Jesse James Treasures: Do They Likely Still Exist?

[Rebel - KGC]

?
Did you mean CSA Gen Joseph O Shelby and his IRON BRIGADE?
Now Dr John Sibley from Mass. was a medic during the Revolution, and Thomas Jefferson made him Indian Agent of the Orleans Territory 1815- 1814. He later settled along the Red River in Texas.
His son, CSA Brig Gen Henry Hopkins Sibley, however commanded a Texas Confederate division whose supply wagons were attacked and destroyed at the Battle of Gloneta Pass, and Sibley retreated to San Antonio, thus ending the Confederacy's hopes of having a southwest passage to California's mineral wealth, primarily, gold.

CSA Gen Joseph O Shelby knew Quantrill, Anderson, the James and Youngers, and NEVER surrendered, and his Adjutant, John Edward Newman, became a newspaper owner and wrote positive reports and stories of Jesse and Frank James.

Yeah... SORRY; got 'em mixed up.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Diving for Pleasure and Treasure - Grab it through Amazon!

[Rebel - KGC]

It WAS Gen. Joe O'Shelby IRON BRIGADE, CSA (1863).

 

[Kace]

The Knights of the Golden Circle wanted men, who could be trusted & SECRETIVE... ranks of Free Masons were good, for Iron Hand, especially... read up on the Confederate Knights of TX.

THAT makes Perfect sense to me...Already a member of a tight organization of trusted men, especially those that share the same views. My Grandfathers, Uncles and Cousins have always had great respect for their 'Brothers' at the lodge and I've met many good people through them too. I see why KGC would want those ties. I'll read CKOT that you suggested!

Thanks Reb!!

 

[Kace]

Soon, I will share MORE on the Degrees of the KGC & some books that you can read "on-line" (like REBEL GOLD)... Chapter 7: "Jesse James, KGC Field Commander" is a "MUST READ" (IMHO). LATER!

I'm Looking Forward To It!! And I'm catching up...Between you guys and my amazing guide and teacher I'm getting Book Knowledge, Life Knowledge and Experience plus Boots on The Ground Knowledge!! It Doesn't Get Any Better Than That!!

I've been revisiting...with new eyes, all of the important places my Dad, Grandparents and Uncles took me to as a child thru my 34th year and after that a favorite Uncle kept it up as landscapes changed where they pointed out things they wanted me to know and the history and its importance.

Memories flood back of those times and now I'm blessed beyond measure to have my 'faded' memories restored and patiently, in detail, explained to me again. I can almost feel my family next to me. It's Been Very Rewarding. Now I Understand More Than Ever The Why's and Reasons Familes and Neighbors Fought, Suffered and Died To Protect and Keep Their Beliefs and Way Of Life Intact No Matter The Cost.

I understand why land is so important to keep in families where their tears and blood were shed and lives were lost and changed forever. Why THAT Tree Can Never Be Cut Down. I can hear my Granpa saying proudly 'That's Where The Confederate Recruiting Station Was....Right At The End Of OUR Lane...and telling me..'MY gGrandma brought peaches out for the boys in line and that line was clear up 'roun the barn she said' Both sets my Grandparents, mother and father were extremely proud of their heritage as are all of the neighbors here.

I really get Why there is so much Hatred here for Lincoln and Every Kansan that was in with Lane and his militia that burned out, beat, stole from,and raped innocent and unarmed women, children and older men. One stroke of the pen and Lincoln changed and decimated lives here forever. Everyone still flys both flags and God Help Anyone who tries to take that Rebel Flag or The Confederate Markers in The Cemetery of the boys who served, died and even those who didn't make it home but have a marker here...insuring they won't be forgotten.

Thank You Guys!

Kace

 

[franklin]

I'm Looking Forward To It!! And I'm catching up...Between you guys and my amazing guide and teacher I'm getting Book Knowledge, Life Knowledge and Experience plus Boots on The Ground Knowledge!! It Doesn't Get Any Better Than That!!

I've been revisiting...with new eyes, all of the important places my Dad, Grandparents and Uncles took me to as a child thru my 34th year and after that a favorite Uncle kept it up as landscapes changed where they pointed out things they wanted me to know and the history and its importance.

Memories flood back of those times and now I'm blessed beyond measure to have my 'faded' memories restored and patiently, in detail, explained to me again. I can almost feel my family next to me. It's Been Very Rewarding. Now I Understand More Than Ever The Why's and Reasons Familes and Neighbors Fought, Suffered and Died To Protect and Keep Their Beliefs and Way Of Life Intact No Matter The Cost.

I understand why land is so important to keep in families where their tears and blood were shed and lives were lost and changed forever. Why THAT Tree Can Never Be Cut Down. I can hear my Granpa saying proudly 'That's Where The Confederate Recruiting Station Was....Right At The End Of OUR Lane...and telling me..'MY gGrandma brought peaches out for the boys in line and that line was clear up 'roun the barn she said' Both sets my Grandparents, mother and father were extremely proud of their heritage as are all of the neighbors here.

I really get Why there is so much Hatred here for Lincoln and Every Kansan that was in with Lane and his militia that burned out, beat, stole from,and raped innocent and unarmed women, children and older men. One stroke of the pen and Lincoln changed and decimated lives here forever. Everyone still flys both flags and God Help Anyone who tries to take that Rebel Flag or The Confederate Markers in The Cemetery of the boys who served, died and even those who didn't make it home but have a marker here...insuring they won't be forgotten.

Thank You Guys!

Kace

Thank you, Kace for telling it like it was and is today.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Soon, I will share MORE on the Degrees of the KGC & some books that you can read "on-line" (like REBEL GOLD)... Chapter 7: "Jesse James, KGC Field Commander" is a "MUST READ" (IMHO). LATER!

The following books can be read "on-line" - KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Keehn; AN AUTHENTIC EXPOSITION OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE; RULES & REGULATIONS OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE; THE MYSTERIOUS ORDER OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Dr. Roy Roush,; JESSE JAMES AND THE LOST TREASURE OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Dr. Roy Roush; HOW TO FIND THE TREASURES OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Dr. Roy Roush; THE ONES THAT GOT AWAY by L.C. Baker; A TRUE DISCLOSURE AND EXPOSITION OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Pomfey; THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Crenshaw; RITUAL OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE AND SONS OF LIBERTY FIRST DEGREE; the knights of the golden circle | Download eBook pdf, epub, tuebl, mobi

 

[Kace]

Thank you, Kace for telling it like it was and is today.

You are very welcome franklin!

I was going to tell more about this area and what happened...documented history as well as local and family history that Didn't make it into print, but I got kind of emotional thinking about this stuff. lol! My window and porch look out over a beautiful long, green pasture surrounded on 3 sides by rocky and wooded hills and a small fishing lake...For years I've loved sitting on this porch or sitting at the table and watching and listening to the deer, turkey, raccoons, squirrels, ducks and geese, the small bear that was transplanted here....even the turtles walking by.

What I didn't realize, was that my beautiful green pasture and these hills were the site of a small, but very bloody skirmish and over 10 locals were killed or injured out in front of me. This isn't a large metropolis so 10 is big here. Now sitting in my chair I'm looking at it differently and trying to picture what happened. I can't really know for certain that what I'm thinking is right, but what I know for certain is right is that I wouldn't be sitting here in this chair on this porch with a tablet in 2017 typing this and posting it to you guys all over the country by pushing a button if they didn't fight and die so their descendants could live freely on this land. It's made me realize that you don't have to be in a cemetery or a park that recognizes a battlefield site to be on hallowed ground. I haven't looked yet, but that little skirmish probably didn't even make the newspaper. It sure altered lives here though.

It's a weird feeling being here for this reason when I stop and think how many times I've walked by, or saw something and my whitewashed brain, over time, and even though I have been told differently,evolved into an explanation that made sense To Me...like the Sweetheart Trees that I always like to look at.. Well, I've spent two of these days learning that a Heart, Date and Intials on Some Trees Do Not Sweetheart Trees Make...

According to my guy and I'm gonna Quote Him, HE Said..."Just Because There Is A Heart, Date and Initials Carved on a Tree, Does Not Always Mean ADAM Was Declaring His Undying Love For EVE OR STEVE"! LOL! I really like this guy and I've said it to him, he does not have a filter on Anything!

It's amazing to me just how much use of trees and rocks people made. There weren't road signs or gps when folks settled here obviously, so using trees or larger rocks as markers makes perfect sense...Country Dr's used them as did new settlers, established homesteaders, traveling Preachers, Stopover Rooms to Rent, Mercantile's, Blacksmiths,Locals and those passing thru etc. People added to them or marked them out, changed or revised the directions...or messages.

I've learned for instance that the Spoked Wheels I see on trees can mean that someone named Wright was there...Or this is for the Wrights, They were wood workers and Wheelwrights. No one carved out the name Wright, they just put what they wanted to on a tree or rock with a spoked wheel. Two WW's can mean the same. Very Cool...I think anyway. Probably tree marking 101 to you guys...But nobody is taught anymore what our surnames mean or really the history and original meaning of any name.

This has been one of the best trips ever!!

Kace

 

[Kace]

The following books can be read "on-line" - KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Keehn; AN AUTHENTIC EXPOSITION OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE; RULES & REGULATIONS OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE; THE MYSTERIOUS ORDER OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Dr. Roy Roush,; JESSE JAMES AND THE LOST TREASURE OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Dr. Roy Roush; HOW TO FIND THE TREASURES OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Dr. Roy Roush; THE ONES THAT GOT AWAY by L.C. Baker; A TRUE DISCLOSURE AND EXPOSITION OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Pomfey; THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE by Crenshaw; RITUAL OF THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE AND SONS OF LIBERTY FIRST DEGREE; the knights of the golden circle | Download eBook pdf, epub, tuebl, mobi

WOW!!!...That's Amazing!!! This collection will help me A Lot!! THANK YOU REB!!

Kace

 

[45th_Johnny]

I am with Franklin on that: "Thank you, Kace for telling it like it was and is today."

 

[Kace]

This is just to make certain that my post on the Crittenden Memoirs was taken correctly...

The Crittendon Memoirs are a recognized, documented history of that era. There is a whole backstory on JFD/FD's role in his part of them. I do not endorse those stories as being HIS First Hand Accounts.. They Are Not.

I believe most of the Events that he wrote about are true because I've seen and read authentic First Hand Accounts of some of the things he has written about by people who were there in Missouri Historical Societies that have collections from Local to Me in MO, soldiers, families and militia members. Sons of the Confederacy etc. We have several in my family that were with Quantrill, more that fought for the Confederacy as soldiers and my family has in it a long history southern political involvement which is why my Grandparents were first contacted about him in '47. My family is from these areas and I'm sitting here in one of those areas he wrote about now.

I didn't post that to prove that Jesse Woodson James was killed in St Joseph, MO by Bob Ford in April of 1882. I Don't Believe That.

I posted that to show what JFD/FD was doing before he announced to the world he was Jesse James..Outlaw. He Was Not JWJ. He Also Was Not J.Frank Dalton,John Dalton, Frank Dalton and there is no evidence he was A Dalton. He was fascinated by the Dalton name...he assumed the Dalton name, he wrote under the Dalton name and he scammed under the Dalton name.

JFD/FD Was A Very Gifted Writer...He kept accurate,detailed journals from an early age and wrote short stories from them on Slavery, The Civil War, Quantrill, Militias, John Dalton, Lawman... Outlaw, Dalton Brothers Gang that operated from 1890-92 with Bill Doolin and later Jesse and Frank James and the Younger Brothers along with other notable people from that era. When he could, he inserted himself into those accounts. He Then Sold Those Stories to Western Magazine out of Texas, Small Newspapers, mainly in Texas and occasionally Dime Novels.

The stories in the CM were printed in other Western Mags that are like The National Enquirer...Pretty Accurate but more Sensationalism where he was concerned.

JFD/FD was also a Confidence Man that has been in More Than One Institution and Hospital throughout Texas, Oklahoma and Arkansas possibly more States. He has Many,Many Aliases.

We do need a Rest of The Story on JFD/FD/ and how JWJ came into the mix.

I'll post more, but I wanted to get this out first in case anyone thought that HIS roles or participation in those events were true...They Were Not..

Kace

 

[Rebel - KGC]

WOW!!!...That's Amazing!!! This collection will help me A Lot!! THANK YOU REB!!

Kace

YW. HH! Good Luck! AND! Have FUN!

 

[Kace]

YW. HH! Good Luck! AND! Have FUN!

I'm Having A Great Time!! The reading material you suggested keeps me busy and entertained at night. I didn't bring any family or friends from home with me on this trip.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

HA!

 

[franklin]

We need to do like the folks in television we need to get us a film crew and document all of these threads on television and make some real money. We get on here and talk and others are making money from our ideas. Just this morning I saw a television show, "Mystery Hunters" and they had everything on their show what we have been talking about here on the forum. They make the money and we do the talking.

 

[Kace]

We need to do like the folks in television we need to get us a film crew and document all of these threads on television and make some real money. We get on here and talk and others are making money from our ideas. Just this morning I saw a television show, "Mystery Hunters" and they had everything on their show what we have been talking about here on the forum. They make the money and we do the talking.

You are so right...

 

[uglymailman]

Wow! Miss a few days and there are pages of this thread to sift thru. Now I'm confused.
J. Frank Dalton. I always thought he was a Jesse James Imposter. Someone who claimed to be JJ for either the notoriety or for a meal ticket during the Great Depression. Claims to be with his Papa at Slave Sale. Papa was State Rep.? There ought to be records to prove that. His sisters & Mom were "Stripped to the waist and horsewhipped" along with Frank and Jesse's sister and Mom Zelda? Wouldn't this exclude his being JJ? "Aunt" is an honorarium like "Granny", dosen't always mean they are kin.
Claims Cole Younger was in LA. at War's end and went to Mexico with Shelby? In his autobiography Cole claimed to be in Monterrey (?) Mexico at the war's end. Other reports have him in CA. with his brother in law Jarrett(?). The guy that was killed with his family when his house was burnt down after the war. The same guy buried in Canada. Somewhere, someones memory is faulty or to be unpleasant, they're lyin'.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

SO! What ya think...?

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Well... today; I did R & I on photos/"pics" of J. Frank Dalton... where I could see the hands... NO missing digits; PROOF of the REAL Jesse James is missing digit of the left middle finger above 1st joint, past knuckle.

 

[Kace]

Wow! Miss a few days and there are pages of this thread to sift thru. Now I'm confused.
J. Frank Dalton. I always thought he was a Jesse James Imposter. Someone who claimed to be JJ for either the notoriety or for a meal ticket during the Great Depression. Claims to be with his Papa at Slave Sale. Papa was State Rep.? There ought to be records to prove that. His sisters & Mom were "Stripped to the waist and horsewhipped" along with Frank and Jesse's sister and Mom Zelda? Wouldn't this exclude his being JJ? "Aunt" is an honorarium like "Granny", dosen't always mean they are kin.
Claims Cole Younger was in LA. at War's end and went to Mexico with Shelby? In his autobiography Cole claimed to be in Monterrey (?) Mexico at the war's end. Other reports have him in CA. with his brother in law Jarrett(?). The guy that was killed with his family when his house was burnt down after the war. The same guy buried in Canada. Somewhere, someones memory is faulty or to be unpleasant, they're lyin'.

Hey UMM...You Are Correct!.....JFD/FD Was A Writer...He Was An Imposter, Mental Patient and Con-Artist too. He Wasnt JWJ though. I explained some of it on post #770

JFD/FD ...Claimed his father-Papa-grandfather was a State Senator...He was Not a Senator in 1860 like he claimed. You are correct, there are very searchable data bases of every State Senator. Also claimed his father was Captain George S. James of Fort Sumpter(sp) fame and his mother was Mollie Dalton.. Not.

He also claimed to be the Co-Pilot of Howard Hughes Spruce Goose........see above and below.

Many People and Agencies have tried to find JFD's true identity for Decades...You can't track someone who never existed. He has No Verifiable Past..None past 1930ish and that is All lies and More Aliases. He doesn't have a birth certificate, he isn't in any census, he doesn't have a drivers license, no marriage or divorce record, he has no military record, no personal or real property, no taxes and his Death Certificate was filled out by Orvus Lee Howk. It's all contradictory too. Surprise! His criminal record is Frank Dalton and J.Frank Dalton. There are literally stacks of letters from law enforcement all over the country to the FBI and J. Edgar Hoover requesting JFD's Identity due to his claims. He does have a daughter named Harriett, I'm not posting her last name because she had nothing to do with his lies and scams. She did grow up with the idea she was Frank Dalton's daughter, although her stepfather raised her. ...he got around.

JFD was Not with Quantrill nor was he a Confederate Soldier. Anyone who looks, will find him Added Later to Quantrill's Partisan Ranger Roll..Thanks to Turilli/Howk..His Bio states he claimed to be Jesse James. You will also see the name Kit Dalton right under JFD. That name was added later too. KD is the Author of the book, 'Under The Black Flag'. Many people think JFD used the pen name 'Kit Dalton'. Writing Styles Are Different, But Who Knows. Sons of the Confederacy Have No Record of JFD or KD. Neither do Daughters of the Confederacy. Neither can be found in any Civil War Records as a Soldier or Partisan Ranger/Militia Member. Everyone Else Can Be Found...Just Not JFD or KD.

I wrote 5 pages on this guy and his lies and aliases and I still wasn't done...I deleted it because it's easier just to say look at Orvus Lee Howk's Movements and His Scams prior to JFD coming out as Jesse James. It started over KGC treasure locations JFD talked about. There is a possibility that one or both of them knew where KGC cashes are located. Doubtful but Anything is possible. Oklahoma, Colorado or Montana would be the best places in the states for that.

JFD questions first came into my gGrandparents life in the 30's before the Crittenden Memoirs were published and then into my Grandparents life in '47 I think it was, prior to the world hearing he was JWJ.. That was because of his claims that his father was a State Senator, presumably in MO by his use of the term 'Home State and HH Critenden making reference that JFD/FD recently visited his Native Missouri'. My Grandmother was FurEous...They did visit Meremac when he was there as an attraction and she did confront him, Turilli and Dill....and made no secret while she was there it was all lies. She was a spitfire!! I miss her.

Grandma always wanted to know who JFD really was and me doing this type of work, she REALLY pushed to know. I said I would find out...I never could give her that. Only theories to his true identity. It still bothers me. I do know he isn't Jesse James..Outlaw. I've always kept looking every three months or so as databases open. If the public would request his records they are Not Available..No Access. Records are usually sealed in 25yr increments, they were not opened at 25 or 50 years after his death and 2026 marks the 75th year. Many are waiting to see.

You guys have probably noticed I do not like people making factual claims that JFD is JWJ. That is the reason...He is not JWJ and even the most basic investigation will tell that. If someone wants to sell books, newspapers or attract folks to a tourist or website..Or treasure excavation referring to JFD being Jesse James, Put a disclaimer on there that it's for entertainment only and there is no proof JFD was JWJ or J. Frank Dalton of Dalton Family Fame. More than my family have been personally effected by JFD, Howk, Dill, Turilli and their lies. It doesn't bother me at all if people choose to believe JFD was JWJ, it only bothers me when they state it as Fact to Try and Profit From it.

There is a probability he came from an obscure or unknown branch of a Dalton family that settled Tennessee and moved to Texas. Not Proven.

He he does use SWMO and Texas in his writings. I've visited many Country Churches of all faiths in the Missouri towns he writes about thinking they might have birth or family records give or take 5 years on his stated DOB and so far nothing. I've been to funeral homes and looked through those handwritten records looking for people that could be his family..nothing. Cemeteries..nothing. Land records show nothing. Historical Societies show nothing and No One Has Ever Heard of Him prior to 1936 or '47-'48 depending on who you talk to. I'm not the only one who has done this. I do believe that it's going to take Boots on the Ground to track him back...At this point databases are not going to do that.

JFD etal claimed that his feet were badly burned...No Record of JWJ having that...But, if you look up what Arsenic does to a person...Burned Feet....Those 32 bullet Holes in JFD's body that the astute Sheriff Baker talked about in his Headline 1966 Interview... Arsenic Poisoning creates open wounds on a person. Arsenic also causes Mumification to a body. Guess who opened a curiosity shop of weird stuff in Colorado...that had an Indian Mummy...OL Howk. There are also letters he wrote talking about taking JFD after death to his shop to charge admission to see Jesse James. Contrary to some people and publications...There was Never an autopsy on JFD. He was buried in a wooden coffin.


If anyone wants more information on him, if I have it, it's yours. Just Ask. Sorry that I've beat a dead horse on this topic. But, he had to get completely out of the way in my mind...again. He has.

Kace

 

[uglymailman]

Thanks Kace. All old time records are not complete. I tried finding a Confederate grave where I grew up. A little crossroads berg was named for him. Can find where he died,body shipped from K.C.,MO. to Chilhowee,MO. in Johnson County. Nothing after that. His wife's grave and the berg named for him is about 5 miles south of there but in Henry County. Nobody knows where he's buried.
You might try the Last name Houk instead of Howk. Good luck.