Closer to rewriting history?

[1320]

If someone where to post a picture in this forum of the artifact shown in the article, I have no doubt it would be labeled a "rock" lol. And I'd probably agree.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...ve-discovery-mexico-double-peopling-americas/

 

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[Fred250]

Seems like the pro’s have the same endless argument we have on here. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Garscale]

Can some one post a pic?. Link requires a subscription.

 

[uniface]

https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2020/07/...arlier-than-we-thought-new-research-suggests/

The usual song and dance -- selective definitions of "acceptable evidence/proof." Aka, "saving the paradigm." Same stunt as at Calico and elsewhere.

What they leave out of their debunking operation is that the record consistently shows that MANY occupiers OF US SITES previous to (guesstimate from memory) 20k years ago did not have lithic-based technologies. So positing the assumption that they should find one there, and debunking it because they didn't, is transparently dishonest -- a variation on the straw man ploy.

Early mammoth scavangings show only large broken stones used as cleavers for dismembering carcasses. Cutting utensils (and projectile points) were of bone.

CAPS = edit for precision

 

[uniface]

re. two of the three flakes shown, bulbs of percussion (diagnostic of human production) plus edge wear = ad hoc tools.

Dismounting soapbox now before going ballistic.

 

[Charl]

Can some one post a pic?. Link requires a subscription.

Yes, this article has a photo of the “point”

https://www.nbcnews.com/science/sci...ople-arrived-america-earlier-thought-n1234578

And a photo from the Nat. Geo. article, the “point” in lower right...



Regarding the above lithics, the authors state that most come from Component SC-B, with dates of 16,605-15,615 cal, and 13,705-12,200 cal.

I was also able to use Sci-Hub to unlock one of the two Nature papers published today:

https://sci-hub.tw/downloads/2020-07-22/59/10.1038@s41586-020-2491-6.pdf

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

"The stones that the researchers believe are tools fashioned by human hands have come under particular scrutiny. While the researchers demonstrated that the stone came from outside the cave, some experts question whether they are actual human artifacts or were created by natural geological processes".

"Loren Davis, the Oregon State archaeologist who directs excavations at the early site of Cooper’s Ferry in Idaho, points out that cave environments also create plenty of naturally fractured stones that can be misinterpreted as artifacts.
“The thing to remember,” says Davis, “is that humans don’t have a monopoly on the physics required to break rocks.”

He’s also troubled by the lack of other signs of human occupation in the cave deposits, such as hearths and animal bones bearing cut marks.

“You can have a big list of all the things you might expect to see in a site, and [the Chiquihuite researchers] don't have anything except for some broken rock,” Davis says. “And if you take the rocks away, there’s really nothing.” While he calls the research “intriguing,” he’s reserving judgment."

 

[uniface]

While the researchers demonstrated that the stone came from outside the cave . . .

The implication being that peoople found them already broken (which kills the roof-fall mechanism they were invoking), carried them into the cave, and left them there after using them.

If those were key elements of a prosecution in criminal court, it would be thrown out as absurd and the DA subpoena'd to (Desi Artnez voice) Do some 'splainin'

Charl: Thanks for liberating the images !!!!!!!!!

 

[uniface]

Images : Isolated striking platform . . . charcoal in direct association (far back inside a cave !) . . .

Case closed.

 

[unclemac]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early...ss Europe,and 210,000 years old respectively.

interesting read to get a more global picture of Sapiens sapiens expansion. It suggests that competition with other homo species may have slowed expansion in certain area (like Europe). And it just struck me that rapid expansion east through coastal Asia (and perhaps eventually the Americas) may have been spurred on (pushed forward) by previous populations objecting to new arrivals. If the Americas had no prior homo species to compete with perhaps early discovery may have been like the weather...a high pressure front blowing into a low pressure area.

 

[uniface]

If the Americas had no prior homo species to compete with

Or previous inhabitants had perished. Or moved to more hospitable locales.

 

[Charl]

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02137-3

 

[unclemac]

what we really need is bones, teeth and DNA. Charcoal and chipped rocks found in strata only go so far. And as the bones are found the more we will know. Clovis first may be under siege but at least it has a lot evidence in multiple avenues as a real continent wide culture.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...als-complex-migrations-first-americans/#close

Since Clovis is associated with the opening of the ice free corridor perhaps this was the first flood of new arrivals following the mega fauna, where as earlier migrations were more of a trickle following the coast line. Of course most of that evidence is long under water as sea levels rose significantly.