School Bully

[michigan michael]

I first started detecting last February. I had a lot of questions and ended up on the defense. I am posting this to gain some insight as to how each person might of handled this situation. Please do not turn this into a personal attack or personal judging issues on myself or anyone else who replies. Thanks so much for everyones insight.

I have been detecting a small school in a small town. I have recovered some silver and have not bragged to anyone about it. I first showed up about a month ago and the grounds keeper yelled at me and my son for metal detecting. I told him that I understood his concerns and assured him that we take great concern about how the area looks when we are done. I explained the process and he said alright. He watched and went on about his business. I sensed he was busy and did not really have time for me. A few nights ago I had a police officer fly in the parking lot and start watching me. It was not long and a second police officer followed. I waved but they did not respond. They were close enough that I could hear them talking. One cop asked the other if they were going to come and talk to me and the other said, "I don't see why he is not causing any damage or bothering anyone." They started visiting with each other then left. I suspected someone had called them by the way they both flew in in such a short time. I went back today and walked the yard as I always do to to check on my plugs. I noticed there was a few brown spots but there has not been much rain either. I went to the trunk and pulled out a gallon of water to water my plugs and the grounds keeper came out and said, " Can I help you?" I told him that I was going to use my detector again but I wanted to water a few spots that was starting to dry out. He said , "I don't like them metal searcher things!" I started to explain the hobby again and he got ticked! He proceeded to tell me how he chased kids out a few days ago and how there was huge holes left open in the baseball and football fields. He says people come here all the time and dig holes, kill the grass, and leave their trash everywhere. I told him I have came here a few times and have not ever seen anything like he was describing. I assured him this was not my practices and picked up trash when I came across it. I also told him I do not detect sport fields and he flat out said, "I do not want you here!" I apologized for making him upset and as I was heading back to my car I asked, " I am sorry for the continued hassle but I am curious, Are there any city or village laws that state No Metal Detecting?" He said well no there is not. ( Which told me probably has already looked into this.) He said the school should have something to say about their own property shouldn't they? I told him he 100 % right I just wanted to make sure I was not violating the law (which I knew I was not) when I plead my case to the school board. I told him I had kids and was a tax payer and disagreed with the idea of one persons opinion ruling the fact of if I could use a metal detector on school property. He threw his hands up and said F*$* it! Tear it up! Do what you want! Whatever! He walked away. I watered my holes and left.

I guess I probably should of left well enough alone because I know the school board would probably side with the grounds keeper anyway. I just had a hard time with the fact of the man telling lies about open holes, trash, and destruction. I also had a small issue with the power trip he was carrying. I know there are some Boy Scout types out there that will seek permission no matter what but, that is not me. If its public its almost always free game. Private land is always PERMISSION ONLY. On that note..... What would you do? What would you have done different? What would you do next? I really want to go back to this spot but am worried it may open a can of worms at many other places. Thanks for reading my long story and my concerns for this situation. Thanks for any and all responses.

 

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[AU24K]

Since I have 4 detectors, I would have engaged him to think of BETTER sites to go to that he might have known of. I'd have said that we could both go and he could use one of my detectors. I'd have also engaged the police officers in a similar discussion.
Scott

 

[Likely Guy]

Hey MM,

I think that you did everything right that you could do, diplomatically, at that time. From what you said, I think that 'Groundskeeper Willy' was used to having his own way, was just having a bad day, or was really pissed at the school board at that time.

To sooth an adversary, it's necessary to get into 'Willys' head space.

Those grounds, as a caretaker, are 'his space'. In his eyes you invaded 'his space', no more no less than a crapping dog, a vandal carving doughnuts with a 4x4, or a litterer (like I said, maybe he just happened across you when he was having a really bad day).

No compaints on your response. You're, by the sounds of it, within your rights and did the right and responsible things (i.e. watering your plugs, picking up trash...)

Long story short, find out what his schedule is, pack one killer of a lunch and share it with him. Be warm, and friendly, take the high road, "I'm sorry how we met the other day..."

That will go a long way. He'll soon find out that you're on his side. When he's not there, assure him that you'll help him 'look after it' and that you too share his concerns.

(P.S.: I used to be a Groundskeeper/Caretaker Willy... a cup of coffee, a little macaroni salad and a nice sandwich go a long way, and like I said, 'take the high road'.)

 

[Tom_in_CA]

MM, for starters, I would not take an instance like this, and extrapilate it out to all parks and schools. That is to say, invariably, people read of exceptions like this guy, and assume "oh no, I can't hunt schools or parks without asking" blah blah. To the contrary, I see encounters like this as the exception. And yes, the public employee on-hand is given latitude to interpret the laws as he feels, and yes, his superiors are likely to side with him, even in the absence of specific prohibitions. I mean, think of it: even if there is no rule, all he'd have to say is "I saw him digging" etc... and you'll loose the debate, even if all you were doing is probing, not leaving marks, etc.... So when I encounter a person like this, I avoid just that one person. Like, go back when he's not on shift. I mean, certainly he's not working on a late Sat afternoon, or whatever. What he doesn't know can't hurt him, eh?

I've gotten to where I do most of my park and school hunting in way off hours (even night-hunting for that matter) just to avoid busy-bodies.

 

[jeff of pa]

I see several Options.

Hunt on Sundays,
Go to the School Office & Ask Permission.
or just ignore him

either way, you heard the police
say nothing was wrong, and him say
said &*$* it! Tear it up!

You said You Fear the Board will Create a Rule,
Let them. Your already Uncomfortable.
Hunt the site till They Ban it, & Move on,
Or Move on so Future Hunters Who arn't
Uncomfortable Can. Your Option.


Enjoy Yourself.

 

[Arizona Bob]

I was just wondering, how old is this school? Besides finding kids lost lunch coins/money, I wonder what else you are expecting to find. I'm also wondering whether your (potential) hassle is worth it for coinshooting when there are so many other (less difficult) places to go hunt for pocket change.

 

[michigan michael]

That is an interesting idea AU24. I will hold that one later for any future situations, should they arise. The way this guy was talking with me, well I don't think he wants to hang out now. I bet this would work more times than not though. Thanks for the angle.

I am not to sure the lunch idea would work for this guy but, it is a great idea to consider. I wonder if my face to face presence would not make him more angry.

As far as Tom and Jeff's replies...... I think I am going to head back one more time. The wife and I are considering a Sunday eve hunt. We plan to hit it fast and hard and move on. If I do talk with the board, I will wait to approach them until the end of next school year. I do not hunt schools until summer breaks anyways.

Arizona Bob, I have asked myself this same question. I have found silver dimes at this location. Two in one hole and one and a wheat in another hole. I know that is not a lot of silver to some but, is sure seems like a lot to me. The school was built in the mid 30's and is the only one in this small town. I have only hunted this area about 3 or 4 times and pulled more silver than I have areas that I have spent 10 times the amount of time. I just cant stop wondering if more is waiting..... laying.... hoping to see the sun again.


Thanks for everyones views and advice. I value all of it.

 

[Monty]

One groundskeeper/custodian approached me one day and asked me if I knew I was on school property, like there was something wrong with that. I responded just as friendly as I could with a big smile that yes I knew it, after all I helped pay for it. He started laughing and said,"You got me there". and asked if I would help him find some water taps that had been covered up by construction. I replied of course I would and found two of them for him. From then on he just waved and asked me if I was finding anything. Apparently he was the supervisor of maintenance for all the city schools and I have talked with him several times since. One day he even unlocked a gated area for me and told me to be sure and put the padlock back on when I was done. A little kindness goes a long way in some situations. I was all geared to do battle if necessary, but didn't have to. Monty

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Monty, thanx for the story to keep balance I too have had folks approach (cops, gardeners, or a person in suit & tie, or whatever) and thought "oh no, here comes a busy-body". And quite often, it's not at all that! Someone who just wants to know what you found, how deep the machine goes, or spinning a treasure story, etc.... But the problem of the internet, is it tends to be the bad news stories (human nature) that get the press (the nice passerbys are quickly forgotten). And all it takes is for a bad encounter to get printed, and sometimes the cautious nature in all of us can think "oh no, everyone hates m'ding, and danger lurks around every corner" It would be sort of like reading auto-accident statistics: If we all thought about it enough, we'd think we had to drive "on pins and needles". Even though, as long as you're not a driving nuisance, you'll generally steer clear of trouble, and ignore the other driver who might occasionally flip you off. Same concept for md'ing

 

[michigan michael]

Another upbeat addition ..... I went to another school today and landed another silver dime. I had a police officer pull up and wave at me. a little while later I was knelled down at a hole and a security officer assigned to the school came up and asked how I was doing. I said check this out and started showing some of my finds. We talked for about a half hour and he said good luck on the rest of your day. Today was a better day.

 

[Monty]

Having a good sense of humor has helped me keep out of trouble with most people I have encountered on public property. Usually I can crack a joke or two with a big smile and they seem to mellow. I think it has a way of disarming them before they can get their mad going. Just don't get too personal at first and try to put out the good guy aura even though you would like to smack them upside the head sometimes. Another tip is to change the subject and get them mad at something else instead of you. I once had a grounds keeper at a museum mad at the squirrels for not filling up their holes they dug. It went somethng like, " Hey, you can't dig up the sod here"!. "Yeah, I know and just look at what the squirrels are doing to the grass, isn't that terrible?" " They've dug holes all over the place, just look at this!" (Showing him some squirrel diggings). "What can you do about these pests?" "Maybe I can fill some of them up for your while I am at it". " Would you?" I'd sure appreciate it". "I'll do my best, and thanks for giving me the opportunity to tidy tings up". "That's OK man, and we appreciate the public helping out". It worked! Monty

 

[michigan michael]

you completely turned that back around. Thats awesome.