Obama Declares H1N1 Emergency

[pygmy]

There have been 32 successful flu vaccinations since 1976 when a mistake occurred.
Obviously since then, improvements have been made.
If you still live in fear 33 years later, then how will you react and protect yourself when
the Big pandemic hits home for example an easily spread Cancer Virus or a mutated non-blood spread HIV.

 

[olepossum]

i live in a town of 70,ooo plus and 99% of the flu cases being seen are h1n1 and the regular flu season has not even started here yet they say that if class attendance is down by 20%in the district they wil close the schools and do a clean over a two day period the attendance is well over 20% we have at least 3 cases in our nieghborhood that the kida have had it for 7 days plus and tamiflu aint touching it about ready to home school kids untill it calms down some my wife says it is suppossed to be that way that we are in the end of times and our 1000years of peace was when the dinosaurs walked the earth i told her to hush up dont scare the kids with that talk.

 

[Smee]

There have been 32 successful flu vaccinations since 1976 when a mistake occurred.
Obviously since then, improvements have been made.
If you still live in fear 33 years later, then how will you react and protect yourself when
the Big pandemic hits home for example an easily spread Cancer Virus or a mutated non-blood spread HIV.

1) Have you had the flu vaccine? My Aunt Katherine has it every year, and every year she get ill with the flu. For almost 30 years the doctor has told her that every year she has already gotten the flu before she got her shot. She is always in the first group vaccinated. That's a pretty damned good record of infection. But . . . she's old and we can't convince her that it is the shot giving her the flu because the doctor always tells her that the shot can't give you the flu.

2) Cancer virus . . . ? No, you don't catch cancer from someone else. It isn't a communicable disease, regardless of what the "educated folks" down under might tell you. You can develop cancer from certain "venereal diseases" as a result of how they behave in the body. You get VD from engaging in sexual relations with an infected person. Just one more reason to follow the advice to remain chaste (archaic word, but we ALL know what it means).

3) HIV . . . AIDS. Let's see . . . how do you get it? Since very few of us here in the U.S. eat monkey meat, that only leaves the spread through blood or sexual fluids. That means blood transfusions (unless you're a vampire, which would be a tricky situation), using a dirty needle, or having sexual relations with an infected person. I think all of those are things that are scripturally "questionable" behavior (each one must decide for themselves what the book says, don't believe what I or anyone else says, read it yourself ).

 

[The Beep Goes On]

Follow the money. I wouldn't get that shot...no freakin' way (nor my children). The testing is totally inadequate. Pharma is pulling in billions. I would much rather wash my hands alot and not touch my face (as most RN's are doing who have refused the vaccine). With so many doctors and nurses refusing...doesn't that tell you something? There have been some articles by vaccine industry insiders (now shunned by the industry) that I have read that are pretty darn scary. What most of them make clear is that the time from vaccine creation to deployment leaves no room for rigorous testing. Future complications that may develop due to the vaccine may take years to exhibit symptoms...and by that time it is easy for Pharma to say "wasn't us".

 

[ClonedSIM]

Wow, paranoid much? How about this? If you don't want the shot, don't take it.

Just because you choose to believe that there's some vast conspiracy surrounding this illness doesn't mean there is, and to sit at home and make accusations like some of you are is irresponsible, to say the least.

 

[Urban Prospector]

It's not paranoia it's distrust in an Administration that tells you to sneeze/ cough on your elbow. Why not recommend a hankie instead carrying snot on your arm?

 

[ClonedSIM]

It's not paranoia it's distrust in an Administration that tells you to sneeze/ cough on your elbow. Why not recommend a hankie instead carrying snot on your arm?

Yours is a perfectly valid question, but remember that the CDC most likely recommended coughing/sneezing into your elbow because not a lot of folks carry handkerchiefs anymore, and it's certainly not often seen among school-age kids but most, if not all, already have elbows. It's not like they issued any kind of political decree, or passed a law banning handkerchiefs, it was just a suggestion.

 

[ClonedSIM]

There have been 32 successful flu vaccinations since 1976 when a mistake occurred.
Obviously since then, improvements have been made.
If you still live in fear 33 years later, then how will you react and protect yourself when
the Big pandemic hits home for example an easily spread Cancer Virus or a mutated non-blood spread HIV.

1) Have you had the flu vaccine? My Aunt Katherine has it every year, and every year she get ill with the flu. For almost 30 years the doctor has told her that every year she has already gotten the flu before she got her shot. She is always in the first group vaccinated. That's a pretty damned good record of infection. But . . . she's old and we can't convince her that it is the shot giving her the flu because the doctor always tells her that the shot can't give you the flu.

2) Cancer virus . . . ? No, you don't catch cancer from someone else. It isn't a communicable disease, regardless of what the "educated folks" down under might tell you. You can develop cancer from certain "venereal diseases" as a result of how they behave in the body. You get VD from engaging in sexual relations with an infected person. Just one more reason to follow the advice to remain chaste (archaic word, but we ALL know what it means).

3) HIV . . . AIDS. Let's see . . . how do you get it? Since very few of us here in the U.S. eat monkey meat, that only leaves the spread through blood or sexual fluids. That means blood transfusions (unless you're a vampire, which would be a tricky situation), using a dirty needle, or having sexual relations with an infected person. I think all of those are things that are scripturally "questionable" behavior (each one must decide for themselves what the book says, don't believe what I or anyone else says, read it yourself ).

Smee,
Pigiron above made the specific examples of "an easliy spread cancer virus" and "mutated non-blood spread HIV," and he did quantify his statement with the word "if," telling me that he was giving you hypothetical situations.

You don't seem to take this into account in your response. Just thought I'd point that out.

 

[pygmy]

Thats correct af1723 , no one knows what mutations will emerge from nature or from
rogue laboratories in the future.

 

[The Beep Goes On]

Wow, paranoid much? How about this? If you don't want the shot, don't take it.

Just because you choose to believe that there's some vast conspiracy surrounding this illness doesn't mean there is, and to sit at home and make accusations like some of you are is irresponsible, to say the least.

Lol...isn't that exactly what I said? Do you like advising people to do what they have just declared? I am glad for you that our gov't and big pharma make you feel all warm and tingly inside. I will not try to fathom how you could trust these folks, but to each his own.

If you want to call pharma's billions of dollars in profit a conspiracy, go for it...it's right there...not really a conspiracy. As for the unforeseen complications that may come about from a vaccine, or any medicine, that hasn't been thoroughly tested...well, that's not a conspiracy either, just common sense. Pharma loves to push new drugs out as fast as possible without adequate testing. Let's see...how many lawsuits have we seen in the last decade from drugs that have had unintended consequences (like death)? A ton. Pharma will kill you for profit...perhaps not intentionally, but from the lack of adequate testing, flawed processes and the monetary grip on the relevant sciences (grants, etc.).

How many times do these people (gov/pharma) have to show us that they are untrustworthy for some folks to, at least, understand how people may think as I do.

"Paranoia is knowing all the facts."
- Woody Allen

"Paranoia is just another word for longevity."
- Laurell K. Hamilton, The Laughing Corpse

"Perfect paranoia is perfect awareness."

"Paranoia is reality seen on a finer scale."
- Philo Gant, Strange Days

"The issue is not whether you are paranoid, the issue is whether you are paranoid enough."
- Max, Strange Days

"Why are you so paranoid, Mulder?"
"Oh, I don't know. Maybe it's because I find it hard to trust anybody."
- Scully & Mulder, The X-Files, "Ascension"

 

[ClonedSIM]

Wow, paranoid much? How about this? If you don't want the shot, don't take it.

Just because you choose to believe that there's some vast conspiracy surrounding this illness doesn't mean there is, and to sit at home and make accusations like some of you are is irresponsible, to say the least.

Lol...isn't that exactly what I said? Do you like advising people to do what they have just declared? I am glad for you that our gov't and big pharma make you feel all warm and tingly inside. I will not try to fathom how you could trust these folks, but to each his own.

If you want to call pharma's billions of dollars in profit a conspiracy, go for it...it's right there...not really a conspiracy. As for the unforeseen complications that may come about from a vaccine, or any medicine, that hasn't been thoroughly tested...well, that's not a conspiracy either, just common sense. Pharma loves to push new drugs out as fast as possible without adequate testing. Let's see...how many lawsuits have we seen in the last decade from drugs that have had unintended consequences (like death)? A ton. Pharma will kill you for profit...perhaps not intentionally, but from the lack of adequate testing, flawed processes and the monetary grip on the relevant sciences (grants, etc.).

How many times do these people (gov/pharma) have to show us that they are untrustworthy for some folks to, at least, understand how people may think as I do.

"Paranoia is knowing all the facts."
- Woody Allen

"Paranoia is just another word for longevity."
- Laurell K. Hamilton, The Laughing Corpse

"Perfect paranoia is perfect awareness."

"Paranoia is reality seen on a finer scale."
- Philo Gant, Strange Days

"The issue is not whether you are paranoid, the issue is whether you are paranoid enough."
- Max, Strange Days

"Why are you so paranoid, Mulder?"
"Oh, I don't know. Maybe it's because I find it hard to trust anybody."
- Scully & Mulder, The X-Files, "Ascension"

You forgot one..."Just because you think you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you." But really, quoting the X-Files??

So a company is making a profit? Really?? How un-American of them.

Let's not forget that there was a massive push by a lot of people; individual citizens, the Government, media, etc. for these vaccines to be produced as soon as possible.

I find it hilarious that we've got people here, of apparently the same anti-Government mind-set, trashing Obama for for not producing enough vaccine to meet the goals he set, and then we have you telling us that they're producing them too quickly.

Just can't seem to make you guys happy, huh?

 

[The Beep Goes On]

Well, nothing's perfect. This planet is a complicated place and almost all issues are only separated by a few degrees. Even people with the same general mindset can have widely varying beliefs concerning certain issues. And, to clarify, I am anti-big-government, not anti-government in general.

Glad you liked the quotes. No one gets out of here alive, so have some fun while you're here.

 

[Smee]

There have been 32 successful flu vaccinations since 1976 when a mistake occurred.
Obviously since then, improvements have been made.
If you still live in fear 33 years later, then how will you react and protect yourself when
the Big pandemic hits home for example an easily spread Cancer Virus or a mutated non-blood spread HIV.

Darn! I misread it I thought he said: "If you still live in fear 33 years later, then how will you react and protect yourself when
the Big pandemic hits home for example an easily spread Cancer Virus or a mutated non-blood spread HIV."

Read it again. The "IF" relates to someone living in fear 33 years later, then the "possibilities" are not stated as something yet to be developed, but a "pandemic" of a "Cancer Virus" or "non-blood spread HIV".

Who knows what darkness lies in the mind of pigiron? Maybe he has plans? He states things that sure make one wonder because of his apparent hatred of all things American, especially his veiled racial statements in other topics at in this portion of Tnet.

Until then, let's deal in what was REALLY SAID, not what you want to change it to say.

 

[Smee]

Wow, paranoid much? How about this? If you don't want the shot, don't take it.

Just because you choose to believe that there's some vast conspiracy surrounding this illness doesn't mean there is, and to sit at home and make accusations like some of you are is irresponsible, to say the least.

Where did I allege that it was a conspiracy?

I question the effectiveness and safety of a vaccine, and you want to get me fitted for an aluminum foil beanie.

Realistically, I looked at the previous "pandemic", and the solution, and decided not to get involved in being a test subject. I made the same decision for myself and my children as your savior did. He's ok, I'm crazy? Don't think so . . .

The jury is still out on the "safety" of this vaccine. No human trials, but we are to take their word that the vaccine is safe?

Do you remember who it was that marched U.S. Soldiers into harms way back in the late 40's? They marched them very close to ground zero of an atomic blast but told them "It isn't dangerous to you." Sure, you can trust them all, I choose not to until I have reason to believe something is REALLY safe.

 

[Smee]

Let's not forget that there was a massive push by a lot of people; individual citizens, the Government, media, etc. for these vaccines to be produced as soon as possible.

I find it hilarious that we've got people here, of apparently the same anti-Government mind-set, trashing Obama for for not producing enough vaccine to meet the goals he set, and then we have you telling us that they're producing them too quickly.

Just can't seem to make you guys happy, huh?

The problem is the MEDIA (it would help to READ my posts) is shoving this stuff down the throats of the American public, creating a panic among the masses of sheeple who are so easily scared into anything. They are being convinced that they MUST have this vaccine! Thus the panic among some.

Now, look at how newspaper distribution numbers have DROPPED over the past several years. The decline in viewers for the nightly news. The decline in viewers for other news outlets. Then remember: Numbers is how they are figure their advertising rates. Low numbers, lowered advertising revenue. Lowered revenue, fewer reporters. So . . . "Let's spice things up, create a panic which leaves the public thirsting for knowledge! Create an event that could end life as we know it! Scare the Bejesus out of them, and they'll watch us, read us, and we'll be important again. We can save their lives if they'll just pay attention to US!"

Are they concerned about creating a panic? Yes they are, because it will give them more news to cover.

There was a guy I knew in New Orleans. We used to do upholstery repairs on used vehicles, but this one old boy came up with a way to repair windshields. If you had a peck in the glass, he could make it disappear. Man, he made money hand over fist for months. Then, one night, a manager at a Datsun dealership saw him parked across the street from the used car lot. He was pinging those windshields, then fixin them the next day. Create a need and fill it.

 

[ClonedSIM]

Well, nothing's perfect. This planet is a complicated place and almost all issues are only separated by a few degrees. Even people with the same general mindset can have widely varying beliefs concerning certain issues. And, to clarify, I am anti-big-government, not anti-government in general.

Glad you liked the quotes. No one gets out of here alive, so have some fun while you're here.

Hey, I can agree with you that pharamecutical companies need to thoroughly test anything they intend to market, but in this particular instance, with the fervor that had been built around it, I don't know if the company could have survived the backlash they would have received by further delaying the release of the vaccines they were producing.

My question to you, since you seem to be quite knowledgeable in the subject, is this: How many deaths would have occurred had the vaccine not been produced at all?

Until we know this with any kind of certainty, which will probably be never, then it's impossible to say for a fact that the vaccine was released too quickly.

 

[ClonedSIM]

Let's not forget that there was a massive push by a lot of people; individual citizens, the Government, media, etc. for these vaccines to be produced as soon as possible.

I find it hilarious that we've got people here, of apparently the same anti-Government mind-set, trashing Obama for for not producing enough vaccine to meet the goals he set, and then we have you telling us that they're producing them too quickly.

Just can't seem to make you guys happy, huh?

The problem is the MEDIA (it would help to READ my posts) is shoving this stuff down the throats of the American public, creating a panic among the masses of sheeple who are so easily scared into anything. They are being convinced that they MUST have this vaccine! Thus the panic among some.

Now, look at how newspaper distribution numbers have DROPPED over the past several years. The decline in viewers for the nightly news. The decline in viewers for other news outlets. Then remember: Numbers is how they are figure their advertising rates. Low numbers, lowered advertising revenue. Lowered revenue, fewer reporters. So . . . "Let's spice things up, create a panic which leaves the public thirsting for knowledge! Create an event that could end life as we know it! Scare the Bejesus out of them, and they'll watch us, read us, and we'll be important again. We can save their lives if they'll just pay attention to US!"

Are they concerned about creating a panic? Yes they are, because it will give them more news to cover.

There was a guy I knew in New Orleans. We used to do upholstery repairs on used vehicles, but this one old boy came up with a way to repair windshields. If you had a peck in the glass, he could make it disappear. Man, he made money hand over fist for months. Then, one night, a manager at a Datsun dealership saw him parked across the street from the used car lot. He was pinging those windshields, then fixin them the next day. Create a need and fill it.

You're absolutely right, the public is convinced they have to have the vaccine. And they are the ones who will be taking it in the arm as well, so what is there to complain about? If a person is panicked enough about something, they'll do whatever is necessary to get what they think they need. But, you're not giving the average person enough credit. Most folks are smart enough to judge for themselves whether or not to take something they think will keep them healthy. And a few folks are going to have a reaction, it's as simple as that.

It's happened with medicines and foods for thousands of years. Even the most well-tested drugs can cause reactions in certain people, maybe just one in 10,000, maybe even more rare than that. Not only this, but even drugs approved and being widely used can cause deadly side-effects in certain individuals. That stop-smoking drug, Chantix, can cause some people to have suicidal thoughts that may be acted upon. Should we pull it from the market?

You seem to have a general distrust of everything, Smee, regardless of it's primary intention. I'm surprised you even spend time online given what can be stolen from you on the Internet.

Good story about the window repairer, though. Find (create) a need and fill it.

 

[pygmy]

af1733 said "You seem to have a general distrust of everything, Smee, regardless of it's primary intention. I'm surprised you even spend time online given what can be stolen from you on the Internet."
It's not for me to judge Smee; only he can look back to determine what has caused his over-sensitivity and general mistrust of authority and government and whether it has grounds in fact
or fantasy.

 

[ClonedSIM]

af1733 said "You seem to have a general distrust of everything, Smee, regardless of it's primary intention. I'm surprised you even spend time online given what can be stolen from you on the Internet."
It's not for me to judge Smee; only he can look back to determine what has caused his over-sensitivity and general mistrust of authority and government and whether it has grounds in fact
or fantasy.

Yeah, you're right Pigiron. I guess I need to emphasize that I don't want to flag anyone as paranoid so much as I really want to understand what drives their seemingly paranoid feelings.

It just doesn't make sense to me that anyone would blame the media, the government, the pharamecutical companies, whomever, just because they don't want to take a vaccine, or believe that it doesn't work.

I mean, if you don't want to get the shot, then don't get it, simple as that. But, if you want to paint all these other groups as guilty of something, then either produce proof of this or else come right out and say that you're just guessing.

The whole world's gone soft. No one wants to own up to their own actions anymore, when it's so much easier to blame someone else for their problems.....

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

It is impossible to get the flu from a flu shot - period. The 2 to 3 days "symptoms" that some people experience is from your own body - making antibodies for the possible onslaught of illness. The fever, chills, etc., that some may experience is your own body reacting - but it is not the flu.
In fact, if you got a flu shot today - you would not be fully protected for 2-4 weeks after the shot, because that's how long it takes your body to make all the antibodies that it needs.

The link about GBS killing more people than die from flu is also bull. While GBS is a "syndrome" - and there is no cure, just treatments - the information first - was from 1976 (some of us remember it well), it was from an actual shot (not a nasal spray), and on the occasions it did present itself, most people survived, and the people that did die, were all compromised in some way or another, and probably would have died if they had gotten the swine flu. Also, in some older and/or compromised individuals, even a flu shot with no consequences may not be able to make the appropriate antibodies.

Just went to the doctor today, and just found out that we have had 30+ cases right here in our town. (all our doctors and nurses have been immunized for H1N1, but its not even available for the public yet.)

The biggest reason for declaring an emergency for the H1N1, is it takes that declaration to get it distributed in a faster than a snail's pace - normal vaccines take so long that, doctors are giving shots for the flu quite a bit longer than it is needed (weeks after an epidemic has started). It also takes that designation for hospitals to bypass some regulations (like designating an area especially for swine flu patients, with certain regulations for visitors, etc.) It also helps clear some of the garbage of getting to see a doctor, or go into a hospital (like preapprovals, etc. can be fast-tracked), along with the distribution of the anti-virals to treat H1N1)

If it makes people a little more aware, I am for it. Anyone here who works in a public job (stores, etc), probably already know this - but, every times people get sick, they might take off work, but they just use the day off to go shopping - and spreading their germs.

More than 1,000 people have died in the US already, in the last 6 months. (100 were children) I don't think it hurts to be careful or pro-active - everyone knows how long it takes to get help AFTER an emergency has already started.

The biggest thing is - it isn't new. Several areas have already been declared "emergency status" (heck, the Bay Area had 58 deaths in the last couple of weeks). Add to that fact, is the fact that THIS swine flu is a brand new one - not the same swine from 1976 - it is one we have never seen before, and a strain that seems to like children.

If I was pregnant, or one of my family were pregnant, or if they have children (which they do), I would hope that, if they didn't get the vaccine, that treatment would be immediately available with pre-planning.

Also, health emergencies have always been self-limiting. Now, if the risk passed, and they still had the state of health emergency, I would have a problem with it.

B