Button Experts

[Bigcypresshunter]

I bought a tin of 300 buttons, mostly WWI Great Seal buttons for under .05 ea. and mixed in I found these 2 undug General Staff buttons. The one on the left is 3 piece, the right is 2 piece. Different wings and shields. No backmarks. Steel or tin backs.

Could they be old with these type backs?

Sorry about the pics I took at nite with the flash on.

 

[kyphote]

These are post-CW backs. With CW buttons you'd either find a wire shank soldered into place or, if solder was unavailable, workers simply inserted a wire into holes in the back, and bent the ends to create a shank.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

These are post-CW backs. With CW buttons you'd either find a wire shank soldered into place or, if solder was unavailable, workers simply inserted a wire into holes in the back, and bent the ends to create a shank.

Can you put a date to them?

Are they CW reproductions?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Could the 3 piece be an Indian Wars era button?

I think the second button is a reenactors repro.

 

[BioProfessor]

The 3-piece is a much better quality button. As far as a date of use, without a backmark it's a crapshoot. I would say more modern than the Indian wars. It may still be a reenactor's button as the number of stars on the shield would be about right for that type button.

Daryl

 

[kyphote]

Not sure. Last week I received a box of what I was told were WWI era buttons. A few of the buttons are exactly as you depict. I'd be interested in what others say as I haven't had time to research. If I had to guess, I'd say they're post Indian Wars. 1910 or later.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Thanks kyphote and thanks professor.

Does anybody know what date they stopped using these muffin type staff buttons?

Or does anybody know how early they used these almost hopper looking backs? I dont know what they are called.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

The 3-piece is a much better quality button. As far as a date of use, without a backmark it's a crapshoot. I would say more modern than the Indian wars. It may still be a reenactor's button as the number of stars on the shield would be about right for that type button.

Daryl

I looked with a loupe and...

the 3-piece button appears to have 7 stars on the shield.

the cheaper made 2-piece button has 13 stars on the shield.

 

[BioProfessor]

7 stars is pretty much on target for Indian Wars buttons. It's the "no shank" that's the issue.

I think I will stick with a repro for Indian Wars.

Daryl

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

7 stars is pretty much on target for Indian Wars buttons. It's the "no shank" that's the issue.

I think I will stick with a repro for Indian Wars.

Daryl

Really. Ah OK.

Heres a link for reenactor buttons and it doesnt match. Theirs has no stars. Civil War Buttons for Reenacting , Fall Creek Suttlery - LDS

Im still searching...

 

[BioProfessor]

Here' one that does.

Daryl

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Here' one that does.

Daryl

Thanks Daryl. Looks like a match. Is it real?? Does it show the back can you show the link?

 

[BioProfessor]

Nope, this one is real. Backmark is Horstmann, Philadelphia. Has normal shank.

Daryl

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Its a dead on match.

 

[BioProfessor]

Yep but the back is like that of a repro. It's a quality button. You can tell that from the edge roll. Just the wrong way of attachment for a period button.

Daryl

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Yep but the back is like that of a repro. It's a quality button. You can tell that from the edge roll. Just the wrong way of attachment for a period button.

Daryl

If anyone can tell me when this type of attachment was first used, I would be satisfied.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Not sure. Last week I received a box of what I was told were WWI era buttons. A few of the buttons are exactly as you depict. I'd be interested in what others say as I haven't had time to research. If I had to guess, I'd say they're post Indian Wars. 1910 or later.

Great Seal buttons were out in 1909. Were these used in WWI?

 

[BioProfessor]

Shankless buttons were patented in 1938 if that helps.

Daryl

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Shankless buttons were patented in 1938 if that helps.

Daryl

Yes it helps.

 

[vayank54]

The type of shank on the buttons is called a self shank. I don't know when they start using them but it was no earlier than 1900. Both are staff button but post Indian war.