Glitch with MLRS closed mining claims

[winners58]

check your claims, MLRS has closed some mining clams that didn't update the $ due date when a small miners waver was filed.
reply from BLM
>MLRS completed a process to close out all claims that didn't have the date changed to 9/1/2022. Unfortunately a lot of the claims were inadvertently closed when they shouldn't have been. We are working to figure out which ones those are and correct them, yours being one of them. It will be changed back to active soon. Please let me know if you don't see that change by the end of the day.

 

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[Assembler]

check your claims, MLRS has closed some mining clams that didn't update the $ due date when a small miners waver was filed.
reply from BLM
>MLRS completed a process to close out all claims that didn't have the date changed to 9/1/2022. Unfortunately a lot of the claims were inadvertently closed when they shouldn't have been. We are working to figure out which ones those are and correct them, yours being one of them. It will be changed back to active soon. Please let me know if you don't see that change by the end of the day.

The MLRS files do not effect the "Claim affidavit" filed at the County level "Records".

So if the MLRS files are not up to date still does not effect what is filed with the "County Records".

 

[winners58]

besides contacting the state office I also put in a trouble ticket through MLRS
looks like they have to manually cancel the closure.
reply;
> First, let me apologize for the alarm we caused you in seeing that your claim was closed. This was a error caused by your waiver being erroneously entered as a case action instead of a claim action, which negated the system prompt to advance the next payment due date, and resulted in automated closure of your claim in the system--this requires manual correction by the BLM staff. While we caught the majority of these errors ahead of time, there were a few claims that were missed, and yours happened to be one of them.

 

[Assembler]

besides contacting the state office I also put in a trouble ticket through MLRS
looks like they have to manually cancel the closure.
reply;
> First, let me apologize for the alarm we caused you in seeing that your claim was closed. This was a error caused by your waiver being erroneously entered as a case action instead of a claim action, which negated the system prompt to advance the next payment due date, and resulted in automated closure of your claim in the system--this requires manual correction by the BLM staff. While we caught the majority of these errors ahead of time, there were a few claims that were missed, and yours happened to be one of them.

This will happen most likely more down the road.
Hopefully there is some lesson learn here all around.

 

[Assembler]

This will happen most likely more down the road.
Hopefully there is some lesson learn here all around.

What is a "trouble ticket" except some kind of internal notice for the employers use?

 

[Minerrick1]

Danger Will Robinson (for those of you who know what this means).... I track the MLRS as I have maps of all the active and closed claims and I also weekly go to the recorder's offices of all the counties I track.... and this is a BIG PROBLEM..... a lot of the of the active claims have been "closed" for no apparent reason. At first I was thinking " wow... a gold mine of closed claims...." but then I started cross referencing with my county filings.... and then it dawned on me that there was a really big problem and people who filed their assessments on time were getting their claims closed. If the claim flippers don't recognize the problem before they go out "flipping" they are going to lose a lot of money. I had my eye on some choice locations... but now... not so much..... who knows how long it is going to take to unwind this mess.

 

[Assembler]

Danger Will Robinson (for those of you who know what this means).... I track the MLRS as I have maps of all the active and closed claims and I also weekly go to the recorder's offices of all the counties I track.... and this is a BIG PROBLEM..... I'd be willing to guess up to 20% of the active claims have been "closed" for no apparent reason. At first I was thinking " wow... a gold mine of closed claims...." but then I started cross referencing with my county filings.... and then it dawned on me that there was a really big problem and people who filed their assessments on time were getting their claims closed. If the claim flippers don't recognize the problem before they go out "flipping" they are going to lose a lot of money. I had my eye on some choice locations... but now... not so much..... who knows how long it is going to take to unwind this mess.

The county "Records" with returns is what the court will look at first. Hopefully the message is getting out there what a paper trail mess there is starting to grow now big time.

 

[Minerrick1]

The county "Records" with returns is what the court will look at first. Hopefully the message is getting out there what a paper trail mess there is starting to grow now big time.

Yeah, the problem is the County and the BLM don't talk. Their systems are independent of each other. This could easily turn into an exponential mess..... give it a couple of days....

 

[mikep691]

I always count on the County Recorder first. I once had the recorder in Plumas county tell me they didn't care what BLM says. If te claim isn't legally closed by the county, it still exists and will continue to be taxed, regardless of the BLM status of the claim.

 

[Minerrick1]

I always count on the County Recorder first. I once had the recorder in Plumas county tell me they didn't care what BLM says. If te claim isn't legally closed by the county, it still exists and will continue to be taxed, regardless of the BLM status of the claim.

Yeah the county recorder is the source of who owns the claim, but the County can't close a claim. Only the BLM can do that. The county can lay liens against any back taxes, but the way I understand it, only the BLM can close the claim. I've run into lots of instances where a person only filed at the BLM and not the county. I'm not sure how the BLM would update the paperwork on their side, if there weren't any tax payment info included with the paperwork, but apparently they do it all the time. This whole mining claim thing is a big puzzle where the blm is always moving the goalposts - by accident or not- but the ONE thing you can depend upon is the BLM has messed something up, somewhere. And don't get me wrong the desk people do what they can to help, but I think the problems are bigger than that level of the org.

 

[Assembler]

Yeah the county recorder is the source of who owns the claim, but the County can't close a claim. Only the BLM can do that. The county can lay liens against any back taxes, but the way I understand it, only the BLM can close the claim.

The County "Records" is where the recognized "Record" is deposited. The discovery shaft / crosscut of the claimed lode deposit is where the first "Record" is claimed to take place at that "Location" if it is "Active" - "Monument-ed"

 

[Assembler]

The County "Records" is where the recognized "Record" is deposited. The discovery shaft / crosscut of the claimed lode deposit is where the first "Record" is claimed to take place at that "Location" if it is "Active" - "Monument-ed"

Acquisition of adverse title by possession of land usually starts or takes place at the County level.

Comparative legislation: California Deering's Gen. Laws, Act 8589, section 35.

Oregon has a section as well.

 

[Assembler]

Acquisition of adverse title by possession of land usually starts or takes place at the County level.

Comparative legislation: California Deering's Gen. Laws, Act 8589, section 35.

Oregon has a section as well.

"Within ten years: Recovery of real property" [Oregon 1862; D. sec. 4]
Comparative legislation: Cal. Code Civ. Proc., sec. 318-19
Idaho. I.C.A., sec. 5-203 to 5-210
Wash. Rem. Rev. Stat., sec. 156

 

[Minerrick1]

yes, that takes place at the county, but the BLM is the only entity that can "CLOSE" a claim listed on their website/system. If someone doesn't pay at the County, the County can't (or doesn't) apparently call the BLM and tell them to CLOSE the claim. Each entity does what they do without any (apparent) acknowledgment from each other. I have been tracking claims that were filed only at the BLM and not at the County.... that have been like that for years. The claims are not legal by any definition, but apparently neither the BLM nor the County either know or care. And I am not interested in acquiring of adverse title of a claim from someone who wants and "thinks" they own it- even though it is invalid. It would be nice if SOMEONE kept track of all this.....

 

[Assembler]

"Within ten years: Recovery of real property" [Oregon 1862; D. sec. 4]
Comparative legislation: Cal. Code Civ. Proc., sec. 318-19
Idaho. I.C.A., sec. 5-203 to 5-210
Wash. Rem. Rev. Stat., sec. 156

BLM only has the ability to take a look at the County records and can "flag" the County clerk to point out other issues. This is the usual process that can take place.

There is a small penalty for tampering with the "monuments" and "discovery location". Keep in mind this was made during the time (1862 in Oregon) when both gold and silver was being used. Today this is no longer the case with most transactions taking place. The "County records" reflect this.

 

[Assembler]

yes, that takes place at the county, but the BLM is the only entity that can "CLOSE" a claim listed on their website/system. If someone doesn't pay at the County, the County can't (or doesn't) apparently call the BLM and tell them to CLOSE the claim. Each entity does what they do without any (apparent) acknowledgment from each other. I have been tracking claims that were filed only at the BLM and not at the County.... that have been like that for years. The claims are not legal by any definition, but apparently neither the BLM nor the County either know or care. And I am not interested in acquiring of adverse title of a claim from someone who wants and "thinks" they own it- even though it is invalid. It would be nice if SOMEONE kept track of all this.....

Correct that the BLM can "flag" the County clerk of these specific issues and I'm sure the County clerk can flag the appropriate BLM Officers whether the "Claim" is "Active" or any other "issues". The County "Surveyor" also has the ability to "flag" the BLM appropriate Officers as well. Heck maybe the FS can also "flag" the BLM as well.

 

[winners58]

Correct that the BLM can "flag" the County clerk of these specific issues and I'm sure the County clerk can flag the appropriate BLM Officers whether the "Claim" is "Active" or any other "issues". The County "Surveyor" also has the ability to "flag" the BLM appropriate Officers as well. Heck maybe the FS can also "flag" the BLM as well.

you have know idea what you are talking about, stop posting and posting

 

[Minerrick1]

Correct that the BLM can "flag" the County clerk of these specific issues and I'm sure the County clerk can flag the appropriate BLM Officers whether the "Claim" is "Active" or any other "issues". The County "Surveyor" also has the ability to "flag" the BLM appropriate Officers as well. Heck maybe the FS can also "flag" the BLM as well.

What you don't understand is the BLM DOESN'T TALK TO THE COUNTY. All they do is record filings. They have no main map that shows where the filings are, they take your money and record it in a book or online and move on to the next person to take their money. I have had - on several occasions- the BLM Staff tell people to go file on my claims because they are open......but my claims are NOT OPEN to be claimed. I take great pride in offering several versions of my maps for them to view so there is NO QUESTION where my claims are. What makes them think my claims are open to the point that they tell people to go file on them? If they had access to the County records, they could have "looked them up" and seen all my County Filing Paperwork was in order..... but they didn't because they DON'T have access to the County Records. The County and the BLM each record a variation of what could possibly be or not be a claim- totally independent of each other. Whoever thought this system up is insane. It's no wonder it is as screwed up as it is.

 

[winners58]

update; my claim has been changed back to "active" in MLRS but has not changed in "Reports" (SRP)
Yet,,, like the LR2000, data is entered then is applied the next morning.
I see it closed a lot of claims that should have been closed several years ago, I guess that will help with the backlog.
if your claim is affected contact the State office but many only have one person answering phones and emails
I also put in a MLRS help desk ticket, each one has to be changed back manually,
you can research your claims, also a link on this page to put in a help desk ticket here;

BLM Reporting Application - Mineral & Land Records System Reports

reports.blm.gov

 

[Assembler]

What you don't understand is the BLM DOESN'T TALK TO THE COUNTY. All they do is record filings. They have no main map that shows where the filings are, they take your money and record it in a book or online and move on to the next person to take their money. I have had - on several occasions- the BLM Staff tell people to go file on my claims because they are open......but my claims are NOT OPEN to be claimed. I take great pride in offering several versions of my maps for them to view so there is NO QUESTION where my claims are. What makes them think my claims are open to the point that they tell people to go file on them? If they had access to the County records, they could have "looked them up" and seen all my County Filing Paperwork was in order..... but they didn't because they DON'T have access to the County Records. The County and the BLM each record a variation of what could possibly be or not be a claim- totally independent of each other. Whoever thought this system up is insane. It's no wonder it is as screwed up as it is.

You may have the impression that the BLM does not communicate or ask for County records.
You may want to take a look at some "Court records" in regards to "Mining Claim disputes".

BLM also has such a back log now of information to process the office appears to be falling behind.