Vermont Copper Ryder Type

Ed-NH

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Hi all,

It's been a while since I posted anything. I finally got the camera working quiet well so I'm posting one that I found on Feb 15, 2009, my last outing. I hope you don't mind as this is not a 'today's find'.

It was a rather warm day 37 degrees. My hunting partner was going out to a south facing hillside that is just across the street from a large wealthy looking brick house built in the 1700's.

There was a few inches of snow in spots and clear in others. I chose the clear areas to hunt. The only find of the three hour hunt was this Vermont copper. I got the signal and dug it out of unfrozen dirt at 7" deep. I thought it was draped bust then realized that it resembled a King George l. After cleaning this up in some water I noticed that the lettering on the front did not align quite right for a KG.

I identified this as a Vermont copper 1785-88 and a Ryder type. I do not know which variety it is. They all look the same to me but I wish I could tell if it is one of the rare or scarce types.

The following two weekends we got a ton of snow. This was a great winter break and a most pleasing find. My first coin from the states and one not too far from home. I have a ton of pictures I anyone has a better eye than I do 8) Thanks for looking!

Ed-
 

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Upvote 0
Took a quick look and seems like a common obverse die, which means you have to ID it by the reverse, which there is not much left on your coin. I still think you might be able to do it, first step is to match up the front to confirm, then you can see how many reverse dies it went with and go from there.

These might be the choices if that's the right obverse. (which it does look like)

http://www.coinfacts.com/colonial_coins/vermont_coppers/vt_ryder_20.htm


PS.. It's a bit easier to try and match up if the pics are not posted showing the image on an angle.
 

Nice find Ed,I am still waiting for the ground to thaw.
Barry
 

1787 or 1788...I'd use the peroxide bath on this one. You got nothing to lose. It looks like a common die var. NICE FIND!
 

Sweeeeeeet dude !!! ;D ;D ;D still on my wish list....
 

ya got out!! nice find ed nice way to start the year. im going out this morning to a old beach theres snow everywere else. hope to hunt with ya soon. willy.
 

I am thinking 1787 RR14 but wow, there is not much to go on here. If Don in SJ knows Vermonts like he does Connecticuts he may be able to settle it!
 

Awesome copper Ed :thumbsup:

I hope to scratch that one of my wish list this year ;D

G1
 

Iron Patch said:
Took a quick look and seems like a common obverse die, which means you have to ID it by the reverse, which there is not much left on your coin. I still think you might be able to do it, first step is to match up the front to confirm, then you can see how many reverse dies it went with and go from there.

These might be the choices if that's the right obverse. (which it does look like)

http://www.coinfacts.com/colonial_coins/vermont_coppers/vt_ryder_20.htm


PS.. It's a bit easier to try and match up if the pics are not posted showing the image on an angle.

Thank you Iron Patch and everyone else for your ideas. I will give the ID another try. Either way I am happy to know that it is a Vermont copper plus it is going nowhere except in my coin display case!
 

Love seeing Vermonts being posted, not enough of them being found :) Tough one to say for sure, I have to agree with about 99% certainty that the Obverse is ID'd correctly, but that still leaves the hard part, the Reverse side, which first off, will tell us if it is a 1787 or a 1788 copper and second off, many of the varieties of the remaining possibilities are rare to extremely rare, other than the Ryder 20.

Ed, if there is any detail that would really help ID the variety by the reverse side it would be the arm and the branch Brittania is holding, if any detail could emerge in that area, that would help considerably.

I took a protractor to the Date Line on the Reverse and sized up with the letter E in ET,your coin with photos from elsewhere and I do not think it is the common variety Ryder 20, but darn, I just got the feeling the date is an 8 at the end and not a 7, but yet, the protractor and the Ryder 14 did match, but I have not measured the other possible seven or so possible reverses.

I do have photos of all the other varieties but without seeing anymore detail on the reverse, it would just be a guess game on the exact variety in my opinion......

Don
 

VERY nice find. :)
 

Awesome find Ed....was glad to be able to share another "first" with you my friend ;D

HH
Al
 

Don in SJ said:
Love seeing Vermonts being posted, not enough of them being found :) Tough one to say for sure, I have to agree with about 99% certainty that the Obverse is ID'd correctly, but that still leaves the hard part, the Reverse side, which first off, will tell us if it is a 1787 or a 1788 copper and second off, many of the varieties of the remaining possibilities are rare to extremely rare, other than the Ryder 20.

Ed, if there is any detail that would really help ID the variety by the reverse side it would be the arm and the branch Brittania is holding, if any detail could emerge in that area, that would help considerably.

I took a protractor to the Date Line on the Reverse and sized up with the letter E in ET,your coin with photos from elsewhere and I do not think it is the common variety Ryder 20, but darn, I just got the feeling the date is an 8 at the end and not a 7, but yet, the protractor and the Ryder 14 did match, but I have not measured the other possible seven or so possible reverses.

I do have photos of all the other varieties but without seeing anymore detail on the reverse, it would just be a guess game on the exact variety in my opinion......

Don

Thank you Don, you are always very helpful to everyone on this forum. I am going to have another look at the reverse 8)
 

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