Carbon dating puts Sask. Indigenous archaeological site at almost 11,000 years old

[Fred250]

Short video of site embedded in article worth a look.

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7448980

 

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[GirlWithWolf]

Thanks for sharing this, it was an interesting article and video. I’m glad to see the FN working with them to learn more.

I might not be understanding the timeline correctly, but one question it brings up in my mind is what does that say about the end of the ice age, which was apparently 10,000 years ago? I read to confirm that, so if it is the case, are they saying they were there during the ice age for a thousand years? Or has the end of the ice age been miscalculated?

 

[Fred250]

It’s a good question and what makes this a surprising discovery. It appears if the timeline on glacial retreat is right they settled that spot as soon as the ice was gone and at least this group was not as nomadic as we thought. It appears the natives assertion of “We have always been here” is correct.

 

[GirlWithWolf]

It’s a good question and what makes this a surprising discovery. It appears if the timeline on glacial retreat is right they settled that spot as soon as the ice was gone and at least this group was not as nomadic as we thought. It appears the natives assertion of “We have always been here” is correct.

Thanks! It is interesting and I hope together they can find more. The part about them not being as nomadic as assumed was very interesting. As that article said it’s going to take a lot more, because maybe they were semi permanently there, or they could have just been returning to that river every 100 years.

 

[releventchair]

Thanks! It is interesting and I hope together they can find more. The part about them not being as nomadic as assumed was very interesting. As that article said it’s going to take a lot more, because maybe they were semi permanently there, or they could have just been returning to that river every 100 years.

A camp for sure.
Amount of time occupied within a given year or decade or eon.... Wants more investigation.

But I'll go with the elders for now and acknowledge it being a convenient site for big game during season.

Farther South here were repeated ice periods of advance and retreat over time.
Riverine areas invited traffic of multiple kinds. As would new greenery.
This site and picture tell of a river. Which suits the theory of traffic.
Was the river a glacial scour prior?
The layers of dark sediment are thin. Loam on mineral soil type thin. In between shows either glacial plowed sand? Or erosion and flood driven sand?
Someone with far more experience than I understands it.
But flooding or unyielding deep ice creeping isn't conductive to camping.

IF common spring run off type activity post glacial periods it may have flushed with tender growth each year with sediment besides sand feeding the plants.
Greater mineral content for plant eaters.
Maybe even traces of salt .
Buffalo meant what for browse?
And did the type buffalo respond to fired short grass prairie and native vantage? Or was the diet different?
Research should determine forest and plant succession of the time of the charcoal extracted from hearth.
Yes buffalo crossed the river there.
Why?

Wood Bison- (Buffalo)

Challenges faced by the Wood Bison that led to their decline, including winters and predator dynamics. Wood Bison vs Plains Bison

allaboutbison.com

 

[Fred250]

A camp for sure.
Amount of time occupied within a given year or decade or eon.... Wants more investigation.

But I'll go with the elders for now and acknowledge it being a convenient site for big game during season.

Farther South here were repeated ice periods of advance and retreat over time.
Riverine areas invited traffic of multiple kinds. As would new greenery.
This site and picture tell of a river. Which suits the theory of traffic.
Was the river a glacial scour prior?
The layers of dark sediment are thin. Loam on mineral soil type thin. In between shows either glacial plowed sand? Or erosion and flood driven sand?
Someone with far more experience than I understands it.
But flooding or unyielding deep ice creeping isn't conductive to camping.

IF common spring run off type activity post glacial periods it may have flushed with tender growth each year with sediment besides sand feeding the plants.
Greater mineral content for plant eaters.
Maybe even traces of salt .
Buffalo meant what for browse?
And did the type buffalo respond to fired short grass prairie and native vantage? Or was the diet different?
Research should determine forest and plant succession of the time of the charcoal extracted from hearth.
Yes buffalo crossed the river there.
Why?

Wood Bison- (Buffalo)

Challenges faced by the Wood Bison that led to their decline, including winters and predator dynamics. Wood Bison vs Plains Bison

allaboutbison.com

Gonna take some time to digest and process this one. I swear I read on here somewhere the theory that they would live near or on top of the glaciers in the summer to cut down on the bug nuisance? It wouldn’t seem like a good idea to live along a river near a glacier in the spring.

 

[newnan man]

If the area of charcoal is extensive it could be from an ancient forest fire.

 

[releventchair]

Gonna take some time to digest and process this one. I swear I read on here somewhere the theory that they would live near or on top of the glaciers in the summer to cut down on the bug nuisance? It wouldn’t seem like a good idea to live along a river near a glacier in the spring.

Cariboo sometimes lay on snow pack remnants. Warm coats and bugs to deal with.

A breeze wins when bugs are busy.
Heat rises in morning and sinks at night on calm thermal patterns.

A point of land with water around much of it often won for a site to tent when we fished North. Till dark when the horde of teeth descended. Best to be under fabric then.

Sites with water often win.
Splits or forks or where a feeder joins did too. Putting water two sides of camp.
A more local site I didn't inquire about sign of prior use was called a hogback ridge on a river.
Floaters on tubes or whatever launched on one side and got out on the other side 45 minutes average later. And only a short distance across.

 

[Lone Star]

Thanks for sharing this, it was an interesting article and video. I’m glad to see the FN working with them to learn more.

I might not be understanding the timeline correctly, but one question it brings up in my mind is what does that say about the end of the ice age, which was apparently 10,000 years ago? I read to confirm that, so if it is the case, are they saying they were there during the ice age for a thousand years? Or has the end of the ice age been miscalculated?

The glacial maximum in the Artic region ended about 24,000 years ago. Earth was warming bit by bit until The Younger Dryas cooling came around, but it ended about 11,700 years ago. Theories abound as to what caused the YD cooling period. Graham Hancock thinks it was caused by a large meteor that hit the 2 KM thick North American Ice sheet in mid Canada. This caused continent wide floods and changed much of the landscape and rivers.

 

[newnan man]

The glacial maximum in the Artic region ended about 24,000 years ago. Earth was warming bit by bit until The Younger Dryas cooling came around, but it ended about 11,700 years ago. Theories abound as to what caused the YD cooling period. Graham Hancock thinks it was caused by a large meteor that hit the 2 KM thick North American Ice sheet in mid Canada. This caused continent wide floods and changed much of the landscape and rivers.

Research by several scientists seems to confirm the impact theory.

 

[GirlWithWolf]

The glacial maximum in the Artic region ended about 24,000 years ago. Earth was warming bit by bit until The Younger Dryas cooling came around, but it ended about 11,700 years ago. Theories abound as to what caused the YD cooling period. Graham Hancock thinks it was caused by a large meteor that hit the 2 KM thick North American Ice sheet in mid Canada. This caused continent wide floods and changed much of the landscape and rivers.

Interesting. Now there’s one more thing added to my summer reading list.

 

[newnan man]

Randal Carlson is a big advocate of the Younger Dryas Impact Theory. He backs up his statements with factual data.He also has dozens of videos on YouTube. He and Graham Hancock are on a Joe Rogan podcast together talking about this (Younger Dryas) and it is one of the best, most interesting podcasts I've ever listened to. It is on YouTube as well.

 

[GirlWithWolf]

Randal Carlson is a big advocate of the Younger Dryas Impact Theory. He backs up his statements with factual data.He also has dozens of videos on YouTube. He and Graham Hancock are on a Joe Rogan podcast together talking about this (Younger Dryas) and it is one of the best, most interesting podcasts I've ever listened to. It is on YouTube as well.

Awesome, thanks for sharing that. I’ll check it out. I’ve watched his podcast a few times when it deals with space or things like Area 51.

 

[ToddsPoint]

Randal Carlson is a very interesting dude. He reminds me a lot of archaeologist Mike Gramly. I was just reading about Crowleys Ridge in MO and AR. It’s a huge gravel bar along the Mississippi River. Miles long. The result of a huge flooding event. The ridge contains Lake Superior agate that was moved that far south. The younger dryas was part of a huge cataclysmic event that caused the extinction of so much of the N American megafauna. And the extinction of the Clovis culture as well.

 

[Lone Star]

Randal Carlson is a big advocate of the Younger Dryas Impact Theory. He backs up his statements with factual data.He also has dozens of videos on YouTube. He and Graham Hancock are on a Joe Rogan podcast together talking about this (Younger Dryas) and it is one of the best, most interesting podcasts I've ever listened to. It is on YouTube as well.

Yes that's right. The two of them together make a hell of a tag team when talking about a subject.

 

[RGINN]

It’s a good question and what makes this a surprising discovery. It appears if the timeline on glacial retreat is right they settled that spot as soon as the ice was gone and at least this group was not as nomadic as we thought. It appears the natives assertion of “We have always been here” is correct.

I like that "We have always been here". Old people tell us that, they tell us that in their stories, and you don't argue with those elders.

 

[Fred250]

I imagine now that these topics are becoming pop culture there will be increased funding looking for older sites. We should be in for some awesome discoveries. Highly recommend the story of The Boneyard Alaska, John Reeves the owner of it also has been onJoe Rogan.

 

[GirlWithWolf]

I like that "We have always been here". Old people tell us that, they tell us that in their stories, and you don't argue with those elders.

Maybe they know more than we give them credit for. Certainly can’t argue it is like trying to swim up a waterfall.

I imagine now that these topics are becoming pop culture there will be increased funding looking for older sites. We should be in for some awesome discoveries. Highly recommend the story of The Boneyard Alaska, John Reeves the owner of it also has been onJoe Rogan.

Thanks for this, I’ll check it out.

 

[RGINN]

One thing mentioned about living on or near the top of glaciers in summer. Pretty simple, it's warmer there. You get all the sun, and at night cold air settles in the valley. Same reason I try not to camp near a river or creek in winter. 500 ft. up in the Aransas River Valley and I can gain 6 or 7 degrees. Doesn't sound like much, but it does make a little difference at night.