Hooah. First dive class. Question about specialties.

LM · May 3, 2011

These are the PADI dive specialty certifications I'll have available to me at my training center once I complete basic OW.

Boat Diver
Deep Diver
DPV
Drift Diver
Dry Suit
Enriched Air
Equipment Specialist
Ice Diver
Multilevel diver
Full Face Mask
Night Diver
Peak Performance Diver
Search & Recovery Diver
Underwater Naturalist
Wreck Diver

Eventually I'll just get them all, but for the time being, which are most useful on a treasure salvage vessel?
The no-brainers seem to be Boat Diver, Wreck Diver and Search and Recovery... I think five specialties are included in the Adventure classification, so any additional suggestions appreciated. I'm thinking Deep Diver and Equipment Specialist would come in handy, but would like to hear ideas.

rgecy · May 3, 2011

I would say DPV, Drift Diver, Full Face Mask, and Night Diver. I like the night diver since it teaches some of the skills you would also need in black water. And certainly knowing how to use a DPV is usefull.

Not sure what all is covered in the equipment specialist, but would probably be a good one also!

Robert

Au_Dreamers · May 3, 2011

I'll lead off with I believe in diver safety and diver education...

But from about the inception of PADI I've always thought they were a let's pull as much money from the pockets of divers as possible organization…

What I would do is check out the “specialty classes” and what they actually offer as special training. Most of it won’t be “anything special” and isn’t something that you can’t very easily learn from just diving with other divers. While diving may be new to you I would say as you put some time in the water you’ll get more comfortable with the required gear and then you can explore some of the other fun stuff.

So ok I’d check out search and recovery. Good base for being a Magnetometer diver especially if you would be using a handheld mag or detector. Agree with night diver and full face if you plan on using one.

Grats and welcome to “the club”!!

Mackaydon · May 3, 2011

If you are a recreational diver (return to port every night), I'd recommend an additional class: Certification in Basic First Aid/CPR and AED (Provided by the Red Cross, among others).

If you are more than a recreational diver, you might consider or make sure someone in your group is certified in ABC (Advanced Bleeding Control), AACB (Advanced Airway Control and Breathing), ACLS (Advanced Cardiac Life Support) and additional courses in the familiarization and administration of meds and related medical equipment.
Happy (and safe) diving,
Don....

Diver_Down · May 3, 2011

LSMorgan said:
These are the PADI dive specialty certifications I'll have available to me at my training center once I complete basic OW.

Boat Diver
Deep Diver
DPV
Drift Diver
Dry Suit
Enriched Air
Equipment Specialist
Ice Diver
Multilevel diver
Full Face Mask
Night Diver
Peak Performance Diver
Search & Recovery Diver
Underwater Naturalist
Wreck Diver

Click to expand...

Eventually I'll just get them all, but for the time being, which are most useful on a treasure salvage vessel?
The no-brainers seem to be Boat Diver, Wreck Diver and Search and Recovery... I think five specialties are included in the Adventure classification, so any additional suggestions appreciated. I'm thinking Deep Diver and Equipment Specialist would come in handy, but would like to hear ideas.

Let me chime in first by saying that I'm a PADI Instructor that has worked throughout the Caribbean and last worked at a CDC training future instructors. It matters where you'll be taking the courses. A Boat Diver specialty taught in the Great Lakes or off Jersey will be way more valuable than a Boat Diver specialty taught in the Keys. The fundamentals will be the same, but the instructors have a lot of latitude in imparting knowledge that exceeds the basics. A Jon line is standard in Jersey, but you would find it difficult to find a crew in the Keys to even know what one is.

That being said, let me highlight the fluff. These are the worthless and only hold value if you want to obtain as many C-Cards as possible and be known as a C-Card Cammando. Great resume; horrible diver. Equipment Specialist, Peak Performance, Underwater Naturalist, Drift, DPV, and Full-Face mask.

What you should focus on after your OW cert is gaining proficiency and take an Advanced Open Water course. You'll be exposed to deep diving at that time. After completing AOW, then focus on some of the specialties on the list. Search/Recovery, Wreck, Enriched Air, Night, and Deep would be top recommendations. Even though some (Deep,Night,Enriched Air) might not be pertinent on a salvage crew, they expose you to technical, physical, and psychological mechanics of diving that allows you to become a more confident and proficient diver. Pass on the Boat Diver course. The core fundamentals will be gear storage, equipment set-up on a moving platform, boat fundamentals (port/starboard, aft/stern), egress from the water, and entry techniques (back-roll, giant stride, etc.)

Au_Dreamers · May 3, 2011

oh I forgot IMHO one very important piece of advice- Join DAN (Divers Alert Network) and get their insurance.

It's the best $75 a year you can spend.

Too many people have been told their insurance covers them with dive related emergencies only to find out when they actually have to use it that it doesn't! Imagine an insurance salesman lying!??!

http://diversalertnetwork.org/

Salvor6 · May 3, 2011

Morgan I am also a PADI Instructor and I would recommend you take the Divemaster Course and then go for Instructor training. That teaches you to become a leader and know so much about diving that you can actually teach it to others. Then, if you don't make any money off treasure hunting you can still have a diving-related income to fall back on.

Diver_Down · May 4, 2011

Salvor6 said:
Morgan I am also a PADI Instructor and I would recommend you take the Divemaster Course and then go for Instructor training. That teaches you to become a leader and know so much about diving that you can actually teach it to others. Then, if you don't make any money off treasure hunting you can still have a diving-related income to fall back on.

Lots of good recommendations for Morgan. If you do pursue continuing Education towards a career path, then please take your time and expose yourself to different aspects of diving. You need to learn to crawl before you run. Ideal continuing education path should be:
OW --> AOW --> Specialties (don't get crazy and collect C-Cards) --> Rescue Diver (one of the most important courses and will impart confidence in your abilities and competency as a diver) --> Technical Diving (You don't have to be hardcore, but exposing yourself to more intensive training and skills is a good thing) --> Divermaster --> Spend a season working as crew/assistant to an instructor --> If you want a career, then go for the IDC/IE earning your OWSI.

I've seen too many students show up at a CDC center with a check from Mom/Dad and the bare minimum requirements. The owner/CD will take the money and the staff will do their job prepping you for the IE, but it doesn't "qualify" you as an Instructor. I've seen many Instructors wash out because they aren't cut out for it.

Good luck and enjoy it.

Au_Dreamers · May 4, 2011

Be careful exposing yourself, some of those critters have teeth :laughing9:

wwwtimmcp · May 4, 2011

aow
deep
wreck
recovery
first aid
get some diving in between so you dont burn out.

Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp · May 8, 2011

Geeze, what ever happened to those days where you just bought a copy of the navy's dive manual, a Scuba
pro regulator and tanks, flippers, a lousy fitting face mask, misc thingies, such as the inevitable SHARK knife
and weights, etc., and went at it?

Even cobbled together a tank filling combination using a B-29 air compressor and a home made air filter from
an accumulator. sigh.

Before he would let me dive with him, My friend made me take off the dive gear under water, completely
disassemble it, swim the length of the pool, and return, reassemble the gear, then surface.

He then made me swim equivalent to 25 meters, using just the tank - I lost a lot of air and chipped a tooth
that way, because I became a bi anxious once, but it certainly gave one confidence against gear failure.

Now days a diver is almost better equipped than a ww-2 sub.

I remember when starting with Al in hard hat diving, they just pushed me off into liquid mud, literally. He said when you leave here, anywhere in the world will be a picnic because by G---! I will make a DIVER out of you !

So am I a diver ?? nah, but a qualified mule pusher? yes!

Don Jose de La Mancha
.

p.s. Still have those hot diving spots waiting.

Salvor6 · May 8, 2011

Don Jose those days are over. There is no practical use in being able to take all your gear off and putting it back on underwater. Now a days the theory is that everyone can learn to dive without the useless obstacle course. I have certified people with heart disease, emphazema, epilepsy, etc. It all depends on your skill level and your dive buddy. There is even a "handicapped dive association" that certifies divers that are paralized.

Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp · May 8, 2011

Evening salvor my friend, Perhaps, perhaps, but even today, equipment 'does' fail, and then is when this confidence training definitely earns it's feather. I rather get the impression that it is like flying with no spin recovery training any more, it has been derated because it frightened some, but this has no place in diving either. Diving IS dangerous, as witness the many fatalties yearly.

You cannot be over trained, but you 'can be' overconfident.

You can establish a different scale of ability.

In my flying years, I was taught to handle any possible type of equipment failure or emergency, and sooner or later, it was justified. Then again, Sometimes not sniff see attach.

Stilll sniff

Don Jose de La Mancha

LM · May 9, 2011

Thanks everyone for your great advice.
I have no interest in obtaining a bunch of pointless 'cards'. I just want to be a good and useful diver. I guess that only comes with experience.

Can't wait to get in, get down and start making bubbles

Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp · May 9, 2011

Morning, speaking of certificates, which one covers attending to mother natures call while down 30 + ft? hmmm?

Don Jose de La Mancha holding up two fingers.

p.s apology for the levity

FISHEYE · May 10, 2011

Don Jose,

I got the same training you did,but from a UDT-Seal in hawaii back in the 70's.My course was 4 months long with 5 of my best friends in the class.All our fathers were officers in the air force,navy,army,CG and marines.We wanted to learn scuba diving.I think this course was set up for us by our fathers.Our instructor took us to the worst places on the island to dive and taught us how to get in an out of the water,dive an deal with the caves,surges,undertows,very large sharks and survive.Places no sane person would ever think about diving at.Im talking about 20-30 foot waves crashing down on razor sharp reefs and rocks and rock walls with sea urchins all over them with 5 inch spines.Our instructor tossed all of our gear in the water from the cliffs above.We had to get in and put the gear on and do the dive till we had no air left.It didnt matter whos gear you got just as long as you got the gear on.He taught us how to use single an double hose regs,rebreathers,DPV's,hookah,hard hat,salvage work,how to run a compressor and maintain it and even how to escape from a sub at the pearl harbor 100 foot dive training tower.Even some UDT work.We all got Naui,padi,Ymca and nasds certs.There was no kiddie pool training.What i learned from this instructor has saved my life many many times.I have been to scuba courses with other friends and what they teach you nowadays is a joke.There is no regulation of scuba courses anywhere in the world so this is why there are so many diving related accidents and deaths.Its very Poor training just to make a buck and sell you equipment you dont need.I guess you could call me old skool.My newest reg is 15 years old.I still use regs that are 30+ years old.I was taught by my instructor on how to rebuild them.Alot of this new scuba gear is junk,look at the recall lists before you buy.Find a ex or current navy seal to teach you if you want to survive.

Diver_Down · May 10, 2011

FISHEYE said:
There is no regulation of scuba courses anywhere in the world so this is why there are so many diving related accidents and deaths.Its very Poor training just to make a buck and sell you equipment you dont need.I guess you could call me old skool.My newest reg is 15 years old.I still use regs that are 30+ years old.I was taught by my instructor on how to rebuild them.Alot of this new scuba gear is junk,look at the recall lists before you buy.Find a ex or current navy seal to teach you if you want to survive.

Sorry, Fisheye, but you are wrong on this account. :nono:

PADI, NAUI, SSI and the technical certifying agencies are the most regulated standards for diving instruction developed through years and years experience. Diving is a very safe sport. The problem is that when accidents happen, they are quite severe. Not all Course Directors/Instructors are the same, but they all have to abide by standards or risk decertification/suspension/expulsion. Yes, many shops will sell equipment that you don't need and I'm as guilty of it as the next instructor. When you work on commission in a shop and customer is determined on such and such, whiz bang, latest flavor, equipment add-on then the end result is an equipment sale that the customer doesn't "need".

Example: I was a Staff Instructor at a CDC here in Florida that had a large international customer base. The instruction was top notch. We didn't cut corners as the owner/CD didn't allow it. He was "old school" Navy Seal that volunteered for 3 tours of duty in Vietnam. The guy was flat-out crazy, but he knew his stuff. Anyway, one of our students was from Lebanon. He owned a shop and wanted to purchase 6 sets of gear. He could buy it cheaper in the US and import than buy at home. I had some reservations on selling him gear that he didn't necessarily need, but he was adamant on the latest and greatest. My owner pulled me aside, and expressed in no certain terms that if I didn't sell anything and everything that the customer wanted than he would find someone who would. Needless to say, the guy from Lebanon paid close to 10k before leaving.

FISHEYE · May 10, 2011

Who regulates padi,naui,ssi or any others?Not the USA gov thats for sure.I can print up any cert card on my printer and laminate it and any scuba shop will fill my tanks or sell me anything.They dont check just cause they want to sell air and equipment.And charge you for a tank vis,valve thread xray inspection even though you have a up to date vis sticker from some other shop an a current hydro.And this bs that no shop will fill a tank prior to 1981 even when the tank has a current hydro and vis sticker.Some shops wont even fill a tank if its not all pretty looking with paint chipped off.Alot of shops wont even fill a tank if its a luxfer,even if its brand new!They are all paranoid that the tank is gonna explode when they fill it.90% of the shops here in florida have workers that dont even know how to properly fill a tank.I have got tanks that were underfilled and over filled.One tank the burst disk blew as i was carrying the tank out to my truck.If the DOT went around to all the shops to inspect im sure most would be shut down.This is why im getting my own compressor soon and filling my own tanks that are hydro-ed and older than 1981.

Diver_Down · May 10, 2011

FISHEYE said:
Who regulates padi,naui,ssi or any others?Not the USA gov thats for sure.I can print up any cert card on my printer and laminate it and any scuba shop will fill my tanks or sell me anything.They dont check just cause they want to sell air and equipment.And charge you for a tank vis,valve thread xray inspection even though you have a up to date vis sticker from some other shop an a current hydro.And this bs that no shop will fill a tank prior to 1981 even when the tank has a current hydro and vis sticker.Some shops wont even fill a tank if its not all pretty looking with paint chipped off.Alot of shops wont even fill a tank if its a luxfer,even if its brand new!They are all paranoid that the tank is gonna explode when they fill it.90% of the shops here in florida have workers that dont even know how to properly fill a tank.I have got tanks that were underfilled and over filled.One tank the burst disk blew as i was carrying the tank out to my truck.If the DOT went around to all the shops to inspect im sure most would be shut down.This is why im getting my own compressor soon and filling my own tanks that are hydro-ed and older than 1981.

Certifying agencies are self-regulated. They don't need the Government to oversee and police their instructional standards. The fact remains that recreational scuba diving is a very safe sport due in part to the required training imposed by the industry. More people die in other recreational sports than scuba diving. More people die swimming, but I don't see anyone clamoring for governmental oversight and requiring people to be properly taught before engaging in such risky behavior. Also, no instruction required for boating, golfing, or horseback riding, yet people die from such risky endeavors.

Tank filling issues are a separate matter. I agree that many aren't trained properly on the use of a fill station. I earned my Gas Blender certification from IANTD in part because at the time there were no fancy computers automating the filling of mixed gas blends. I learned the old school way were you calculated partial pressures and the volume needed to fill to obtain a desired custom blend. Separate fill tanks of helium and oxygen were used first and then topped off with regular compressed air to dilute the concentration of oxygen/helium. It was a whole lot of voodoo and very risky with regards to fire and explosion. I would like to see mandatory OSHA inspections to ensure safe and proper use of filling stations.

Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp · May 10, 2011

Gentlemen some excellent posts on both sides. However I still contend that all divers should be trained in how to cope with equipment failures, under water.
"cut hoses do occur, diaphragms do fail, valves do stick, etc., etc".

Most of my diving down here has been contrary to basic rule #1, 'alone'. I had no convenient places to fill fill my tanks under 150 miles, so I constructed my own compressor rig and filtering system, then learned how to check it for gas / oil contamination. Slow, needed two hours to fill my double tanks.

I constructed my own surface supplied air system and enjoyed it, until one day I found my motor compressor lying beside me at 35 ft . This is where my past training came into play, there was only a feeling of inconvenience, not panic. I merely looked at the motor lying on its side and wondered to myself "is the @%% motor hydraulically damaged"? and surfaced slower than my ascending bubbles. No problem, as usual I was alone. The motor was only lightly damaged, went diving two days later again, however, I can guarantee that that cottin pickin motor never left it's boat mount again.

No, to be checked out in equipment failure is just basic logic. while you may not require your student to swim 10 - 25 meters under water, you can teach her / him to handle emergencies. This is applicable for all, including the severely handicapped. Actually diving is an ideal sport for many of them, since the body is basically weightless.

Don Jose de La Mancha el mule driver that has gotten into more trouble riding mules than diving.

Flying ?? forget it, sniff, none were 'my' fault you understand ! Fish eye may have had something to do with it. He is, ah, well, you know !