Testing water flow and new Infinity jet nozzle, input needed

[TheEquineFencer]

I've posted in a couple of forums but have not got an answer yet.: Infinity nozzle I built.; Calculating water flow from a horizontal pipe using the Purdue method? Chart with the Diameter for a 3 inch pipe and "X" horizontal flow and "Y" vertical drop would be nice.
I finally have my pipes/hoses and such and I'm heading up to my pond to see what kind of flows I get and to just "play around with the new nozzle."
I do not have a vacuum gauge, so I guess I'll use the "hand test" method for now. I'll see what kind of results i get. Keeping the intake clean is going to be a challenge I'm sure.
Later after I've run the nozzle a while...
OK, I know this is not perfect but here's what I can remember abou what I did. Free flow at idle speed, low throttle setting, 2 inch x 25 foot pipe from the pump, (1) 90* fitting on pump, put out about a 24 inch horizontal stream of water that at 2 inch down struck the water column. I then flowed the 2 inch output into a 100 gallon stock tank and it took about 1 minute 10 seconds to fill the tank. The pump was about 4 feet above the pond water level BTW. We dumped the 100 gallon tank. I then attached it to the nozzle I built and dumped the 3 inch outlet into the stock tank. It took 1 minute and 17 seconds to fill at idle speed. I had about 8 inches out before it struck the water column at 3 inches. I then stuck the nozzle in the stock tank and the three inch nozzle outlet on the ground and it took it about 1 minute 15 seconds to pump all but about 5-10 gallons out of the stock tank. Then we played in the pond with it. After a while it seemed to not suck as well so I just opened the gap in the nozzle some more thinking it might have some trash in it. It still didn't pull like I thought it should. So we went the other extreme and closed it past my original .100 opening point when I flowed it the other day w/o and outlet hose on it. It sounded like it was "sizzling" with it out of the water. With the inlet to the nozzle 6-8 inches under water laying horizontal, I had a vortex from the surface down to the nozzle and it felt like a ton of suction. If I put my hand over the nozzle inlet and let my fingertips be near the edge of the intake pipe, it hurt when it sucked it to it. Not too precise, but it pulled like a big dog then and the suction was great sucking the scum from the pond. I the middle of all this I went to full throttle. Near the end I adjusted the throttle to 3/4 and 1/2 flow went down and a bit of the suction too. If things work out, in the morning I'll do a flow test to see how long it takes to fill the tank with my present nozzle settings. My PSI gauge stops at 30 and was bouncing so bad I don't think it'll be useful. Any ideas or input would be helpful. Thanks.

 

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[ncclaymaker]

Do like water does... follow the path of least resistance and have a Margarita at the same time. https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=water+flow+meter . Try Amazon and eBay for similar devices and prices. When all else fails... GOOGLE.

 

[russau]

TEF I know you don't have these gauges BUT using a vacumn gauge at the inlet to the suction device , youll need to place it about 12 inchs ahead of it and the same for the pressure gauge at its exit! while adjusting your device , watch the 2 gauges and when you've reached the highest vacumn reading , LOCK it off. now understand this setting that you would have achieved would be ONLY for your pump that you just used. another pump my be close , but different wear /machining RPM ,ETC. would change its optimum setting a little.... what you would be doing is tuning the device to your pump and rpm! the hand method will work tobe close enough as you already know! good luck!

 

[TheEquineFencer]

If things work out OK in the morning, I'm going to do another test run at the pond in the front yard. My plan is to retest with both the pump,nozzle AND 100 gallon tank close to the water level. I'm going to run it with my present adjustment without the nozzle in the water to see how much flow I'm getting from the pump at 100% throttle, then again at 50% throttle. Then I'll retest with the nozzle in the water. Depending on the flows I get I'll decide the width of the sluice I'll build. I had a vacuum gauge a while back, but it burned when the shop went up.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I realized later my previous testing was done with the pump pulling UP about 4-6 feet, then pumping down to the nozzle, then the nozzle was pumping UP 4-6 feet to where the outlet of the 3 inch hose was. It might be interesting to see if the flows change much.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

 

[russau]

Well it sounds like you have it dialed in! who needs a gauge when its pulling that hard!

 

[ncclaymaker]

When do you plan to put this into production for sale and what will it cost?

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I doubt I will "go into production", there does not seem to be much real interest in the nozzle. As I knew going into this project, they are difficult and expensive to build. From what research I've done and read about these nozzles, it's a no brainer that it's the best nozzle to use when you look at the the amount of material they move compared to a standard or tri-jet nozzle. The way I looked at it, if you can move 2-3 times as much material for the same amount of time, do it with a cheap low pressure/high volume trash pump, verss a high-dollar dredge pump/motor combo, you're way ahead of the game. Another upside to this nozzle I seeis the way material flows thrugh it. With a stadard or tri-jet, water blows the material against the sides of the pipe. With this material if just sucked through the nozzle, there should be less wear over the long haul. People just don't want to pay to go first class. Right now I'm looking at around the $300-$350 price range for a 3 inch nozzle. I looked the Hydro-Force nozzles and there's a heck of a lot more work in this nozzle than that one. Some other guys I've chatted with have had some they had built that cost them over $400 to build and were not built like this. This can also be converted buy swapping out the curved inlet pipe for a straight section and used as a jet log. Doing that, one "drawback" is you will need I'm guessing 2-4 foot of hose or pipe between the jet and the outlet to a dredge or high banker so it can build the hydraulic water column. Something a Mechanical Engineer buddy pointed out with my design, the slope area of my nozzle, is a LOT longer that the original Gold Diver Nozzle. He said from just looking at it, my nozzle would probably have a a LOT more velocity than the original design because of this, I think he's right.

I still need to build a high-banker dredge combo to run this thing in. When I ran it the other weekend, I used Doug's 2-1/2 inch Keene and just dumped it in the top of his combo.

It looks like you're not too far from me, would you like to try it out? There's a place up near Red Oak/Rocky Mount area I can meet you at. It's down stream a ways from the old Portis Gold mine. It's easy to get to the creek from there if no one is already there. The other week Doug and I went there, a tree had fallen across the path, bring a chainsaw and you could drive right up to the creek. I'll PM you a location to see what you think. BTW there used to me a Mill at this site, the footings are still there.

 

[Master-Peter]

I really like that one. Have been playing with the idea myself. The only improvement I could see is to feed from a 180° elbow, so the water does nit hit the funnel straight. I read somewhere this causes about 10% loss. Besides this - you made you a very neat sucker. Please keep us updated how it performs.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

considering I run it at just above and idle, I don't think the 10% matters. The original patent was the same way.

 

[Master-Peter]

considering I run it at just above and idle, I don't think the 10% matters. The original patent was the same way.

Just came to my mind. Might be of interest if one really scales up...

 

[TheEquineFencer]

do you have a 2-1/2 or a 3 inch highbanker or dredge?

 

[Bonaro]

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I think I have a print of a 4 or 5 inch they built. This is the first 2-1/2 inch print I've seen. Mine does not have as many parts as the original one shown above.