Large coin and a couple buttons today, HELP!!!

[firefighter35]

Hey yall, was nice out today so shaun and i went to indian head alley. Thats were we found so many indian heads. I pulled out 2 buttons, one marked GILT with a crown on it and another with "THEIR COLOUR WILL STAND". Does anyone know about the buttons? Next thing i found was this large coin. It has a bust and is the size of a LC but its very worn. You can read what appears to be SAR but you can be the judge. Please HELP. I know someone will know what it is, lol I even wrapped it in foil to try and get more detail out. Thanks guys, HH Greg

 

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[Goes4ever]

Can't help u ID but congrats on the great finds

 

[Kirk PA]

You found a William III copper. That is a great find.

Kirk

 

[dirtdigginpa]

It was a good day! Tried to post mine via my phone since my computers down but don't think it worked. Good finds bro! Shaun

 

[umrgolf]

That button backmark is amazing gratz on the William III Halfpenny or farthing ( late 1600s-1700 i think) might be time to rename your site

 

[Kayaker]

Great finds! I'm a noob and have barely had a chance to try the Bounty Hunter Tracker IV my wife bought me for Christmas. Spring can't come soon enough after this hard Connecticut winter.

Hey firefighter35 and dirtdigginpa, I have a sister that lives right down the road in Robesonia. I'd love to get some pointers if/when I get down that way in the spring. Ever since I got this thing I've been thinking that your area of PA would probably be great to search!

Kayaker - New Fairfield, CT

 

[dale68]

The spelling (colour) on the buttons is british english (versus color), suspect them to be english.

 

[civilman1]

Nice dig's.....That IS a cool backmark,patriotic in my mind.Congrat's on the William

 

[dale68]

The words on the buttons indicate-military(british) or even colonial militia,especially if found near the william III coin

 

[firefighter35]

Thanks guys. The button was found about 10 feet from coin. That would be my second William the III coin i found in a year. One in schaefferstown and now this site. Wonder if they used it to play poker with? lol Thanks alot guys. TNET is the best for iding.

 

[firefighter35]

You found a William III copper. That is a great find.

Kirk

Im not so sure that it is copper. It did not ring up on the explorer ii as copper. It rang up like bronze. It is actually heavier than the other william III i had found. Is it possible it would be a counterfeit?

 

[Iron Patch]

You found a William III copper. That is a great find.

Kirk

Im not so sure that it is copper. It did not ring up on the explorer ii as copper. It rang up like bronze. It is actually heavier than the other william III i had found. Is it possible it would be a counterfeit?

It's possible but the tone it gave on your detector won't prove it, and you should compare the weight and diameter to the genuine issues... and even if close still doesn't say for sure. In other words you need some very serious testing to feel confident in calling it one way or the other. Also if it's cast not struck than it's counterfeit.

If most things add up to being counterfeit than it probably is.


The button is most likely early 1800s and the mark just a quality mark. "Best gilt" "True quality" etc. etc. etc.. Their Colour will stand = Their gilt is high quality and won't wear easily. That said, I don't recall ever seeing that one.

 

[steelheadwill]

Nice Old Copper & Coolest backmark I've seen

 

[firefighter35]

The back mark is the first i have ever seen too. I tried finding info on it but nothin. Wonder if its a banner button, lol The front is just the normal slightly rounded but the back is awesome. The coin is cool but the button i feel is better than the coin, lol More mystery behind it!!!

 

[Kayaker]

Ooh... I rephrased the wording and just found THIS... http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php?topic=111679.0

... but I think the way you read it makes more sense. Still, seems very rare, nothing else from Google, Bing or Yahoo.

 

[Nutriasub]

Love the buttons.
I hope you get the coin identified

Cheers

 

[Don in SJ]

IP is correct on the button, an early 1800s button that is just stating the Quality of the button in a slightly different matter, do not think it is anything too special, but is nice to have found one and glad you took notice of the backmark. Too many never even clean the back side of a plain button, and those are the ones who miss out on knowing if they have found a political or patriotic button that only had sayings on the backside!
Since another was found a few states away, I believe they are probably more common that thought. Added: Just noticed the period on the button so if there is no other period, the button's statement is: WILL STAND THEIR COLOUR which seems to make sense on being a quality b/m instead of THEIR COLOUR WILL STAND, which sounds more like a statement of some type.

As far as the coin goes, wish the photo was a tad better, but as you saying it reads wrong, well, I am doing a study on all my colonials and weighing all, measuring diameter on all, doing Specific Gravity on some that are suspect legit or counterfeit and also the main part of the study was to use the Digital Ferrous and Non Ferrous (Conductive) readings that the SE Pro, using the SR-1 probe and record where all the coins under controlled circumstances read on the detector.

William coppers happen in general to read lower in tone and crosshair and digital readings than most all of "coppers". I have recorded data on 28 of our William III Halfpence and the readings to vary but in general they are all lower than KGI, KGII, and even almost every KGIII Halfpence of which are all counterfeits in our collection. Now the KG II and KG III coppers that are cast countefeits, DO read lower, but again, William III Halfpence in my study of 28 ground found ones read low...

I assume the Explorer II has the double digital readout, so if you could, pass the two Williams you have under the coil, and it does not matter whether you use Conductive sounds or Ferrous sounds, the readings will remain the same. Just pass the coins evenly under the coil or probe in a smooth (flat not angled) manner and do it several times and the most common reading you get is what I would like to hear. I used the SR-1 Probe since it made it very easy to do it with one in the house.

I will let you know how they compare with my study in a PM, which I do not want to post at this time, due to possibly publishing the results in the future.

Don

 

[traverdog]

Good show!!

 

[West Jersey Detecting]

You found a William III copper. That is a great find.

Kirk

Those are all some nice finds. As for the readings, I remember my Wm. III being a bit lower, near what a Wheat Cent would read if I am not mistaken. As for ferrous, non-ferrous and specific gravity .... It makes my head spin!

Nice job on the ID Kirk!

 

[firefighter35]

Thanks guys. Im kinda confused with the whole specific gravity stuff too. Its deff a cool find in my book. Tomorrow im heading to a house that was built in the 1700s with shaun. The lady who owns it i went to school with and she has a cheap bounty hunter and had found 2 half cents!!! So who knows what we will find with the explorer II and the fisher f70!!! Keep and eye out for the finds guys, maybe i will get a banner find for once, lol Greg