trigger like object.... 1750s British Brown Bess bayonet scabbard

[rogue]

trigger like object.... 1750's British Brown Bess bayonet scabbard

Ok, Cant figure this one out...any ideas?? Made of brass, and found with other items of the colonial period, but may not be colonial. the objects with it are buttons found in the area.object is 2" long1/4" wide at it's widest part.

 

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[scavenger]

Re: trigger like object

ive seen muzzleloading rifle trigger guards that look similar, I'll try to find a pic

 

[scavenger]

Re: trigger like object

not exact but very similar

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

Thats the road I've been searching...just can't nail it down... Thought i would throw it on here in case I was having tunnel vision...thanks

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

I see what you mean.. very close, it would have had to have been a two piece, this is not broken off all the ends are finished smooth..I'll keep digging in that direction and see what I come up with....Thanks, Steve

 

[uglymailman]

Re: trigger like object

I don't know the correct term but could it be something used to wrap string or rope around when tying something off. Like on the bottom of a flag pole or for curtains?

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

A cleat like on a boat...Hmmm, that could be, there are no holes to attach it, but it could have gone through a piece of leather like a saddle to hang the reins on.....or something to that effect...thanks

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Re: trigger like object

A cleat like on a boat...Hmmm, that could be, there are no holes to attach it, but it could have gone through a piece of leather like a saddle to hang the reins on.....or something to that effect...thanks

No holes or studs to have attached it to a rifle, either. Looks more like something from a wagon to guide or hold the reins, or a casting that didn't fill out and was never used.

Most trigger bows have at least two lugs sticking up into the stock wood and are pinned in place with 1/16" or slightly larger brass pins through a hole in the lug. Less fancy ones are screwed or even nailed in place - with corresponding holes in the trigger guard.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Re: trigger like object

First, for anybody here who doesn't already know:
A bayonet scabbard "frog" is a leather or cloth hanger which fits on a 19th-century soldier's belt, to hold the bayonet scabbard.

That brass object looks very much like the Enfield 1853-model bayonet scabbard frog-hook ...which is a brass hook double-riveted to the side of the scabbard's brass throat. However, the Enfield bayonet frog-hook is a bit shorter, and its tip is pointed ...which does not quite match up with the similar-looking object found by Rogue. Perhaps it is a yankee or Confederate copy of the British-made Enfield bayonet scabbard's frog-hook. OR, it may be entirely something else. But it's "close enough" that I thought I should mention these possibilities, which may lead to the exact ID of Rogue's mystery-object.

Here are links to photos showing the British-made version. One photo shows the frog-hook on the side of the scabbard's brass throat. The other photo shows the frog-hook "in place" on the frog. The photos are Copyrighted, so I cannot copy them and post them here.

http://arms2armor.com/Bayonets/brit1853.htm

http://www.sharpsburg-arsenal.com/c...rd-frog-by-s-w-silver-dated-1861/prod_37.html

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

Ok well your the second person to suggest a bayonet frog clip... time to hit the books in that direction...thanks

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: trigger like object

First, for anybody here who doesn't already know:
A bayonet scabbard "frog" is a leather or cloth hanger which fits on a 19th-century soldier's belt, to hold the bayonet scabbard.

That brass object looks very much like the Enfield 1853-model bayonet scabbard frog-hook ...which is a brass hook double-riveted to the side of the scabbard's brass throat. However, the Enfield bayonet frog-hook is a bit shorter, and its tip is pointed ...which does not quite match up with the similar-looking object found by Rogue. Perhaps it is a yankee or Confederate copy of the British-made Enfield bayonet scabbard's frog-hook. OR, it may be entirely something else. But it's "close enough" that I thought I should mention these possibilities, which may lead to the exact ID of Rogue's mystery-object.

Here are links to photos showing the British-made version. One photo shows the frog-hook on the side of the scabbard's brass throat. The other photo shows the frog-hook "in place" on the frog. The photos are Copyrighted, so I cannot copy them and post them here.

http://arms2armor.com/Bayonets/brit1853.htm

http://www.sharpsburg-arsenal.com/c...rd-frog-by-s-w-silver-dated-1861/prod_37.html

2nd

time for a green check

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Re: trigger like object

Great ID Cannonball Guy! I can't find an identical match but it sure is right for form and function. The M1835 was that long and the hook of that shape (but brazed to the sheath rim). I think you got a hit!

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

1750's British Brown Bess bayonet scabbard

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

I would say solved...great call..Thanks for everyone's help!!!!!

 

[Kiros32]

Re: trigger like object

I would say solved...great call..Thanks for everyone's help!!!!!

I would lean toward a later model bayonet rather than the 1750's Brown Bess.

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object

I would say solved...great call..Thanks for everyone's help!!!!!

I would lean toward a later model bayonet rather than the 1750's Brown Bess.

well this was found in the same area as a piece of reale which was minted 1707-1714, and also flat buttons. but i'm open to suggestions, why would you lean toward a later model??

 

[Kiros32]

Re: trigger like object

I would say solved...great call..Thanks for everyone's help!!!!!

I would lean toward a later model bayonet rather than the 1750's Brown Bess.

well this was found in the same area as a piece of reale which was minted 1707-1714, and also flat buttons. but i'm open to suggestions, why would you lean toward a later model??

The lean is based on the fact that the functionality of scabbard frogs applied to many types of scabbards, therefore pinning it down to a scabbard specific to a 1750s Brown Bess may be difficult. Point is, it could be from any colonial era scabbard or later. Regardless, I have not seen one posted on here before and it's a pretty cool find!

 

[rogue]

Re: trigger like object.... 1750's British Brown Bess bayonet scabbard

I'm in total agreement on not pinpointing it specifically to the 1750 brown bess ..It's the only pic I found in three days of searching that comes 99.9 % close to what I have..Besides the interest in "what the hell did i find", we are trying to set the time period of the site, and try to figure out(IN OUR MINDS ANYWAY) what the heck might have gone on there...
Thanks again everyone for your help, Steve