Xterra 705 and "noise cancel/frequency adjust?

[Backstrap80]

I've noticed VDI #'s change with different noise cancel #'s so this has me thinking it changes the frequency of the machine slightly, if it does, does anyone know by how much? for example of I have the 18.75kh on and lower the noise/frequency adjust to -2 what Kh or +2? For example a -2 will lower dimes to the 38-36 range a +2 puts the 40-42. If I didn't explain this right, or it's confusing let me know.

 

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[Longhair]

It shouldn't have nearly the effect on ID's as ground balance does. The amount of frequency change is miniscule. It's only enough to alter the effects of harmonics or directly conflicting frequencies.

 

[Jublain]

I haven't noticed any difference in my ID's when adjusting the noise cancel. There is a difference in ID when changing from the 3kHz digger coil to the 7.5kHz nel tornado. The 3kHz gives slightly higher readings on copper and silver.

 

[Backstrap80]

I guess I'm not the only person to have figured this out lol. After researching the Golden Umax I knew the Xterra could some how reject pull tabs. I hunt newer park with 3" of sod then hard pan mostly* city life... Anyhow I don't always do this but when I can see 20 tabs in a circle around me with just my eyes I'll go into cherry picking and play the odds. If I had the time, I'd mark it off and clear and dig everything but I dont. My last 4 hunts have been 1-2hrs. I'm also 20 grams heavier on gold. I don't block the high numbers like Gerry but I do knock out pull tabs, yea, I may leave a ring. But I'll find 4 more... Check this out and you'll see it does change the ID's https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pm5IgBS0GS8
LMK what you guys think.

 

[Backstrap80]

BTW, with my stock elliptical I don't do this, I do this with my 15" 18.75kh WOT. I've used the stock enough to where I know a pull tab, it's not repeatable. It bounces 12-14/14-16 never repeats 12,12,12 like my rings.

 

[atomicscott]

I've noticed VDI #'s change with different noise cancel #'s so this has me thinking it changes the frequency of the machine slightly, if it does, does anyone know by how much? for example of I have the 18.75kh on and lower the noise/frequency adjust to -2 what Kh or +2? For example a -2 will lower dimes to the 38-36 range a +2 puts the 40-42. If I didn't explain this right, or it's confusing let me know.

That is the whole point of noise cancel. It sets your detector to a frequency that is not (as) susceptible to emi in the particular area. It is just a slight shift I believe. It should not be enough to skew the numbers. I have a lot of hours on the 6" 18.75khz. It does raise the numbers a bit in the silver range compared to the 7.5 khz coil, but not enough that I would not dig those targets still. I do dig more iron with the 18.75 for this reason.

 

[Longhair]

It does raise the numbers a bit in the silver range compared to the 7.5 khz coil

And that is a known fact. It has to do with target bin segment widths assigned. Low frequency coils will be more accurate on high conductors (copper, silver, brass), and high frequency coils will be more accurate on low conductors (gold, pewter, iron).

This chart illustrates what I'm talking about.

 

[Backstrap80]

Thanks Atomic, I own 6 coils for the Xterra, I think as Longhair showed on the chart and further proving my question, if the VDI changes from "noise cancel" is it also "frequency adjust" it's not a huge deal, I'd just like to know if taking my noise cancel on my 18.75kh coil to -2 makes the Kh 16.75kh. It's not a "game changer" etc but if I had a 3kh coil on and went -2 would I be running closer to 1Kh-that could change things. It help ID items when I have more Kh. I can separate Zink, copper and dimes a lot easier with 18.75 than 7.5 but soul plays into this also-I know this.

 

[Backstrap80]

This may be "nothing" to some hunters but I'm approaching 2000 hrs on the Xterra so it's just a little more I can learn about this machine.

 

[Longhair]

I believe that each increment represents a shift of .15kHz(I'll verify when I get home), making your change to -2 equivalent to operating at 18.45kHz, which shouldn't alter TID significantly.

FWIW, Coiltek coils generally tend to run a bit hotter than the Minelab coils, and TID's are typically one higher as a result.

 

[atomicscott]

Thanks Atomic, I own 6 coils for the Xterra, I think as Longhair showed on the chart and further proving my question, if the VDI changes from "noise cancel" is it also "frequency adjust" it's not a huge deal, I'd just like to know if taking my noise cancel on my 18.75kh coil to -2 makes the Kh 16.75kh. It's not a "game changer" etc but if I had a 3kh coil on and went -2 would I be running closer to 1Kh-that could change things. It help ID items when I have more Kh. I can separate Zink, copper and dimes a lot easier with 18.75 than 7.5 but soul plays into this also-I know this.

Nope. It likely only changes it a couple points. One channel is 18.75khz. The next may be 18.70, 18.65, 18.80, etc... I still think there is no way it would change ID numbers though. Minelab would put that in the users manual if that was the case. Diggers book "understanding your x-terra" explains the circular disc concept. I'm sure you already downloaded the free e-book by Randy Horton from Minelabs site. Its a must have for XT users. It is an in depth read that goes into why the X-Terra is designed with all the tones, etc...Oh my buddy found 2 gold rings with his 705. One was a solid 12, the other was bouncing 8-10. I've tested many gold rings with my 505. Some jump 6-9, 9-12, 12-15, etc... some were solid, some even hit in the 15-18 range. Mineralization, position of the ring in the ground, etc... can all change ID numbers, so I dig any pulltab nickel or foil numbers/tones from 9-18, that don't bounce more than 2 segments when looking for gold jewelry. EDIT: Just read longhairs post re: noise cancel freq shift. I was off on my numbers I know, but noise cancel wont change freq a whole number, jus points of a number.

 

[Longhair]

Just read longhairs post re: noise cancel freq shift. I was off on my numbers I know, but noise cancel wont change freq a whole number, jus points of a number.

Ha! Actually we were both off a bit, but I just couldn't recall off the top of my head.
I'm back home now and have access to all my info, so here's a chart that shows NC channels by machine and frequency selected.

 

[atomicscott]

Ha! Actually we were both off a bit, but I just couldn't recall off the top of my head.
I'm back home now and have access to all my info, so here's a chart that shows NC channels by machine and frequency selected.

Longhair, we can always count on you to set things straight!

 

[relicmeister]

a lot of interesting discussion here, too deep for me now-I have less than 100 hours on my xterra 705. My take away from this thread is to get the Horton ebook.
thanks for that tip.

 

[ZR2guy]

a lot of interesting discussion here, too deep for me now-I have less than 100 hours on my xterra 705. My take away from this thread is to get the Horton ebook.
thanks for that tip.

Definitely! It is the Holy Bible for the X-terra series machines.

 

[Dtektor]

Re: VDI changes with Freq Adjust...

I've noticed VDI #'s change with different noise cancel #'s so this has me thinking it changes the frequency of the machine slightly, if it does, does anyone know by how much? for example of I have the 18.75kh on and lower the noise/frequency adjust to -2 what Kh or +2? For example a -2 will lower dimes to the 38-36 range a +2 puts the 40-42. If I didn't explain this right, or it's confusing let me know.

I am expecting the delivery of an xterra 705 in a few days and watching allot of related videos for hints and tips. This video explains and demonstrates the process of frequency adjust to allow certain targets to be included in the grouping with a majority of more valuable ones so as not to inadvertently discriminate them out in order to avoid the junk: [video=youtube;pm5IgBS0GS8]https://wwwoutu.ybe.com/watch?v=pm5IgBS0GS8&list=UUBifFJHDtSo7dqYa9fkGXxw[/video]

 

[Longhair]

I am expecting the delivery of an xterra 705 in a few days and watching allot of related videos for hints and tips. This video explains and demonstrates the process of frequency adjust to allow certain targets to be included in the grouping with a majority of more valuable ones so as not to inadvertently discriminate them out in order to avoid the junk: [video=youtube;pm5IgBS0GS8]https://wwwoutu.ybe.com/watch?v=pm5IgBS0GS8&list=UUBifFJHDtSo7dqYa9fkGXxw[/video]

If you do as he says in that video you'll miss more than you'll find.

Suggested reading:
Free eBook - Understanding your X-TERRA | Treasure Talk

Notch Discrimination on the X-TERRA - Part 1 | Treasure Talk
Notch Discrimination on the X-TERRA - Part 2 | Treasure Talk

Hunting by ear... Audio tones on the X-TERRA | Treasure Talk

Which X-TERRA coil is best for me | Treasure Talk
Which X-TERRA coil is best for me? | Treasure Talk
Which X-TERRA coil is best for me? - Part 3 | Treasure Talk
Which X-TERRA coil is best for me? - Part 4 | Treasure Talk

 

[atomicscott]

I am expecting the delivery of an xterra 705 in a few days and watching allot of related videos for hints and tips. This video explains and demonstrates the process of frequency adjust to allow certain targets to be included in the grouping with a majority of more valuable ones so as not to inadvertently discriminate them out in order to avoid the junk: YouTube Link: https://wwwoutu.ybe.com/watch?v=pm5IgBS0GS8&list=UUBifFJHDtSo7dqYa9fkGXxw

Longhair is dead on as usual. You may be able to disc some pulltabs and find 50 gold rings, but you will be likely missing the good with the bad. Check the e-book "understanding your x-terra" by Randy Horton. Its free on the ML site & tells you how to get the best out of the XT series. No disc, AM, 99 tones. Best way to go. Ive tried different combinations of disc settings & it really sucks (IMO) compared to AM.

 

[Dtektor]

Longhair is dead on as usual. You may be able to disc some pulltabs and find 50 gold rings, but you will be likely missing the good with the bad. Check the e-book "understanding your x-terra" by Randy Horton. Its free on the ML site & tells you how to get the best out of the XT series. No disc, AM, 99 tones. Best way to go. Ive tried different combinations of disc settings & it really sucks (IMO) compared to AM.

I have the book and have been reading it. Until I actually have my 705 in my hands I have no other reference. I thought the video I linked was pretty good but I also see your point atomicscott. I think it is only 28 tones on the 705 but that is still allot of audio learning ahead of me.

 

[atomicscott]

I have the book and have been reading it. Until I actually have my 705 in my hands I have no other reference. I thought the video I linked was pretty good but I also see your point atomicscott. I think it is only 28 tones on the 705 but that is still allot of audio learning ahead of me.

I have a freind who knows the guy in the vid. He's a very successful hunter, & nice guy but the disc patterns are best used in pristine areas with very little trash. Those areas usually have very few people, and trash = people = more likely to find good items. The 2 go together. Trash and treasure can both be disc'ed out together on many detectors, so I would rather have every advantage available to me & run AM 99 tones.