Really - 4,453 sales of what???

[maine_Jim]

I was thinking of selling off a bit of my CRH finds this week so I checked ebay for what was selling...really couldn't believe what I saw. How in the world could you sell 4,453 rolls of un-searched rolls? Wow. That is all I could say to myself.

Maine_Jim

 

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[SD51]

Unsearched? If they were truly unsearched, I would expect to see old looking wrappers, not brand new white wrappers on every roll.

 

[Diver_Down]

I don't see the benefit of the costs/hassle. With ebay's fees and the seller paying for the shipping, they are at most making $1-$2/roll. Now, I guess you can make the argument that even at $1/roll, the seller made $4K in profit. Their profit is probably even less after you factor in the cost of bubble mailer envelope, tape, ink cost to print the labels (paper), etc. It just seems like it wouldn't be worth the hassle.

Then if you have buyers that claim a roll was damaged/lost in shipping, demanding a return, etc., it wouldn't be worth it to me. Good for that seller to have the patience.

 

[Diver_Down]

Unsearched? If they were truly unsearched, I would expect to see old looking wrappers, not brand new white wrappers on every roll.

The seller is just buying boxes of halves from the bank. Of course, the paper will be bright white. They are likely weighing the rolls and keeping any heavy ones that would indicate a roll containing silver or more than 20 coins. Any that are light are placed in the unsearched rolls inventory available for sale.

 

[maine_Jim]

I'm pretty sure there aren't any "enders" being shipped out!

Maine_Jim

 

[maine_Jim]

It does seem like a lot of work for little money but still over 4k in sales! What the ****! I couldn't believe there were that many suckers around!

Maine_Jim

I don't see the benefit of the costs/hassle. With ebay's fees and the seller paying for the shipping, they are at most making $1-$2/roll. Now, I guess you can make the argument that even at $1/roll, the seller made $4K in profit. Their profit is probably even less after you factor in the cost of bubble mailer envelope, tape, ink cost to print the labels (paper), etc. It just seems like it wouldn't be worth the hassle.

Then if you have buyers that claim a roll was damaged/lost in shipping, demanding a return, etc., it wouldn't be worth it to me. Good for that seller to have the patience.

 

[Diver_Down]

The seller is setting aside 10 or so rolls of their supply and flipping them. Just renews the ad whenever they sell enough that drops the availability below what they stated was available. The 4000 is just a cumulative total since they started selling from that specific ad. I suppose it isn't that big of a deal to do what they have done. And yes, there are a bunch of people that will take a chance. Some see a roll of halves as a great rarity as they never seen them available at the bank or in circulation. We of course know otherwise. Still wouldn't be worth the hassle for me.

Side note of a selling experience - I had sold a group of rolls of Mint rolled state quarters and a tube of greaser quarters. I didn't count the tube. As anyone knows, a tube sometimes doesn't hold a full roll due to rim thickness, the exacting standards of the Chinese manufacturing, etc. Well, I described the listing as "rolls" and with that was the assumption that every roll contained 40 quarters. The Mint rolls were of course true, but the tube was short 1. Well, the buyer didn't like the degree of grease filled die strikes so they demanded a refund stating the listing wasn't as described (not exact quantity). Fine by me as the buyer barely had paid over the face value of the lot and after eBay fees, I was losing money. So when I got them back, the Mint rolls had busted open. I was a little ticked off as the rolls with the wrap intact would have allowed me to resell them as "unsearched". Since I now had the rolls already "opened", I might as well search them. 2 of the rolls in the lot were of the Alaska state quarter. There is a known variety with extra claws on the bear. Between the two rolls, I discovered enough of the extra claws to make a full roll. I even released a few into circulation that weren't as clear as I would like. So thankfully, I now have a full roll of mint state Alaska state quarters with extra claws all because the original buyer didn't want to settle for 1 less quarter in a tube.

 

[maine_Jim]

That is funny! I have been lucky on ebay as I've never been stiffed. I have sold some mint rolls before, dollar coins for twice face and I had my best luck with the 2009 Lincoln cents when one of the issues was released in Maine before most other states and I sold a bunch of sealed boxes. The best went for about $175 for a $25 sealed box. I think I sold about a dozen boxes before they were released around the country.

Maine_Jim

The seller is setting aside 10 or so rolls of their supply and flipping them. Just renews the ad whenever they sell enough that drops the availability below what they stated was available. The 4000 is just a cumulative total since they started selling from that specific ad. I suppose it isn't that big of a deal to do what they have done. And yes, there are a bunch of people that will take a chance. Some see a roll of halves as a great rarity as they never seen them available at the bank or in circulation. We of course know otherwise. Still wouldn't be worth the hassle for me.

Side note of a selling experience - I had sold a group of rolls of Mint rolled state quarters and a tube of greaser quarters. I didn't count the tube. As anyone knows, a tube sometimes doesn't hold a full roll due to rim thickness, the exacting standards of the Chinese manufacturing, etc. Well, I described the listing as "rolls" and with that was the assumption that every roll contained 40 quarters. The Mint rolls were of course true, but the tube was short 1. Well, the buyer didn't like the degree of grease filled die strikes so they demanded a refund stating the listing wasn't as described (not exact quantity). Fine by me as the buyer barely had paid over the face value of the lot and after eBay fees, I was losing money. So when I got them back, the Mint rolls had busted open. I was a little ticked off as the rolls with the wrap intact would have allowed me to resell them as "unsearched". Since I now had the rolls already "opened", I might as well search them. 2 of the rolls in the lot were of the Alaska state quarter. There is a known variety with extra claws on the bear. Between the two rolls, I discovered enough of the extra claws to make a full roll. I even released a few into circulation that weren't as clear as I would like. So thankfully, I now have a full roll of mint state Alaska state quarters with extra claws all because the original buyer didn't want to settle for 1 less quarter in a tube.

 

[Holt0222]

I mean I do this with Eisenhower coins. 5 coins for $13. It works great as a little side income.

 

[Avago]

Here's the math, for those interested... The return gets better on multiple rolls sold due to the nature of combining shipping:

One roll -> $15.50 minus PayPal/eBay fees of 13% total ->$13.48 minus cost of standard shipping on 9oz ($3.34 USPS) -> $10.14 minus the $10.00fv of the roll leaves FOURTEEN CENTS PROFIT on one roll.

Two rolls -> $31.00 minus PayPal/eBay fees of 13% total ->$26.97 minus cost of Priority flat rate shipping in a standard flat rate box ($7.05 USPS) -> $19.92 minus the $20.00fv leaves a SEVEN CENT LOSS on two rolls.

The KEY is, once you get above selling two rolls to a single buyer you can start to squeeze more into a single small flat rate box but pay the same to ship. I would estimate you could probably fit at least ten rolls in one small flat rate box.

Ten rolls -> $155.00 minus PayPal/eBay fees of 13% total ->$134.85 minus cost of Priority flat rate shipping in a standard flat rate box ($7.05 USPS) ->$127.80 minus the $100fv invested leaves $27.80 PROFIT on ten rolls

Bottom line, for every roll over TWO that the seller sells he profits about $3.50 because of combining shipping.

Not much to say about the ethic at play other than if people are dumb enough to demand it at that price, someone is going to supply it.

 

[Diver_Down]

Thanks for the breakdown, Avago. It also doesn't factor in residual costs related to shipping and processing such as the bubble mailer (for 1-2 rolls), ink/paper for shipping label, packing peanuts/material if shipping in the larger box, etc. Many sellers just consider it a "cost of business". But when you do a lot of selling, the costs add up.

I only use my printer for shipping labels. Can't recall when I last used it for anything other. Black ink runs me $30 every 3 months. Just used up my packing peanuts recently and had to buy more. It was a Buy 2 - Get 1 free. Bought 2 of the 2 cu.ft bags for $35. I only use flat rate packaging so I don't have to pay for the box, but buyers frown upon any cost over the actual. eBay charges 10% on shipping cost even if it is at cost. They do give a discount when print the label, but for every parcel that I ship, I lose money. The med. FR box is $13.65 which is what I charge the buyer. eBay charges $1.36 in fees (in addition to the final value fee) on the shipping. I receive an $.80 discount for printing the label. So not factoring the ink cost, packing peanuts, tape, I lose $.56 on every parcel that I ship. It sucks, but I try to offer the cheapest costs to the buyer. What really sticks in my craw is when people leave detailed seller ratings indicating that the shipping costs are too high. I call it the Amazon effect. People are so indoctrinated in expecting free shipping that sellers who actually charge for it even though we lose money are considered gouging the customer.

 

[Holt0222]

Oh of course. That’s why I always build it into the cost. So if it gona cost 6 to ship I’ll charge 3 and build 3 in or build all 6 in and do free shipping

 

[A2coins]

If its too good to be true its not true....lol

 

[port ewen ace]

OR______ go buy your own box for face---

 

[cyberdan]

I mean I do this with Eisenhower coins. 5 coins for $13. It works great as a little side income.

I once bought a bag ($1000) from a Brinks type company. Tried to sell some on ebay and never got a nibble. (buy the way I searched the bag BIG SKUNK but at least the armored car company sold a full bag)

 

[cyberdan]

OR______ go buy your own box for face---

At the top it says over 15000 rolls sold. Glad he didn't tell those people about this t-net forum.

 

[mark1982]

Some people also have eBay stores and special deals they get with eBay as far as seller fees go. They might not take as big of hit on the fees like the average seller would

 

[GMan00001]

Here's the math, for those interested... The return gets better on multiple rolls sold due to the nature of combining shipping:

One roll -> $15.50 minus PayPal/eBay fees of 13% total ->$13.48 minus cost of standard shipping on 9oz ($3.34 USPS) -> $10.14 minus the $10.00fv of the roll leaves FOURTEEN CENTS PROFIT on one roll.

Two rolls -> $31.00 minus PayPal/eBay fees of 13% total ->$26.97 minus cost of Priority flat rate shipping in a standard flat rate box ($7.05 USPS) -> $19.92 minus the $20.00fv leaves a SEVEN CENT LOSS on two rolls.

The KEY is, once you get above selling two rolls to a single buyer you can start to squeeze more into a single small flat rate box but pay the same to ship. I would estimate you could probably fit at least ten rolls in one small flat rate box.

Ten rolls -> $155.00 minus PayPal/eBay fees of 13% total ->$134.85 minus cost of Priority flat rate shipping in a standard flat rate box ($7.05 USPS) ->$127.80 minus the $100fv invested leaves $27.80 PROFIT on ten rolls

Bottom line, for every roll over TWO that the seller sells he profits about $3.50 because of combining shipping.

Not much to say about the ethic at play other than if people are dumb enough to demand it at that price, someone is going to supply it.

You are pretty close, but using 13% to estimate fees works best for higher dollar amounts as it ignores the $0.30 paypal transaction fee which is significant for lower sales prices. I just recently started selling stuff on ebay and some of what I am selling falls into the $3-$5 range, so I just finished going through this analysis for myself to figure out if it is was worth it.


For example, if you charge a shipping cost of $1.09 and you sell an item for $0.50, the paypal and ebay fees collected will be $0.51 (or 31.7%) of the total $ collected ($1.59), but as your sales price increases, the fee % drops.

Note: The following table assumes the sale was from one of the 50 free listings a month and the shipping cost was set to $1.09 and $1.09 was your actual shipping expenses at cost (no extra $ built in).

Total sale without shipping (Fees charged - fee %) - [Amount left to acquire the item being sold] - {Net if item acquired at 50% sale price}
---------------------------------------
$0.50 ($0.51 - 31.77%) - [-$0.01] - {$0.26 loss}
$1.00 ($0.57 - 27.25%) - [$0.43] - {$0.07 loss}
$2.00 ($0.70 - 22.61%) - [$1.30] - {$0.30 profit}
$3.00 ($0.83 - 20.24%) - [$2.17] - {$0.67 profit}
$4.00 ($0.96 - 18.79%) - [$3.04] - {$1.04 profit}
$5.00 ($1.09 - 17.83%) - [$3.91] - {$1.41 profit}
$10.00 ($1.73 - 15.61%) - [$8.27] - {$3.27 profit}
$20.00 ($3.02 - 14.32%) - [$16.98] - {$6.98 profit}
$50.00 ($6.89 - 13.49%) - [$43.11] - {$18.11 profit}
$100.00 ($13.34 - 13.20%) - [$86.66] - {36.66 profit}
$500.00 ($64.94 - 12.96%) - [$435.06] - {$185.06 profit}

The high fee % for low sales prices is why it isn't worth selling low $ items on ebay. Obviously if you acquire the item for less than 50% of the final sales price, you will make more and can sell some things for $1, but you aren't making much per transaction.

Taken to an extreme, say for some reason you wanted to sell an empty envelope on ebay listed with free shipping. Your actual shipping cost today would be $0.50 for the stamp and say $0.05 for the envelope (includes the ink to address it). To break even you would need to sell that empty envelope for $0.98.



Getting back to the example, we are both assuming the seller is using a free listing or else there will also be an ebay insertion fee of approximately $0.35. We are also assuming the user does not run an ebay store or else the fee structure is different.

I reran the numbers subtracting the paypal transaction fee using your shipping costs.

Single roll:
It would be a $0.14 loss on a single roll before subtracting expenses such as the cost of the envelope, paper and ink for the packing slip, etc.

Two rolls:
It would be a $0.35 loss before subtracting actual shipping expenses.

Three rolls:
It would be a $3.15 profit before subtracting shipping expenses.

For each roll after the third:
As stated, there would be an additional $3.50profit as there wouldn't be any additional shipping expenses.


If it were me, I wouldn't sell less than 3 rolls as it would be at a loss.

 

[maine_Jim]

I guess the volume makes it worth it - they seem to sell a ton of coins. All free shipping but a lot of sales. I still can't believe these people don't just call a few banks and ask if they are available!

Maine_Jim