Amish craftsmanship my butt!!!

[olroy70]

dave44

 

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[mikeofaustin]

Sorry about the confusion Mike. When I spoke of leaders I in no way meant to refer to politicians, I was referring to legitimate business owners that try to build a future for themselves and their employees.

And we agree get corporations out of congress, as long as Unions and self interested groups like the Sierra Club, Al Gores bunch of crazies and any other group that helps the decline of America.

Weren't the Rockefellars partly responsible for the building of the Federal Reserve structure? Not a fan!
I can see that unions were needed at the turn of the century, now they are a tumor, feeding off of its members AND the tax base everywhere they exist. And judging by the deplorable tactics they use, it would be hard to say they didn't attack the National Guard, they definately attacked other mines, after all, misery loves company.

By the way. Did you see that baby Joe was allowed to go home today??!! To fill you in, Canadas utopian Health care said that he was going to die anyway, so they were not going to spend anymore money on him. So they brought him, Wait for it.... To the United States for the best health care in the world (currently that is). Looks like he is terminal, but OUR health care bought him another year or so and if Obama care doesn't cripple us first Our Doctors might find a cure, unlikely, but it is possible

I was not justifying unions. it was a simple example of what happens when you have corporation influence on government. Please do not try and group me into a union loving person.
...And, when you say, "Obama care"... can you please expand a little bit on what is 'crippling'? Because as soon as you respond, I plan to counter you with plenty of examples of why the republicans actually destroyed any possibility of it becoming a useful thing for the common citizen. Just a heads up.

And, if you consider a corporation a 'leader'... you truly are indoctrinated.

 

[olroy70]

So, you think the reps destroyed obamacare?

Isn't that the plan that Peelousi pushed thru without anyone reading it? Remember, you have to pass the bill to read the bill!!!!!!!!!!!

ok. now that is has passed, have you read any of it Probably not!

It passed with funding in it. Starting now, and nobamacare doesnt start for years. (after nobama leaves, ya know)

the taxes collected will be more than most people spend on healthcare per year!

It rapes medicare and medicaid.

It has loopholes, so muslims and the "amish" arent taxed. And, many states are getting out of it. Unions dont have to use it!!

look it over!!!! anxiously awaiting your response, olroy!!!!

 

[mikeofaustin]

So, you think the reps destroyed obamacare?

Isn't that the plan that Peelousi pushed thru without anyone reading it? Remember, you have to pass the bill to read the bill!!!!!!!!!!!
ok. now that is has passed, have you read any of it Probably not!
It passed with funding in it. Starting now, and nobamacare doesnt start for years. (after nobama leaves, ya know)
the taxes collected will be more than most people spend on healthcare per year!
It rapes medicare and medicaid.
It has loopholes, so muslims and the "amish" arent taxed. And, many states are getting out of it. Unions dont have to use it!!
look it over!!!! anxiously awaiting your response, olroy!!!!

Hello? The plan was gone over again and again... it was eventually castrated by the republican party into the monstrosity it is today. It WAS going to pay for itself. But, because, again, of the republican party, it was lobotomized into something that actually needed money from taxpayers. Again, thanks to republicans...

Have I read it? No... Do you understand what happened with it? probably not.
The Taxes collected on it, again, is because of the republican hands. It was going to pay for itself. Remember? Probably not.
It rapes medicare and medicaid? Do you know what republicans are doing to medicare right now? Probably not.
Look it over? Yes, I have. Have you actually spent time looking at facts about it rather than getting the Fox News version of it? Probably not.

... the taxes collected on it will be more than most spend on healthcare a year? Ummm... ... what?

 

[olroy70]

Hello? The plan was gone over again and again... it was eventually castrated by the republican party into the monstrosity it is today. It WAS going to pay for itself. But, because, again, of the republican party, it was lobotomized into something that actually needed money from taxpayers. Again, thanks to republicans...


not before it was put into place............ do you ever read what you post??

 

[Dave44]

You obviously know that health care bill is a trojan horse to single payer, And you know that the plan is to tax anything that moves to help pay for it. I wished the Republicans had gutted it, you and I cannot afford it.

And before I let you go too far, do you understand that the Canadians said let the boy die!!!!

The point to one that doesn't care is that it is money that could be spent on an individual that deserves it more and can pay more taxes, A theory that was cooked up by progressives(complete lives theory?).
So the beaurocrat decides who has more worth to a society? The perfect example of Sarah Palins death panels!!!
Now here in The good old, Not Quite Socialists of America, If you or your son looked terminal you could STILL get an operation if you choose. I know you don't know why, but it is because you can BUY it. In your utopia, the beaurocrat has the last say, and if America falls, where will you go when that Socialist says you are too sick to pay taxes?

And finally, If you think that Government magicly doles out money and goodies, and creates jobs and all of this comes about without corporations,, You Have Been Indoctrinated, take another look around you buddy.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

Just a point here on NAFTA - Bill Clinton - not.

We would not have NAFTA if it wasn't for..................................................Bob Dole.

The vote was tied and he had the deciding vote and he sold us out. I say "sold us out" because he spent MONTHS trying to beat Clinton by putting down NAFTA - anything for a vote, I guess.

Beth

 

[Dave44]

Just a point here on NAFTA - Bill Clinton - not.

We would not have NAFTA if it wasn't for..................................................Bob Dole.

The vote was tied and he had the deciding vote and he sold us out. I say "sold us out" because he spent MONTHS trying to beat Clinton by putting down NAFTA - anything for a vote, I guess.

Beth

I will have to defer to your knowledge on this Beth. But I would think that competing with corporations in countries that do not suffer the same burdens as ours would cause seriously bad trade imbalances. Oh wait, I think they already have.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

Dave44,

You're right - they already have.

B

 

[mikeofaustin]

I've haven't read any replies to this thread since I last posted, because I realized that there really is two sides to everything. And the last set of comments made me realize that i was arguing with a side that was already set in their ways, and some random person like me on the internet will not have a chance in hell in changing anyone's thoughts on the matter. The two sides really are set in their ways and will defend it to the end of earth. Who am I to try and be the hero of change. It's not up to me, it's up to the people themselves. Plus, I felt I got a little testy, and I REALLY don't like being 'that person'. So I apologize if I attacked anyone personally. I was merely trying to 'enlighten'. Again, who am I to do such a thing. You are who you are and it is not my job to try and change you're beliefs. I will not be coming back to this thread again because I do not want to again become the person I saw myself as (an ugly person). One thing I've learned again and again, you do not talk to your friends or family about politics and religion. I failed this time. I'm sorry.

It never hits home, until it hits home.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

MikeofAustin,

Don't think you really know me - but, personally - I like a lively debate - and, believe it or not - even though I am an old lady, so to speak, and yes, set in my ways - I am always ready to learn something - and have had others change my mind - given the right circumstances and evidence.

That's why we have an "everything else" and places like the political forum on this site. Life would get really boring if we all thought the same way.








Beth

 

[oldgoat]

MikeofAustin,

Don't think you really know me - but, personally - I like a lively debate - and, believe it or not - even though I am an old lady, so to speak, and yes, set in my ways - I am always ready to learn something - and have had others change my mind - given the right circumstances and evidence.

That's why we have an "everything else" and places like the political forum on this site. Life would get really boring if we all thought the same way.








Beth

thank you, Mrs.O, I too am an older person, and when I quit learning and debating then I might as well die. If we give up on learning we just stagnate and I for one don't want to do that....goat