Explorer "Noise cancel" question

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I am new to Minelab I just got a used XS off ebay. Mt true motivation for the switch was no one makes a small DD for the ace 250 and I got the idea in my head that only a 5" DD could cut through the trash right around my hunted out cellar holes. so with XS and 5' DD coil I went out to my most nail infested cellar hole to try it out. Powered up and hit noise cancel and switched to ferrous sounds. In 5 minutes I came up with this 1/2 real from a spot I hunted over 10 times before with the ace and XS with the stock coil. Did noise cancel contribute? Who knows but you can bet it will be a part of my routine from now on!

You'll be surprised how well the stock coil will see through junk too, once you have some experience with the detector. I've tried smaller coils several times and they didn't seem to do much better. I'd probably find less because of the loss of coverage and depth.

Spanish silver is a good day!

Thanks, I did make some great finds with the stock coil in heavy trash like these old buttons that my ace missed even with the 4' coil. I was going to buy a new SE Pro or an Etrac till I read your posts about your exp. II being just as good. The part that hit home is when you pointed out that they all use the same coils how different could they be? Maybe they recover faster but I like to hunt slow and methodically anyway. If i get the urge to swing fast I still have my ace I use to scout for iron patches.

I think the certain way they're geared to hunt slow is actually what makes them great, and I'm guessing better than the e-trac. (in my opinion) I think the mistake Minelab is making is trying to speed things up for the people that don't understand an explorer and just say it's slow. In clean ground you can swing it as fast as you want and still hit targets. The more junk there is, the more you have to slow down, and cut your swing down to maybe 6"-12" sweeps. There's no detector that can be swung fast through heavy trash and see all targets so people really have to use some perspective when talking about an explorer's swing speed. Sometimes I move fast when I'm looking for a site in a large field, other times I spend 30 minutes in a 8' x 8' area. People who don't adapt, or don't understand why, don't really know how to use an explorer to its full potential.

 

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[iron_foot]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

i think the Noise cancel feature on the explorer is fantastic. i searched for over two years with a minelab SOVEREIGN XS-2a Pro machine and could never search any wear near power lines/cables without the machine getting totally wiped out which was very frustrating. don't get me wrong the sovereign is a great machine infact it found me a hoard off hammered coins last year, but with the explorer if your near power lines and getting interference one press of the Noise cancel button wait 30 seconds, sorted interference has gone.
so 10/10 for the explorer from me. now i can search the hole of a field with out much problems not just a portion of it.

here is a picture of the coins in case anyone is intrested.

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

i think the Noise cancel feature on the explorer is fantastic. i searched for over two years with a minelab SOVEREIGN XS-2a Pro machine and could never search any wear near power lines/cables without the machine getting totally wiped out which was very frustrating. don't get me wrong the sovereign is a great machine infact it found me a hoard off hammered coins last year, but with the explorer if your near power lines and getting interference one press of the Noise cancel button wait 30 seconds, sorted interference has gone.
so 10/10 for the explorer from me. now i can search the hole of a field with out much problems not just a portion of it.

here is a picture of the coins in case anyone is intrested.

It definitely helps but I've been around some interference that was so bad it didn't make much difference. It is a good feature but is getting way more hyped in this thread than it deserves.

 

[iron_foot]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

well it gets my approval i no which of the two machines i mentioned handles the interference best.
when i used to use my sovereign and searching along side with a few other lads all using different machines to the explorer laser hawkeye etc we all used to get bad interference from the power lines but the sovereign suffered the most. now using the explorer in the same fields it is handling the interference just great .

 

[grumpyolman]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

Here's a test for the naysayers. Go to any field you hunt and do the noise cancel and note what channel the machine selects. Move 50 yards, or wait 15 minutes and do it again. Wallah! It will select a different channel...usually. It really is fine tuning itself to give you the best information it can. Unless you think ML programmed a random channel selection algorithm just to make pretty you are missing the fact that the electrical situation around you is constantly changing and it can interfere with clarity and depth of hearing a potential target. If you want to ignore this feature then it's your loss and I'll find the stuff you missed. HH Jim

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

Here's a test for the naysayers. Go to any field you hunt and do the noise cancel and note what channel the machine selects. Move 50 yards, or wait 15 minutes and do it again. Wallah! It will select a different channel...usually. It really is fine tuning itself to give you the best information it can. Unless you think ML programmed a random channel selection algorithm just to make pretty you are missing the fact that the electrical situation around you is constantly changing and it can interfere with clarity and depth of hearing a potential target. If you want to ignore this feature then it's your loss and I'll find the stuff you missed. HH Jim

So in other words the people who just noise cancel once at the start of the hunt are wrong too, and it should be done every 5 minutes because things are constantly changing?

PS.... Giving so much credit to the noise cancel and actually putting it in the same category of all the other things that help you find, or make you miss targets, is really starting to bug me about this thread.

Is the e-trac your first Minelab?

 

[grumpyolman]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

Noise cancel is one of the important things to consider. Didn't say it was the only one. It's way up there in terms of priorities though. I do think you have to noise cancel every so often and the person who does it once at the beginning of the hunt is not using his/her machine's features. Let's see. If it takes 30 seconds to noise cancel and you do it 12 times in an hour then you lose 6 minutes of the total time actually hunting in that hour adjusting the machine. By the way, unless it's unstable once every 15 minutes is probably OK.
What the heck difference does it make if it's my first Minelab or my tenth? I first had an SE...Then an Excalibur and now the E-Trac. I bet the stuff Andy Sabisch says in his book about the Explorers and the E-Trac should be discounted if it's not in your realm of experiences, also. No what? There are some people you defer to because they know more than you do. Andy is one of the people that walks the walk. Read his book and you might broaden you narrow view of detecting and really what makes the Minelabs tick.
In the cited book on page 95 he has a full explanation of noise cancel. Reviewing that he recommends used a 30 minute time limit between noise cancels. I'll quote just one part of that information. "Make it a habit to use it regularly throughout your time in the field." Like I said before, "don't use it and I'll be behind you to find the deepies you went over because your machine wasn't adjusted for the conditions on that piece of land." HH Jim

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

Noise cancel is one of the important things to consider. Didn't say it was the only one. It's way up there in terms of priorities though. I do think you have to noise cancel every so often and the person who does it once at the beginning of the hunt is not using his/her machine's features. Let's see. If it takes 30 seconds to noise cancel and you do it 12 times in an hour then you lose 6 minutes of the total time actually hunting in that hour adjusting the machine. By the way, unless it's unstable once every 15 minutes is probably OK.
What the heck difference does it make if it's my first Minelab or my tenth? I first had an SE...Then an Excalibur and now the E-Trac. I bet the stuff Andy Sabisch says in his book about the Explorers and the E-Trac should be discounted if it's not in your realm of experiences, also. No what? There are some people you defer to because they know more than you do. Andy is one of the people that walks the walk. Read his book and you might broaden you narrow view of detecting and really what makes the Minelabs tick.
In the cited book on page 95 he has a full explanation of noise cancel. Reviewing that he recommends used a 30 minute time limit between noise cancels. I'll quote just one part of that information. "Make it a habit to use it regularly throughout your time in the field." Like I said before, "don't use it and I'll be behind you to find the deepies you went over because your machine wasn't adjusted for the conditions on that piece of land." HH Jim

I'm happy your a fan of the great Andy but it's a very good bet I'd disagree with at least some of his points of view on the explorer. There is very little point to this debate going further because I quote real life experience over many years and you quote what you read in a book.

 

[grumpyolman]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

We'll if it comes to a choice between Andy's experiences, that are read from a book, are and what your experiences are, from reading on-line posts, you are not my first choice in whom to rely. Maybe Minelab should contact you about field testing their machines in the future, like they did Mr. Sabisch. Perhaps there's a reason why they haven't. HH Jim

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

We'll if it comes to a choice between Andy's experiences, that are read from a book, are and what your experiences are, from reading on-line posts, you are not my first choice in whom to rely. Maybe Minelab should contact you about field testing their machines in the future, like they did Mr. Sabisch. Perhaps there's a reason why they haven't. HH Jim

The only people who contact me are people who want the truth, and would relay the truth, and from what I've learned of Minelab over the years they do not fit into that category. Your posts actually make me feel a bit nauseous, though I'm sure A Sabisch appreciates you being such a fan. You should also buy the Exploring the Explorer video, now there's a learning TOOL. lol

 

[iron_foot]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

i do a noise cancel every now and then within say a few hours search time. the slitest hit of any electrical interference and the button gets prest and especially when i move on to another location to detect. it cant do any harm only help keep the machine running smooth.
i no with the experiences i had with the power lines wiping out the sovereign machine i used to own, noise cancel is the best thing since sliced bread. there was times with the sovereign i felt like trowing the machine over a hedge with frustration of not being able to detect till the machine had settled down then 5 minutes later total wipeout again. the hoard of coins i found if they had bean at the other end of the same field nearer to the power lines i probably would of never found them, someone else with an explorer most definitely would of though, so i can definitely see grumpyolman point of view.

not trying to pick any fights here or any thing like that but looking through a lot of iron patch's on-line replys to other peoples post quite a lot of his comments seam to come across more on the attack than advice. all or most people use these kind of forums to help each other out with good advice not to attack every thing that is said.
i used to detect with a lad who got right on my nerves who used to almost bully you in away with his why don't you do that, why arn't you doing that, you should be doing that all the time. it got to the point i got fed up with it was always his way are no way most of the time because he had bean detecting for 9 years more than me. i don't mind people helping out but not ramming their opinions down your throat constantly and his was mostly in a cheeky manner. i wouldn't care we both used totally different machines and i never ones tryed to tell him how he should be using his machine. not that he would of listened anyways.

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

i do a noise cancel every now and then within say a few hours search time. the slitest hit of any electrical interference and the button gets prest and especially when i move on to another location to detect. it cant do any harm only help keep the machine running smooth.
i no with the experiences i had with the power lines wiping out the sovereign machine i used to own, noise cancel is the best thing since sliced bread. there was times with the sovereign i felt like trowing the machine over a hedge with frustration of not being able to detect till the machine had settled down then 5 minutes later total wipeout again. the hoard of coins i found if they had bean at the other end of the same field nearer to the power lines i probably would of never found them, someone else with an explorer most definitely would of though, so i can definitely see grumpyolman point of view.

not trying to pick any fights here or any thing like that but looking through a lot of iron patch's on-line replys to other peoples post quite a lot of his comments seam to come across more on the attack than advice. all or most people use these kind of forums to help each other out with good advice not to attack every thing that is said.
i used to detect with a lad who got right on my nerves who used to almost bully you in away with his why don't you do that, why arn't you doing that, you should be doing that all the time. it got to the point i got fed up with it was always his way are no way most of the time because he had bean detecting for 9 years more than me. i don't mind people helping out but not ramming their opinions down your throat constantly and his was mostly in a cheeky manner. i wouldn't care we both used totally different machines and i never ones tryed to tell him how he should be using his machine. not that he would of listen anyways.

Well you can think what you want but doesn't mean you're correct.

..... and you just made my point for me "i do a noise cancel every now and then within say a few hours search time. the slitest hit of any electrical interference" Everyone in this thread that is making such a big deal about the noise cancel is basically making the case you have to keep hittin the noise cancel over and over again. They're not saying it, but it's what is definitely implied. As I said from the start, if your detector is running smooth with no sign or interference the lack of doing a noise cancel is not going to cause you to miss targets, there is MANY more factors that are more important that will.

The reason I post is to set people straight on what I believe, and trust me, I've been on the Minelab forums for about 9 years and there's a lot of people who need correcting. So should I sit back and disagree and not set them straight, or "attack" as you call it. If I feel someone is getting an attitude because they can't handle my having a different opinion then I probably will reply straying a little off topic if need be.

You can take my posts anyway you want. But if you don't think I don't know what I'm talking about just ask the people that private message me to ask questions. I assume they think otherwise.

 

[mainer]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I have read Andy's book cover too cover and it is a great tool. And after reading the book I still had to PM Iron Patch to help me out with some things. Its hard to beat his experience, never met him had never spoke to him, But he has responded and help me many times in the last six months or so that I have had the explorer. You may not agree with IP but in time usuing the explorer I'm sure theres things that you may not agree with Andy on too. But both guys have been great tools for me. and I'm sure others too. Thanks for teaching me.

Mainer

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I have read Andy's book cover too cover and it is a great tool. And after reading the book I still had to PM Iron Patch to help me out with some things. Its hard to beat his experience, never met him had never spoke to him, But he has responded and help me many times in the last six months or so that I have had the explorer. You may not agree with IP but in time usuing the explorer I'm sure theres things that you may not agree with Andy on too. But both guys have been great tools for me. and I'm sure others too. Thanks for teaching me.

Mainer

Thanks Mainer. Rarely do things get sorted out because detecting is such a hands-on activity. For example we could debate settings and masking for the next ten years but it still wouldn't come close to comparing and making adjustments for 20 minutes in person. When I got my first explorer I don't think there was another within 500 miles of me, so I had to figure it out on my own. I made lots of mistakes, got very frustrated, but finally in time it started to make sense. Seeing what it could do over our Garretts my detecting bud the Cladman ordered his. It only took one hunt to teach him everything it took me an entire month to learn. You just can't beat in person experience and I would dearly love to defend everything I've ever posted swinging in a field and not sitting in a computer chair. But that's just the way it is. I guess it must be Winter.

 

[mainer]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I agree 100% with you IP. When I got my xlt I never had anyone and I was younger and more stubborn, So asking another forum member for help was a little more out of the question for me. But I learned it and learned it well, When my buddy got into detecting and bought the dfx I set it up how I had tweaked the xlt and he took off and running with no struggling. But now Im a little older and taking it all in trying to make the most of my time in the feild. As I said you and Andy both are great tools. But when I have a question about somthing or dont completly understand somthing I cant PM Andy but I can you, and that is a big advantage for me. Now if spring would just hurry up and get here. Maybe we could put all this knowledge to use. Have a good one IP.


Mainer

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I agree 100% with you IP. When I got my xlt I never had anyone and I was younger and more stubborn, So asking another forum member for help was a little more out of the question for me. But I learned it and learned it well, When my buddy got into detecting and bought the dfx I set it up how I had tweaked the xlt and he took off and running with no struggling. But now Im a little older and taking it all in trying to make the most of my time in the feild. As I said you and Andy both are great tools. But when I have a question about somthing or dont completly understand somthing I cant PM Andy but I can you, and that is a big advantage for me. Now if spring would just hurry up and get here. Maybe we could put all this knowledge to use. Have a good one IP.


Mainer

If you figured out those Whites units I think you'll be ok. I remember Dave Z (did you know him on the forums?) posting his DFX settings. It was so long I thought it was a joke ...but it wasn't. To me it seems like the Explorer needs much less tweaking for good solid performance.

 

[mainer]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I dont remember a Dave Z. But I do know that the xlt has way more things to set up and tweak then the explorer. The settings to me were so much easier on the explorer but I also have more experience with detectors in general. The biggest thing is getting use to the sounds. Even with my short time with the explorer I have scene how much better it is in trash, not too metion depth. Glad you talked me into the switch.

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

I dont remember a Dave Z. But I do know that the xlt has way more things to set up and tweak then the explorer. The settings to me were so much easier on the explorer but I also have more experience with detectors in general. The biggest thing is getting use to the sounds. Even with my short time with the explorer I have scene how much better it is in trash, not too metion depth. Glad you talked me into the switch.

You just said something I have pointed out for years. Getting used to the sounds.

Minelab has always marketed the Quattro or now maybe the Safari as being "user friendly." I've said it for years the settings on an Explorer are not complicated, it's learning the sounds that is the learning curve. So even if you only have to push one button on the Quattro vs 3 on the explorer, it's not going to be any easier to learn. All it is, is hype to fit another Explorer type detector into the line up, not more user friendly.

 

[mainer]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

You are right IP. Most of the settings are geared more toward personal preference and thus are set and forget. When I was in the maket a few years ago for a new detector I origanally wanted the explorer. But from what I read on forums I decided with my limited experience it sounded too complicated for me. Thats when I bought the xlt, hearing that it was easier. But Knowing what I know now it isnt and I would have been better off to go with the explorer from the start. Although the xlt has made me some great finds and was a excellent machine. But I would recommend the explorer to anyone.

As for the Safari/quatro I really dont know what to make of the machine I hear so many mixed reveiws on it. Seems to me if you are going to buy one of them you may aswell buy the explorer, but I am basing that one what I have read not from personal experience.

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Explorer "Noise cancel" question

You are right IP. Most of the settings are geared more toward personal preference and thus are set and forget. When I was in the maket a few years ago for a new detector I origanally wanted the explorer. But from what I read on forums I decided with my limited experience it sounded too complicated for me. Thats when I bought the xlt, hearing that it was easier. But Knowing what I know now it isnt and I would have been better off to go with the explorer from the start. Although the xlt has made me some great finds and was a excellent machine. But I would recommend the explorer to anyone.

As for the Safari/quatro I really dont know what to make of the machine I hear so many mixed reveiws on it. Seems to me if you are going to buy one of them you may aswell buy the explorer, but I am basing that one what I have read not from personal experience.

That's my point. If an explorer is in the budget it's better to get it over the Quattro or Safari.

My first detector was a choice between 3. The Fisher 7a pro, XLT, and GTI 1500. Being new the imaging on the Garrett is probably the thing that sold me into buying it... plus it was the name I was most familiar with. That detector did find me some good stuff but I think the Fisher was probably the better choice.