🥇 BANNER *UPDATE* Cleaned up nicely! Just dug one of the rarest New Jersey Contemporary counterfeits 1787 Maris 83-ii variety R7

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

I located a small cellar hole not far from where I live. How I did not notice this years ago is beyond me? As with most cellars these days most are pounded out. As I walked up to it after a 15 min hike. I had doubts it was even a cellar hole. no well just a shallow depression with a small pile of more rounded rocks son the edge. turned my machine on and 1st target was a musket ball, nice I thought! 2nd target was a rat tail pewter spoon bowl. so this confirmed home site to me. I dug a couple fugio's and a shot CT copper a a few buttons and last target was a sweet silver luckenbooth brooch. I called it a day as it was getting late. I returned today started out with another musket ball. nabbed another copper which is a hibernia. then i dug a a button signal and out popped a clipped thin copper. didn't think much of it and put in in my case. When I got home and started cleaning my finds I saw a shield but it looked thinner and more narrow than your typical NJ copper. I sent a few messages to some colonial copper experts on facebook and got the good news. super rare only 10-12 known Maris 83-ii Rarity 7 which is amazing. boat loads rarer than my AMERI. reversed Chain cent. My coin is struck over a 1782 KG III Hibernia. You can clearly see the under type in the pics below.

What a day!!!!!!!!!

PIC BELOW SHOWS A KGIII HIBERNIA ON THE LEFT AND THE UNDERTYPE ON MY COIN ON THE RIGHT. YOU CAN CLEARLY SEE THE IA OF HIBERNIA AND THE NUMBER 2 IN THE DATE OF 1782.

 

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[HEAVYMETALNUT]

That's an incredible bunch of finds, congrats!

thanks!

 

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[HEAVYMETALNUT]

Just wanted to show a auction price of one close in grade to mine.
crazy the value on this Maris 82-ii variety.

https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/item/1787-nj-1-2p-maris-83-ii-hourglass-muzzle-bn/756010/1496942936977976700

 

[E-Trac-Ohio]

Congrats on the outstanding finds !

 

[Kona Koma]

I located a small cellar hole not far from where I live. How I did not notice this years ago is beyond me? As with most cellars these days most are pounded out. As I walked up to it after a 15 min hike. I had doubts it was even a cellar hole. no well just a shallow depression with a small pile of more rounded rocks son the edge. turned my machine on and 1st target was a musket ball, nice I thought! 2nd target was a rat tail pewter spoon bowl. so this confirmed home site to me. I dug a couple fugio's and a shot CT copper a a few buttons and last target was a sweet silver luckenbooth brooch. I called it a day as it was getting late. I returned today started out with another musket ball. nabbed another copper which is a hibernia. then i dug a a button signal and out popped a clipped thin copper. didn't think much of it and put in in my case. When I got home and started cleaning my finds I saw a shield but it looked thinner and more narrow than your typical NJ copper. I sent a few messages to some colonial copper experts on facebook and got the good news. super rare only 10-12 known Maris 83-ii Rarity 7 which is amazing. boat loads rarer than my AMERI. reversed Chain cent. View attachment 2113510 View attachment 2113511 View attachment 2113512 View attachment 2113513 View attachment 2113514 View attachment 2113515 View attachment 2113516 What a day!!!!!!!!! View attachment 2113850 View attachment 2113851

Good job. Several nice finds.

 

[JamieD]

Hi, congratulations on the find!

This may be an ignorant question but are these counterfeits always overstruck on other coins? I only ask as the auction coin you linked was overstruck on a Nova Constellatio copper and yours looks to be overstruck to - it seems to have the obverse legend from a George iii coin as well as the NOVA CAESAREA.

Jamie

 

[pepperj]

Congratulations on the amazing recoveries.
Just the brooch would of made the day a top self hunt.
Given that you recovered the rare copper it's a Banner quality hunt.

I have spent some time studying the different varieties of these coppers again since you posted up.
In all honesty it would take a lot of time, and knowledge to wade through them and figure out what variety something actually is.
The question nags in the mind-have they documented all the different varieties or are there some still lurking in the dark soils?

 

[Gare]

Great FINDS for SURE Thanks for sharing with us. Now i have a question. How does anyone think they would cut a portion off a coin ? Also why would they cut it off. ?I have seen a lot of coins with a portion cut off.

 

[l.cutler]

Congratulations on the amazing recoveries.
Just the brooch would of made the day a top self hunt.
Given that you recovered the rare copper it's a Banner quality hunt.

I have spent some time studying the different varieties of these coppers again since you posted up.
In all honesty it would take a lot of time, and knowledge to wade through them and figure out what variety something actually is.
The question nags in the mind-have they documented all the different varieties or are there some still lurking in the dark soils?

New Jerseys are pretty easy to ID. There was a new Connecticut variety discovered just in the last year, but they are tougher to ID with much more minor differences in the varieties. There was a major New Jersey variety discovery in the mid 1990's, with Walter Moulds initials, he was the minter of that variety.

 

[l.cutler]

Hi, congratulations on the find!

This may be an ignorant question but are these counterfeits always overstruck on other coins? I only ask as the auction coin you linked was overstruck on a Nova Constellatio copper and yours looks to be overstruck to - it seems to have the obverse legend from a George iii coin as well as the NOVA CAESAREA.

Jamie

Readers digest condensed version. By the end of the 1780's there was such a glut of lightweight coppers in circulation that they became virtually worthless. New Jersey coppers were held to a high standard of weight and were accepted at a higher value than most others, the counterfeiters used the lightweight coppers as cheap ready made planchets and overstamped them with New Jersey designs. Nova Constellatio coppers, lightweight Connecticuts and imitation British halfpennies were the most common to be overstruck.

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

Hi, congratulations on the find!

This may be an ignorant question but are these counterfeits always overstruck on other coins? I only ask as the auction coin you linked was overstruck on a Nova Constellatio copper and yours looks to be overstruck to - it seems to have the obverse legend from a George iii coin as well as the NOVA CAESAREA.

Jamie

Thanks! From what I understand these NJ counterfeits were struck over less worth coins in order to make it worth what a NJ copper was worth. I had no idea how substantial a discovery this was until a few experts messaged me wanting to buy it with some pricey offers. being the 13th known to exist is pretty exciting. This is struck over a KG Hibernia.

 

[pepperj]

Thanks! From what I understand these NJ counterfeits were struck over less worth coins in order to make it worth what a NJ copper was worth. I had no idea how substantial a discovery this was until a few experts messaged me wanting to buy it with some pricey offers. being the 13 known to exist is pretty exciting. This is struck over a KG Hibernia.

That's interesting that they want to buy it so quickly.
Surprisingly good about of 👀 watch the forum for something that can be bought.
I've been approached by "newbies" a few times sniffing to buy.

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

I love the cleaned up pics!
Looks like it was overstruck on a George ll halfpenny...how cool is that !!

Thanks! It is struck over a KG III Hibernia.

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

That's interesting that they want to buy it so quickly.
Surprisingly good about of 👀 watch the forum for something that can be bought.
I've been approached by "newbies" a few times sniffing to buy.

yeah I had offers of 5k already but I know it's worth more so I'm sitting tight.

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

Awesomeness!!!! Congrats!!!!

Thanks RJ!

 

[Fugio]

First of all, congrats on a truly incredible find. I recently dug a hard times token, circa 1833, in similar condition to your Jersey Copper. I always have such a hardtime getting toasty coppers to clean up without destroying them. May I enquire about your cleaning process on this?

With a rare piece like that, I would reccomend you submit to NGC and have it professionaly conserved and encapsulated. Again, congrats on such a rare and interesting find.

 

[JohnnyMac]

I located a small cellar hole not far from where I live. How I did not notice this years ago is beyond me? As with most cellars these days most are pounded out. As I walked up to it after a 15 min hike. I had doubts it was even a cellar hole. no well just a shallow depression with a small pile of more rounded rocks son the edge. turned my machine on and 1st target was a musket ball, nice I thought! 2nd target was a rat tail pewter spoon bowl. so this confirmed home site to me. I dug a couple fugio's and a shot CT copper a a few buttons and last target was a sweet silver luckenbooth brooch. I called it a day as it was getting late. I returned today started out with another musket ball. nabbed another copper which is a hibernia. then i dug a a button signal and out popped a clipped thin copper. didn't think much of it and put in in my case. When I got home and started cleaning my finds I saw a shield but it looked thinner and more narrow than your typical NJ copper. I sent a few messages to some colonial copper experts on facebook and got the good news. super rare only 10-12 known Maris 83-ii Rarity 7 which is amazing. boat loads rarer than my AMERI. reversed Chain cent. View attachment 2113510 View attachment 2113511 View attachment 2113512 View attachment 2113513 View attachment 2113514 View attachment 2113515 View attachment 2113516 What a day!!!!!!!!! View attachment 2113850 View attachment 2113851

Congrats on some really great finds!

 

[cannonball]

OUTSTANDING !!!!

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

First of all, congrats on a truly incredible find. I recently dug a hard times token, circa 1833, in similar condition to your Jersey Copper. I always have such a hardtime getting toasty coppers to clean up without destroying them. May I enquire about your cleaning process on this?

With a rare piece like that, I would reccomend you submit to NGC and have it professionaly conserved and encapsulated. Again, congrats on such a rare and interesting find.

Thanks! I seen some horror story coins they were sent in to be "conserved" The end results were far worse than before they were sent in .

 

[Fugio]

Thanks! I seen some horror story coins they were sent in to be "conserved" The end results were far worse than before they were sent in .

Never heard that! I retract my initial "advice" then haha.

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

Never heard that! I retract my initial "advice" then haha.

lol. I think I did a better job conserving it that they may have done