Tenderfoot]

WhT do you mean by the Excaliber puts out a "transmit signal"?

 

[OBN]

WhT do you mean by the Excaliber puts out a "transmit signal"?

Sends out Electromagnetic field, (TX field, transmit signal/field) the RX receives the targets that are lite up by the TX signal. To improve the send and return signals I have by passed the circuit's on Excalibur boards. Does it help, Need to take the time and test.




Right now testing endcap for coil changing on the Excalibur. Seems the remote PP on the Excalibur is good to go, sold several kits last season US, Japan, Australia, Germany, Spain, England, and the list goes on....

 

[Tenderfoot]

What does that do? You're over my head.

 

[gallileo60]

There was an old thread about installing a switch to keep it in pin point mode..I have used my ace many times like that..

 

[Carl-NC]

All-metal modes (inc pinpoint) are usually a little deeper than disc modes. Audio response is also faster, as well as noisier. Zero-motion pinpoint can drift so you may need to occasionally do a reset. It does not chew up batteries any faster.

 

[OBN]

Off subject......

Carl can you explain to me this field that I hearing in the video, it extents way beyond what is report on a target in the headphones....why does the detector not respond to targets that pass thru it at it's furthest point....I am using a audiosears speaker much like a crystal radio to pick up the field, I'm using a sound meter to measure it. Many Thanks....

Also it seems to be stronger one side of the coil to the other...if I remember correct..And this is the Minelab Excalibur, Tested a few others, same... Whites DF, the field was very large...

 

[Carl-NC]

Targets have a round-trip signal, that is, the TX field has to be strong enough to generate strong enough eddy currents that create a strong enough field back at the RX coil to generate a strong enough receive signal to detect. On a DD or 00 loop the TX coil is on one side and the RX coil on the other, so the TX field is stronger on the TX coil side.

 

[DDancer]

I remember that video... it was a bit on EMI a while back. You didn't explain you were using a speaker for a pickup then and I kind of bashed the idea of measuring EMI with an audio meter. Interesting trick. Still don't agree with that particular post but oh well~ I'm not going to dig into it anymore.

What Carl is explaining is essentially true. I'd like to add that the reason your seeing the transmit field so far out from the coil is that radio emissions extend indefinitely from the source they are broadcast from. With the right equipment you could pick up the transmission from anywhere in line of sight from the detector. As Carl also pointed out the receiver will only pick up that part of the transmission as it interacts with a target if its of sufficient strength to be interpreted as a target by the detector circuits. An example of this would be picking up a small coin at 10 inches with a 11 inch coil but picking up a boat anchor at 2 feet with the same coil.

As to the subject of using Pin Point for detection I'll have to disagree that it does not eat up batteries any faster than Disc mode. It may or may not be a strong effect, the depletion of the batteries, but because Pin Point constantly drives the audio circuits this will affect battery life in a detector. Disc mode uses less power because the audio is not always turned on and only sounds for target identification. With headphones and low volume the affect would be negligible but using external speaker it would be more pronounced. The battery drain will be different between different types of detectors in my opinion.

If you like using pinpoint to detect go for it~ its just all metal mode

 

[OBN]

Thanks Carl I figured all but was hoping for more and possible a solution to more depth.

I remember that video... it was a bit on EMI a while back. You didn't explain you were using a speaker for a pickup then and I kind of bashed the idea of measuring EMI with an audio meter. Interesting trick. Still don't agree with that particular post but oh well~ I'm not going to dig into it anymore.

Yes, The post was not mine, I was just showing what is emitted and I to did not agree with all that was said, special since it was coming from someone that had just got into metal detecting less then a year. I hide the fact that I was using a audiosears 2463 speaker, I noticed it one day when I was working on a Excalibur board. Powered up the PCB with the coil only and heard audio coming from a box of speakers I had setting on the desk. It only works with the audiosears 2463....

And you are correct on the battery drain, all from the headphones....

Thanks DD for the follow up expiations, just confirms what I question from time to time and readings from the old masters over on FM, Eric and the boys...


I use almetal 99% of the time and the shared info from discriminate with a quick toggle of the switch to determine the target..(more nfo)..with AM one can run the sensitivity higher then in Disc giving better depth I have found, then the quick toggle the target is read and has no time to false, while the sensitivity is higher... And these are saltwater conditions..