My "AT Pro" Has Reached its Limit on These 5 Silvers, Im Ready for a PI

[SoCalBeachScanner]

My "AT Pro" Has Reached it's Limit on These 5 Silvers, I'm Ready for a PI

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Went back to an area in the Belmont Shore area of Long Beach, CA, that has old sand and has produced a couple of wheat's. The area of dry sand I worked is basically the size of a football field that has 6"-7" of soft top sand with very hard packed sand underneath. Based on the location, I just knew there was silver in the hard sand under the soft sand if I could hear that deep soft whisper of a high tone.

It was very early morning, so there was absolutely no outside noise, wind, or distractions. The area is virtually trash free, had the headphones cranked all the way up, I worked the machine wide open and slower then I have ever worked it (about a 3-second short slow swing) while skimming the sand with the coil. And with my self proclaimed ADD, scanning this slow was very trying and challenging, to say the least.
I dug lots of what I believed were deep whispers that disappeared after the first scoop. I heard my first true high tone whisper (in between shallow bottle tops that about took my head off with the volume so loud) after about twenty minutes and it showed a 92 on the display. I scooped and scanned three times through the soft sand as the tone got louder, then I chopped with the scoop at the hard sand for several more inches.

And there it was! A 1961 Franklin Silver Half. Then about every fifteen minutes or so I dug down in the hard packed sand for four more silver. FIVE SILVER TOTAL!!

It takes a lot of patience and concentration to work the machine that slow to hear the whispers of a good deep target, and I was ready to pick up the pace after an hour plus of that. I didn't cover much ground today, but the ground was good, and there is a lot more ground to cover. In areas that have quality targets that are deep, it difficult to constantly work a machine to it's limits, and then, you still wonder what your missing a few inches further down.

I believe if I had a Good PI Machine in that same area, along with other old sand areas I know of, I just may have a jar full of silver, and jewelry from the same era as the coins.

So now you guys know what I want for Christmas Just in time for the Winter Storms in January.

I really love my AT Pro, it has served me well, and still will, but it has it's limits, and I believe I'm ready for a Good PI Machine for areas just like I was at today, maybe an ATX? Still waiting for beach user reviews before I pull that trigger.


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Beautiful Morning .. About 58 Degrees when I Started .. These pictures are not the exact area that I worked ... Gotta have some secrets
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Thanks For Looking ... Keep on Swinging

 

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[SoCalBeachScanner]

So-Ca beach-scanner, wow you are thinking LONG AND HARD about this decision of yours No one can accuse you of "not doing your homework" on the pros and cons, haha. However, anything (youtube vids, other threads, consumer reviews, etc...) that you can get on the net, are going to have be "put into context". Because each hunting situation, location, soil type, goals-of-targets, junk situations, etc... is different.

If your dilemna was teensy jewelry, and/or mineralized/black sands, then I would agree with you that any of various pulse machines is the options. However, ........ ignorning for a moment your desire to get a machine for all-sorts-of other venues (nuggets, blah blah blah), and just focusing on the silver coin phenomenom that started this thread:

If we can ditch the talk about a "do-everything" machine for a moment, and focus just on that goal. Then assuming we're talking about normal So. CA dry sand, then I don't think you're talking nasty minerals there. Only certain beaches there in So CA are reknowned for nasty jet black minerals. Dockweiler for instance. And certain other ones when water cuts channel paths to the ocean, etc... But I'm going to assume that this portion of Long Beach (where you suspect more deep silver coins are, in that firm-pack ~8" down), then no, you don't need a pulse to reach those depths. And no, you don't need a pulse d/t we're not talking about nasty and/or wet minerals.

So that only leaves dainty fine tinsel thin chains, or earing studs. To that I would say that while this is true, yet ..... most standard coin machines (like the sov, explorer, etc...) can indeed *still* find some fairly small stuff. Yes not as small and dainty as a pulse machine, but I still manage to find pretty small stuff. And the depth is comparable, on coin-sized targets, to most of the available beach pulse machines.

You can expect about a ft. on coins with an explorer. Maybe 13" if you get the CTX and use the big coil. Perhaps 14" with a sov/wot combo. All of which will afford you iron disc. Now ask any beach pulse user how deep THEY can get coins to, and I believe you'll see that the depths are no better than those.

So the issue will be: how much iron just is there there? I know that where I'm doing my dry sand for silver coins (not unlike your Long Beach situation), I would indeed be be-devilled with teensy iron stuff, if I went the pulse route. All while gaining no depth (believe me, I've already tried.).

Anyhow, that's my two cents worth. If you want to get some IN-FIELD machine comparisons, let me know. And as I said, I know guys down your way, who have all the various options in their aresenals already, and are quite adept at each of them. You guys can test over flagged virgin targets. They would abide by the "code" and go by your say-so.

Tom, you crack me up

My decision on a new detector is not just about going deeper in the location that I found the silver in this thread. It's mostly about a whole new detecting experience with a detector that works opposite in some respects to a VLF multi-freq on the electronic field and the sounds you hear.
In my own mind I have correlated the use of a pulse machine with today's latest claimed technology for a experience I believe it will give me. So all I can say is we'll see how it works out in heavy and light black sand riffs, along with trough of the surf. This will be more of a in the surf and bay machine with me and in non-trashy areas of dry sand.

If it only works out as you think it will, I guess I will just have to sell it to a prospector If not, I will come up to CentralCal and clean up what you left behind


Updated Post 4:00 PM

Also Tom ... below (your a & b) is what you said to me in a long pasted thread about pulse machines. I was thinking back remembering that you did talk about pulse at one point in time as this thread was unraveling, and I just found what you said. So I guess I am becoming one of the those SoCal hardcore as you said and of course I will avoid the junky nail-ridden areas with a pulse and I will save that for the AT Pro


"a) On southern CA beaches, pulse machines are very popular amongst the most hardcore there. They go super deep (deeper than your at-pro), find the finest daintiest of chains and earing studs, and will cut right through the nastiest of minerals. Hence, "how can you argue with that?" right? But the downside of those machines is, they can't discriminate out nails (especially bent ones).

b) so those pulse users tend to avoid the junky nail-ridden areas, and gravitate to cleaner areas void of nails. Thus yes, if someone with a discriminator goes into junky areas, then yes, you're often in an area the pulse machine users avoid."

 

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[SoCalBeachScanner]

Agreed, I'm not looking for tiny tiny earring backs, etc but I did pick this tiny star shaped bling piece up with stock coil on CTX up at 8-10 inches in wet salty sand and was impressed to say the least. The nickel was laying under this rusty iron at approx 12-14 inches and it had no problem picking it. That's as good as I can ask for. If the ATX can do what the vids say then great, but for where I mostly hunt there's just too many tiny pieces of iron, screw caps, bobby pins , foil, etc for me to spend all my time digging with the type PI machine I have used.

Hi Fletch ... I just noticed your post on the previous page

I agree with you on not wanting to spend time digging tiny crap. The At Pro could also screen out that and pick out coins in trashy areas along with smaller jewelry that would fall through my scoop, not as deep as your CTX, but for the price, you can't beat it.

If I lived in an area that had tons of small iron and trash all over the beach, a pulse would not be an option on the beach, but I could still use it in the desert. I don't do parks either, so that's not a problem. We have many options in Southern CA; Mountains, Beach & Desert to detect.

Southern CA, has black sand and Long Beach has the heaviest concentration of black sand. Sure, the CTX could handle some of that, the AT Pro sounds like you have the iron audio on that switches from high to low as you scan over the riffles, and I'm tired of hearing that.

I can't get through Tom's head that I want a different MD experience that a pulse will give me and I will be dealing with black sand, obviously he didn't read #5 in this thread. And no matter what machine you use, you are going to dig false signals and trash.

Anyway, I don't mind being double teamed It's funny though, you would think people would want to know if the ATX lives up to it's claims in the surf, and push someone to get one.

 

[christo000]

Id like to know the entire experience with an atx in surf,land,water any knowlege I can get on something i dont have ill take. Sounds like you know what you want in an experience & in a detector. Go for it & let us know

 

[SoCalBeachScanner]

Id like to know the entire experience with an atx in surf,land,water any knowlege I can get on something i dont have ill take. Sounds like you know what you want in an experience & in a detector. Go for it & let us know

Now there's a man after my own heart and wallet ... Thank You christo000

 

[christo000]

Hahaha

 

[RobRieman]

I say buy two of them so you have a back up!

 

[SoCalBeachScanner]

Id like to know the entire experience with an atx in surf,land,water any knowlege I can get on something i dont have ill take. Sounds like you know what you want in an experience & in a detector. Go for it & let us know

Hi christo000,

No decent ATX reviews in the surf yet, but I just found this impressive video showing it hit a nickel at 15" in dirt.

 

[christo000]

Thanks buddy really looks totaly different then others I like the machines that stand out from others. I got garrets fall issue in couple others have gotten some great finds with it

 

[Fletch88]

I saw in Lost Treasure magazine this morning where Minelab is coming out with a mid priced nugget machine similar to ATX maybe. It folds up to an OAL of 18". Will be curious to see it when it hits the market.

 

[christo000]

Looks like the deus xp being the first to fold up was a hit companies take notice. I wonder If they will pop out with an all wireless machine

 

[Tom_in_CA]

so-ca-beach hunter, once you decide on, and buy, a beach pulse, see how deep it will get on a coin-sized target. That shouldn't be too hard. Either by simply burying one, and letting the water slap/slop over it, to pack it in at the surf's edge. So that it mimicks undisturbed solid sand. Or simply going and digging enough signals in those dry sand zones you speak of. After getting a few of the deeper coins, you will immediately get a feel for the depth-at-which it peaks out at coin-sized targets at.

Ok, then report back here the # of inches that is. I'm going to guess it's no deeper than some of today's power-house coin machines (unless you settled on something that WAY squirelly sensitive like some of Minelab nugget machines out there today). But yes, you're right: even though it could be argued that "coin-sized items" will fair about the same whether pulse vs non-pulse (even if that were a true statement), that yes, there's still other considerations. It's hard to argue with the smooth pleasant sounds of some of those beach pulse machines. Their ease of use. Their great ability in minerals. Their great ability at teensy things, etc... So that only leaves iron disc as the possible downside. And that may or may not be a problem where you're at.

So I'd be very curious when you buy, to report back how you faired in the exact same zone as where you found those 5 silver coins. The zone-at-which you suspect there are deeper silvers. Yes I know that's not your only objective, and yes I know you'll keep a standard coin machine around for certain venues. Still though, I am curious how you'll fare, for just that one venue. Does it get the depth to get more silver coins? Is the ratio of iron too punishing to do it that way? etc....

 

[Tom_in_CA]

About 20 yrs. ago, I was at an old stretch of Manhattan Beach, in Southern CA, following some heavy rains. The rains had washed out their annual channels of water-outflow, coming out of the culverts, that cut channels across the dry sand to the ocean. One of these little creek-channels had taken an odd turn, and cut under the Manhattan pier (a very old pier). I got down into the channel of water, which had cut a channel several feet deep, and several yards across.

At the time, I was using a Whites Eagle SLII. Which is NOT a particularly good wet-salt sand machine. NOR is it good in nasty minerals. However, it does have disc (since it's a standard coin machine). I figured that the washed out sand in this zone should be producing some targets. And I wasn't dissappointed: I got lots of coins, inc. some silver ones, wheaties, etc... mixed in with the clad. And there were tons of nails (go figure, it was right beneath a pier). It was all I could do *just* to get an inch or two deep though the heavy black sand in this gully-wash, but it didn't matter. Because since it was all washed out sand, none of the targets were necessarily deep.

As I was hunting this mess of nails and targets, I spotted a guy working his way down the the open beach, swinging a whites beach pulse machine. As he came my way, we stopped to chat. I showed him my stuff, including the old coins . His eyes widened up, and he asked if he could join me in these tight confines. I said "sure. In fact, let's see what your machine can do, because these minerals are giving me fits!". However, the guy didn't last more than 3 minutes. After his umpteenth nail, not having progressed out of an area more than 3 or 4 ft. square, he left for "greener grounds". So there I was again, all alone, digging what I could get out of this morass of nails and targets.

The point of all that is: that there IS a place for different types of machines. Yes you may fall in love and do quite well with a pulse machine. I will be curious if it ends up being one that works for the deep silver in the dry sand (yes, I know that's not your *only* objectives). Keep us posted.

 

[Fletch88]

Tom, I dug a clad dime at 18" in semi-dry sand at beach with the stock coil on the CTX. I was hunting in pitch hold which was the only way I found the initial signal. Once I scooped down a couple times I picked up a strong signal. That's as deep as I ever care to dig in dry sand, and almost impossible in wet sand.

 

[SoCalBeachScanner]

The point of all that is: that there IS a place for different types of machines. Yes you may fall in love and do quite well with a pulse machine. I will be curious if it ends up being one that works for the deep silver in the dry sand (yes, I know that's not your *only* objectives). Keep us posted.

Thanks Tom, I'll keep you posted. I just posted in "Today's Finds" what I found early today in LB. I found a HUGE CHAIN, but..............

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Tom, I dug a clad dime at 18" in semi-dry sand at beach with the stock coil on the CTX. I was hunting in pitch hold which was the only way I found the initial signal. Once I scooped down a couple times I picked up a strong signal. That's as deep as I ever care to dig in dry sand, and almost impossible in wet sand.

Fletch,

When you say "stock coil", you mean the 10.5" coil? And when you say "pitch-hold", are you referring to some sort of all-metal mode? Excuse me for my ignorance, but I'm still using the Exp. II. And from what I've read, the CTX is really nothing more than a glorified water-proof explorer or etrac anyhow. At least as far as depth goes. The exception may be when going to larger coils: Whereas the etrac or exp. II do not go deeper on coin sized targets when switching to the 12, or 13 or wot, etc... (you only gain more coverage swath). Yet supposedly the CTX *is* able to "handle" those larger coils to the extent that .... yes you can go deeper on coin sized targets. I'm sure there's some trade-offs though, of warbly sounds, masking, pinpointing, etc...

With my Exp. II, I can fairly reliably tell high vs low, to about 10" (maybe 11" depending on the coin size). And I can tell conductive vs non-conductive down to 12" (maybe 13" depending on coin size). But if I want to chase insane whispers that are beyond my ability to tell conductive vs non-conductive, I can get about 13 or 14" (maybe 15" for larger targets). But in those cases, I'm having to kick sand aside, re-scan, and THEN I can tell conductive vs non-conductive, once I'm down about 5" of kicked-aside sand.

These type of depths would not be do-able in park turf. Because there's not the liberty to chase and investigate every single peep. Ie.: a little .... uh .... discernment and cherry-picking is often in order. But on the beach, I have chased coins that were definately beyond a foot, with my standard 10.5 coil.

 

[Fletch88]

Tom, the stock CTX and Etrac is an an 11" DD. On the CTX and Etrac the Response option choices are Normal( most popular), Long, Smooth(relics) and Pitch Hold ( standard on the Excal, Sov GT, and beach mode of CTX /Etrac) I usually only use pitch hold on the beach where there's little trash or not multiple targets close together. It will change the threshold tone when you go over a target that the signal isn't necessarily strong enough to give a target response, but strong enough to barely break the threshold. I know most are reading this thinking the coin fell in the hole out I the wall of the hole I dug. I was very careful that this didn't happen. I changed the threshold with my scoop several times and was still able to get a pitch change in threshold before I started digging. After I dug about 5-6" down I was able to get a normal target response by sticking the coil in the hole and doing a short wiggle. I kept checking target in PP as I dug down thinking there was iron in the vicinity fooling my detector. When I recovered the dime I laid my scoop in hole and scribed a line on the handle. I've only had the CTX a couple months and this was my first hunt using pitch hold on the beach. After doing this I dug several more pieces of clad that only gave me a change in threshold pitch. Most times I could PP and hit target pretty well, especially after digging a couple scoops off the target.

 

[Fletch88]

I will be beach hunting again after Thanksgiving to see if I can replicate this hopefully on gold targets not clad. I'm taking the family on a cruise over to Nassau , but have already been told that the detectors stay home! Lol. I'm taking a guys vacation next year for a whole week water detecting somewhere tropical. Or maybe sound the whole state of Florida for a 9 day excursion.

 

[SoCalBeachScanner]

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I will be beach hunting again after Thanksgiving to see if I can replicate this hopefully on gold targets not clad. I'm taking the family on a cruise over to Nassau , but have already been told that the detectors stay home! Lol. I'm taking a guys vacation next year for a whole week water detecting somewhere tropical. Or maybe sound the whole state of Florida for a 9 day excursion.

Hi Fletch88,

What are your thoughts about Steve Herschbach's comment yesterday, in thread below, on the CTX3030 in a high mineralized park vs the ATX?


http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/metal-detecting-gold/387818-gold-nugget-detecting-new-garrett-atx.html#post3708260


His comment is from this article (below) when talking about using the ATX at a old mineralized park in Reno


Gold and Silver with the New Garrett ATX Metal Detector

 

[Fletch88]

I really don't give it much thought but 2 things that stuck out were 6.9 lbs and 50/50 trash to treasure ratio, that coupled with the coil mounting design/look is enough for me to not buy one. Everyones needs are different though mainly I don't live in any mineralized areas or beaches. You don't have the ATX in hand yet? I'm ready to see the results in the area you're taking about. I may fly over to compare detectors one day.

 

[SoCalBeachScanner]

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I really don't give it much thought but 2 things that stuck out were 6.9 lbs and 50/50 trash to treasure ratio, that coupled with the coil mounting design/look is enough for me to not buy one. Everyones needs are different though mainly I don't live in any mineralized areas or beaches. You don't have the ATX in hand yet? I'm ready to see the results in the area you're taking about. I may fly over to compare detectors one day.

Yeah, it's a heavy beast ... my arm is not the thing that wears out detecting for four hours, it's my damn head from hearing everything in the ground

No ATX in my hands yet. I was waiting for reviews of the ATX in the saltwater that I have yet to find. Although, I most likely will try to work a Good Friday deal with one of the supporting vendors. Then we'll see what I find, I guess.

Thanks, Fletch