Cynics, anyone?

[Old Town]

I like to look at Faith Hill. It's her music I hate. Country and Rap. Two horrible all-American music forms.

OT

 

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[DigginThePast]

OT - The problem that I have is that some have seen the unexplainable yet can not do anything to prove it. When/if this has happened to you, then you start to look at the other things in a different light. That is not to say that others should blindly follow/believe any specific incident, but perhaps keep an open mind.

Science is to fluid for me to look at as black and white.

So to answer your question. We are not on common ground on this subject but you can only base your opinion on your experiences.

P.S. - You can hit the mute button when Faith Hill comes on.

P.P.S. - Ever pray to God when hungover?

 

[Old Town]

Diggin, when that hungover I beg to die, not pray. But I dig your pain. LOL

OT

 

[DigginThePast]

Diggin, when that hungover I beg to die, not pray. But I dig your pain. LOL

OT

 

[packerbacker]

Being incapable of faith or believing is actually a shortcoming of sorts. If all one can believe in is what they can see they are not capable of creative thought or independent thinking. Not too long ago in human existence, walking on the moon would have been thought to be "majic" or a "miracle". Sailing around the world would not have been attempted; open heart surgery would have been "witchcraft", no phones, no tv's, no cars, no medicine, no nothing; just some caveman wondering why the sticks get warm when rubbed together and his buddies laughing at him saying it was impossible.
I don't really believe in divining rods myself but I do know they work! I've seen it and done it. Still have trouble walking on water though. I'd have to be put in the "I believe in some things I don't understand" category I guess.

 

[Michaelangelo]

Well said packerbacker!!

 

[godisnum1]

Bran said we all have faith to some degree. This I wholeheartedly disagree with. Chairs holding my fat behind notwithstanding.

Old Town

As I wasn't trying to be disagreeable or argumentative by any means, only take part in your discussion... I understand that we have contrasting views, so I'll refrain from sharing anymore of my opinions on your thread.

Bran <><

 

[Old Town]

Bran, should not have singled you out. I meant nothing personal. All, so far, feel as you do, I only used your example and assigned your name because you used the phrase first.

Such defensiveness of religion is not what I'm after on this topic. No need for it.

OT

 

[packerbacker]

One "fact" I've said before really tugs at my earthly understanding of the laws of science is, as Jeff stated, an unending space or, if you will, infinity. Even if there were bricks at the end of outer space, then where do the bricks end? and so on, and so on, and.........
If you have no faith in anything then you would have to choose to just ignore that fact because there are no Newton's laws to explain that one for you. Not saying it's a miracle and I'm not saying it's magic but I am saying there isn't one scientist on the planet that can even theorize on the phenomenon.

 

[Old Town]

packerbacker, you raise a good issue with the space thing and does it have an "end". Have always wondered about this. But just because I wonder and do not have an answer is no reason to automatically grasp at god and what the Bible might say or infer. You didn't really say that - look to god. But many do this the first time they run into a subject they do not understand.

I do not need to know why flowers are so lovely or the origin of the night stars. I only appreciate the flower and look longingly at the stars. I'm not a navel-gazer. I don't over-think things and do not need all the answers.

OT

 

[bigscoop]

packerbacker, you raise a good issue with the space thing and does it have an "end". Have always wondered about this. But just because I wonder and do not have an answer is no reason to automatically grasp at god and what the Bible might say or infer. You didn't really say that - look to god. But many do this the first time they run into a subject they do not understand.

I do not need to know why flowers are so lovely or the origin of the night stars. I only appreciate the flower and look longingly at the stars. I'm not a navel-gazer. I don't over-think things and do not need all the answers.

OT

OT, sounds to me like you're not understanding why people believe in things that can't be, or have not been, proven to be fact. Is this a fair assessment? Or am I over-thinking things?

 

[Old Town]

scoop, I think I know why people believe in the far-fetched. It has to do with "need". It's a very human emotion or desire to understand that which is around you but lacks clear definition. I simple do not have this innate ability to conjure up fanciful reasons for complex problems we see in our environment. Problems or happenings that might appear magical or beyond reason. Many attribute this stuff to their made-up god. God can get it done when no other explanation fits. He's very handy at such times. This, I believe, is his chief reason for existing in person's minds.

When not turning to god, we turn to aliens and outer space beings. The list goes on and on and it all comes down to a human need of answers. These "answers" are not a need of mine. I don't ask the questions in the first place.

Now isn't it funny that not one poster, except maybe Beep, has answered this question in a yes or no manner. This was all I wanted in the first place. Yes, you are a believer in the fanciful, or No, you are not. Not one person has said NO (except me) and nobody has really understood the question. Very interesting and indicative of the need to explain our "needs". I said all along we human's are needy animals. Hence religion and Bigfoot and space ships by the hundreds.


OT

 

[The Beep Goes On]

Many people are asking these questions. Our most advanced scientific research facilities are looking for things we're not even sure exist while basing our calculations on a model that only approximates reality. Newtonian mechanics was more cause and effect but relativity and quantum mechanics have brought science full circle back into the mysterious. Most scientists can't agree on the basic principles governing everything around us - right in front of our face.

Like you, I do not feel the need to cage myself, or obfuscate reality, through fantasy. Once the knowns and unknowns are delineated, there is no harm in finding the wonder of the unknown, undefined and mysterious as long as you avoid delusion. I do not try to force reality into my beliefs. My interest, for instance, in UFO's is that it represents the mysterious all around us and is an interesting subject. Do I base any practical thought or action based on my non-position concernig UFO's? No. It's all good if you keep a balanced, objective perspective. Can I do that? No, not all the time, but I prefer it over missing what I think is the most important part of life.

 

[bigscoop]

OT,
I've said it in these forums many times, to me, "If it hasn't been proven by conclusive and undisputed proof, then it's just another theory." So I'll have to answer, "No".....I am not a believer in such things.

 

[The Beep Goes On]

The logical conclusion to this perspective is that nothing is real. Basically, all you know is cogito ergo sum. Since everything you perceive is second-hand information transmitted to your brain through electrical impulses, you really have no direct contact with reality. Personally, I like 'I think, therefore I and the universe are'. I can't even prove that the universe will still be here without me. A step closer to reality and we still can't peg down anything definitive. Matter, time, energy...all mixed up in ways we theoretically know about and ways we probably can't even imagine. There are no absolutes, but we should avail ourselves of the benefits of being human while we are here.

 

[Old Town]

" Be human while we are here." I'll drink heavily to this and go find a willing female of no inhibitions. This is all the reality I can stand or even want.

OT

 

[CrazySlasher]

Why would a race of extraterrestrial beings advanced enough to circumnavigate the universe come to this planet and hover around doing nothing? To monitor us? I would think that their technology would be so advanced they wouldn't need to come anywhere close to us to know what we're doing. To plan an invasion? For the purpose of what? To harvest our natural resources? I'm sure they know about synthetics and don't need anything we have. To enslave us? We're pretty lazy, I know I am.

Cryptids? Maybe. I live an area called "The Bridgewater Triangle." Smack. Dab. In. The. Middle. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridgewater_Triangle) In 27 years the strangest thing I've seen here is a drunk trying to rob a Salvation Army. Though the idea of some type of unknown creature living at the bottom of the sea or in a remote part of a jungle doesn't seem too far fetched to me.


I would love to believe in some of the things I read or hear about as it would make life just a little bit more interesting, sadly, I just can't.

I also wish I could believe in a higher power. I watched someone who was a man of faith die of cancer 2 months ago. He had no fear, he was at total peace with himself when he died. I fear that one day I will be in that situation and not have the comfort that he did. Though, I hate the word, I would consider myself an Agnostic. I hate self-righteous religious nuts just as much as I hate militant atheists.

 

[The Beep Goes On]

That's the point: "BELIEF NOT REQUIRED"

You can still enjoy the subject matter if you so choose. It is not necessary to exhibit belief or disbelief concerning any topic; there is a middle ground that simply awaits further information...no decision is required. Some think it has to be one way or another.

 

[packerbacker]

I believe I answered your question with my "I believe in some things I don't understand" statement. I didn't want to answer with a simple "yes" because I don't believe aliens are watching me, I don't believe in magic, I don't believe in Bigfoot BUT, I DO believe there is something more going on than our just existing to exist. I'm sure part of that is my human need to believe I won't just cease to exist when I die but that "endless space" offers me real hope.

 

[spartacus53]

That's the point: "BELIEF NOT REQUIRED"

You can still enjoy the subject matter if you so choose. It is not necessary to exhibit belief or disbelief concerning any topic; there is a middle ground that simply awaits further information...no decision is required. Some think it has to be one way or another.

Like beep said above.. I answered this early on by saying keeping an open mind... An open mind is a definitive answer, even if it's open ended.