average depth of Spanish ship wrecks

[mariner]

Are all of these so-called long-range locators scams?

There is one called "Vectra Trek" made by a guy in Oregon called Fitzgerald and advertized on the T-Net site. A couple of years ago, I spoke to a company who claimed to have used this device to find a substantial treasure cache in the Bahamas or Bermuda, I can't remember which, and they swore it was true.

I have a friend who bought the equipment, after being given a demonstration similar to that in the clip, but then never found anything with it.

Anybody have any experience of this particular product, or information about it?

Mariner

 

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[mariner]

SWR,

Thanks for the link. I am very skeptical about the ability of these LRL boxes to detect or excite molecular vibrations in buried objects, but I have personal experience of a water dowser detecting an underwater (20 feet under) stream on a property I had in Canada in teh 1970s. We dud a well and bingo, there it was. First time.

I am surprised that Carl, on his website, is so dismissive of the whole idea of dowsing, and not just the pseudo science gadgets.

Mariner

 

[Carl-NC]

I am surprised that Carl, on his website, is so dismissive of the whole idea of dowsing, and not just the pseudo science gadgets.

I've tested dowsers, and none of them could do what they thought they could do. Try digging a well and NOT hitting water... it's harder than you think.

- Carl

 

[mariner]

Carl,

Probably a good answer.

Mariner

 

[Polart]

Hi SWR,

Would you please PM me also with the video?
Thanks a lot.

Here, I will host it on my domain for a short period of time. That will ease the strain on TreasureNet's server(s) and such:

http://www.shallowwaterrecovery.com/TreasureTracker.wmv

Thanks!
By the way, nice site.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I've still have the Treasure Tracker video.

Like walking down memory lane

Thanks for the old video. Being an honest person myself, its hard to imagine scammers exist like this man, but they are out there trying to steal your money.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I am surprised that Carl, on his website, is so dismissive of the whole idea of dowsing, and not just the pseudo science gadgets.

I've tested dowsers, and none of them could do what they thought they could do. Try digging a well and NOT hitting water... it's harder than you think.

- Carl

I remember you offered a $25,000 reward for an LRL that worked better than chance, but no one could claim it.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Common sense and logic alone dictates that Carl's, challenge is not applicable to Treasure Hunting. It's criteria is based on the assumption that everyone has the ability to chance guess a correct location 50% of the time.

Since Carl, and his followers promote this human ability with their so called challenge one might assume that Carl, has this ability to accurately guess the location of a buried 300 year old Treasure trove, within a square mile of rough terrain, Or, accurately locate a chest of shipwreck Gold, that is contained within one square mile of ocean?

I admit that I am unable to repeatably GUESS a buried Treasure location anywhere, even 1% of the time, let alone be able to consistently random guess a location 70% of the time in repeated tests.

It's beyond my imagination that I have the ability to accurately GUESS the location of a major buried treasure trove, or Shipwreck treasure even 40% of the time, and recover $millions$ from every secondor third hole I dig as Carl, and his tests implies.

Personally, i am skeptical that Carl himself, has the ability to accurately GUESS the location of buried Treasure trove below land, or ocean 50% of the time, and I would like to see him prove this ability he seems to imply that everyone has.

I view the so called $25,000 Challenge as an un-winable. impractical, public deception. A publicity gimmick to promote Carl, and the skeptic agenda.
Dell

It obvious that Carl knows electronics and he says these LRL's are electronic bs and I believe him.

Now thats not to say that I dont believe in the hidden powers of the human mind, such as the talent you may possess yourself. But to make an electronic device to locate metal at such long ranges is impossible and CaRL has proven again and again on his website by taking these instruments apart and studying the electronics. Often the electronics are not even properly connected or not connected at all.

Carl doesnt need a gimmick to promote himself.

Dont you understand Dell, an electronic device must work all the time? What kind of detector would that be if it beeped on iron only 1 percent of the time? http://www.geotech1.com/cgi-bin/pages/common/index.pl?page=lrl&file=reward.dat

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Its been a very long time I will have to look at his challenge again. I believe he set it up where he hid the treasure under cup A or B and a person could guess right 50 percent of the time by chance. He required that the LRL operator needed to be right more than chance to take the money but allowed for a few mistakes. I thought it was fair.

Carl never claimed that he could do better. His claim is that the LRLs cannot locate treasure at 1 inch let alone at long range. If he buys a contraption, opens it, and the wires are not even connected, then he can conclude that it wont work lol.

As far as yourself, Dell, I am not calling you a liar. You may have special talent. I believe the ability to locate Treasure from dowsing comes from the operator and cannot be packaged and sold into an electronic gizmo. Maybe some dowsing rods work better than others. I was just commenting on electronic LRLs ability to locate metal.

I would be glad to hear more about your finds.


ADDED: I notice you have a website. I will look at it. Thanks..

I am just stating my opinion "in general" about LRL's and I am not at all familiar with your product and I have made no specific mention of it. I will have to read up on it when I get time..

 

[Carl-NC]

Folks, there is no need to travel this road again, we've been down it enough. I have a well-established and well-documented view of these products, and some people have a vested interest in discrediting my findings in any way possible. Not a problem, and it ain't gonna change with another debate. Folks can look for themselves and figure things out, sometimes before spending $5000, sometimes after.

- Carl

 

[gldhntr]

when exactly might one expect a full refund in the mail on the so called treasure tracker ? since it seems to be public knowledge they don't now nor ever worked.....just curious

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

when exactly might one expect a full refund in the mail on the so called treasure tracker ? since it seems to be public knowledge they don't now nor ever worked.....just curious

LOL You have a great sense of humor. I believe you were one of their first clients. I also seem to remember you supporting them.

 

[tom yerian]

That is exactly true. Most wrecks that are known of wrecking are from hitting the rocks, and are not much depth..

So grab your scuba gear

Not quite correct. The Spanish were noted for their greed, and they loaded all they could on their badly deteriorating treasure ships. Many, were swamped in deep water due to overloading, and poorly maintained condition of their fleet vessels......Tom

 

[gldhntr]

'''LOL You have a great sense of humor. I believe you were one of their first clients. I also seem to remember you supporting them'''

yeah i am a barrel of laughs ...and yes i was....i also supported to a point....i supported what i saw with my own two eyes, which was a generator bought from another person, used in conjunction with who knows what which was called the treasure tracker..as far as my letter of recommendation to their website, #1 it was not printed as it was written/sent..all the misspellings on it that were constant throughout the website should have raised eyebrows..#2 as a certain pretty good fellow at his expense {which i am sure has never been reimbursed} sent a couple here to do surveys, the result of which was the possible locating of unobtainable treasure *{see below}, i felt like i owed them to some degree, sans the letter of rec...if i could have rescinded the letter a bit later i would have..believe me.......i do not now, nor ever did, support the equipment {if you could call it that}, that was portrayed to be the treasure tracker to those of us unlucky enough to have had the $ to ask to purchase one....point in fact, a crude 30 dollar non working replica of someone elses generator unit {described on the website mentioned by someone above}, sold/leased/whatever for 3-4 times the amount one could have went to the source and bought an actual one for, and calling it treasure tracker, is not what i term an honest deal.....not to the purchaser/leasor/whatever, and not to the fellow who actually built the generator {FYI the generator builder had no knowledge of the copycat units being built/sold/leased under the name treasure tracker and i am quite certain he had nothing at all to do with them either}...
*now to add a bit about what was actually located..one area i located through many years of research and knew exact cache spots and more or less what was there, i had them survey..yes they hit on a few things there with the treasure tracker..yes they verified findings with 3 other types eq if i remember correctly..a pulse unit, an em83 or something, and a walkabout unit...since these surveys i have had 4 other people, using no less than 11 different type locators {none of the hocus pocus bull}, and each found same targets at same spots...one of these surveys was done with a unit used by governmental agencies in locating buried people/arms/etc and shows a much better picture of whats beneath the soil than all of the above mentioned eq....so, i can say in retrospect, they verified something i knew, although unless in the dark of night will never be able to prove..at least i was able to close the book on that one and move on.........
on another researched area the tracker hit on nothing but *small minute gold particles*...since these surveys were done a number of very large holes have mysteriously appeared throughout the area, one even being a grave dated 1817...i do not know for certain if gophers are now digging 3ft by 4 ft holes 4-5 ft deep, nor if they are digging 10 ft by 12 ft holes 10 feet deep, using shovels and drinking citrus sodas, but it must be as this area is, or was, only known by none....maybe the gophers sensed the minute gold particles or something, i do not know......
on a sidenote, just to let you know, after the holes started appearing, and i got the blame as i was the person with permission, the property owner posted the property and told me not to come back, no interest in my protest of innocence ...i did though, one last time..in the dark of night like on a creepy crawly mission i snuck my way back to the grave the gopher dug and refilled it, resetting the tombstone in its proper position, picked up the elcheapo citrus soda bottles and left...it was the least i could do in leu of rectifying a problem i did not do but most definatly caused....
and another thing is that i learned very well at much expense what will work, what will not work, and who to trust....if portrayed as a miracle, it will not work...if portrayed as a decent detector and backed with scientific proof it will work, to a point....and trust nearly no one...should have learned that one sooner...one should be careful about where and when he wears a hat with padre island on it.. .....what comes around goes around...............gldhntr

 

[bucketofguts]

what do you call a purveyor of snake oil................

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

...since these surveys were done a number of very large holes have mysteriously appeared throughout the area, one even being a grave dated 1817...i do not know for certain if gophers are now digging 3ft by 4 ft holes 4-5 ft deep, nor if they are digging 10 ft by 12 ft holes 10 feet deep, using shovels and drinking citrus sodas, but it must be as this area is, or was, only known by none....maybe the gophers sensed the minute gold particles or something, i do not know......
on a sidenote, just to let you know, after the holes started appearing, and i got the blame as i was the person with permission, the property owner posted the property and told me not to come back, no interest in my protest of innocence ...i did though, one last time..in the dark of night like on a creepy crawly mission i snuck my way back to the grave the gopher dug and refilled it, resetting the tombstone in its proper position, picked up the elcheapo citrus soda bottles and left...it was the least i could do in leu of rectifying a problem i did not do but most definatly caused....
and another thing is that i learned very well at much expense what will work, what will not work, and who to trust....if portrayed as a miracle, it will not work...if portrayed as a decent detector and backed with scientific proof it will work, to a point....and trust nearly no one...should have learned that one sooner...one should be careful about where and when he wears a hat with padre island on it.. .....what comes around goes around...............gldhntr

I had a feeling something like that would happen. Its a shame but lurkers will scan Treasurenet looking for tips with the sole purpose of making midnight raids. Unfortunately we must be careful of what we post on here. It was a long time ago but I remember the gravesite story and the hiring of the Treasure Tracker. Thank you for updating.

 

[armchairQB30]

Lets just say that I invented a product that could detect gold from a one mile distance;

I would never tell anyone about it...WHY? Where is the greater payoff? In finding the gold or selling the gold finder?

I would not make any drawings. (hello reverse engineering)

I would not patent anything. ( Patents mean nothing in the US or international)

I would simply lead my life and offer my services to folks needing my help for 50% of the take. ( Seed money)

I would then hire a team of researchers and lawyers to start on my own projects. ( Let the fun begin)

If there is a trace element or something in the properties of gold that makes it detectable from a distance....... this would flood the market with gold and drive the price down.

I would like to see a case study or proof that it works by allowing a 1715 treasure boat to try it. What will it hurt?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Lets just say that I invented a product that could detect gold from a one mile distance;

I would never tell anyone about it...WHY? Where is the greater payoff? In finding the gold or selling the gold finder?

I would not make any drawings. (hello reverse engineering)

I would not patent anything. ( Patents mean nothing in the US or international)

I would simply lead my life and offer my services to folks needing my help for 50% of the take. ( Seed money)

I would then hire a team of researchers and lawyers to start on my own projects. ( Let the fun begin)

If there is a trace element or something in the properties of gold that makes it detectable from a distance....... this would flood the market with gold and drive the price down.

I would like to see a case study or proof that it works by allowing a 1715 treasure boat to try it. What will it hurt?

Hello armchair. This is similar to what the owner was doing. He was not selling it but wanted a percentage of what he found and charged a fee. He never found anything, unless by chance, but he traveled around at others expense. Carl from the Carolinas offered him $25,000 if he could pass a few simple tests. All they did was bicker back and forth. It was a fraud from the get go. Much has been deleted from this old post.

 

[armchairQB30]

Big Cypress,

Sorry for adding my comments so late into the thread. I still think that a trip to Florida on the coast would put the final concept to rest. Maybe he is already here.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Big Cypress,

Sorry for adding my comments so late into the thread. I still think that a trip to Florida on the coast would put the final concept to rest. Maybe he is already here.

No need to be sorry, but its already been put to rest when the owner has admitted it was a fraud all along.

One of the Colorado boys openly admitted that this was a fraud but I see now that it has been deleted.

It was somewhere before reply #88 where gldhntr asked for a refund. I thought it was very honorable for him to admit to it years later but I guess he had to pull his posts in fear of lawsuits and I didnt save it. In defense, he said he was taken in by the fraud himself as well.

when exactly might one expect a full refund in the mail on the so called treasure tracker ? since it seems to be public knowledge they don't now nor ever worked.....just curious