One For Crispin

[pippinwhitepaws]

Typography Book Explores What It Feels Like To Have Dyslexia

 

[Dave44]

Hey Dave, I do have a problem at times, keeping threads and thoughts on track. I do appreciate, when someone gently nudges or directs me, back on track.

Please do expound on what your main concern is, atm(here or on the other thread). Sympathy burnout? Emotional fatigue?
I'll try to keep up, and my intention is not to cause confusion. You can even tell me to butt out, too, LOL!
Hope all have a good day, and find the treasures and answers, you seek.

Never, ever would I tell you to butt out! My concern was the investigations about why some children in our society now think they need to kill many people, What is driving them to that point? But that is there. And we are side tracked with this thread. And may even be under attack from a newcomer to this thread.

 

[Crispin]

(" The hallmark symptoms of Schizophrenia are thought disorders and disorganization".
Crispin, your quote there scared me a little. Is having too many thoughts at once, considered a "thought disorder"? Have you ever worked with small children who tell you, they can't turn their brains off?
Is organized chaos, ok? I mean, something that may look disorganized to another, may be organized(to a degree), by the one who has organized. I know there are many offshoots and extremes in this also, just set it on the back burner or in the bottom file, for now.)


I appreciate these types convo's. This fella is doing some remarkable work at Baylor, atm, David Eagleman Ph.d.
His article/paper on the Bell Tower shooter, also shows empathy from one, who KNEW something was not right within himself, but then had no (or seemed to have no) free will, to employ empathy, towards those he was shooting at.

http://www.eaglemanlab.net/papers/Eagleman Atlantic The Brain on Trial.pdf

I am a proponent for proper perception. Being taught that; "perception is the lamp of earthly life". I have come to believe folks perceive the world around them in one of three ways; with anger, with fear, or with love(positive perception).
If you have the mindset, to seek out the good and positive from your perceived environment, and look for the good, before acknowledging the negatives, then you are seeing and finding the good and better things of life. You develop an open mind to grow in proper positive directions.
One that views their environment with fear, can develop avoidance issues, along with other ranges of personality disorders. This is usually a closed stunted mind.
One that has anger for their perceived enviroment, may attempt to seek out to destroy that, which they do not like. This is also a closed mind.
Fear and anger will NOT cancel each other out and BOTH perpetuate the other.
Love(positive perception), on the other hand, can cancel BOTH anger and fear.

No matter what comes your way, or what your environment may be, I was taught that if we practice seeing the good of the world, that it would actually CHANGE our brains for the better. This was taught to me 40 or more yrs ago, before brain plasticity was even seriously considered by anyone, other than maybe Luria.

Imho, the only reason one would do the terrible horrible things, these killers have done, is lack of love(positive perception).
The have lost or never had love(positive perception) for either themselves or those around them. My teacher was also a proponent for prisoner rehabilitation, through showing that prisoner how to restore love and positive perceptions for himself, and the world around hm.

I wonder if we can teach our young today, better perceptions for their worlds, in SPITE of all the media hype and overflow of information(not always the best info either), they are bombarded with daily.

PTC: There is so much to respond to in your reply that I'm just going to pick the first one. Children cannot be diagnosed with schizophrenia. Although, we do not know what causes schizophrenia we know a lot about what contributes to the disease. Excess dopamine in the brain is a huge factor; hence, most antipsychotics target blockade of dopamine receptors. Another role is the poor organization of thoughts in the frontal lobe. Children's brains have not developed enough to have organized thoughts. I'm sure you are aware of the work that talks about what age children become able to understand concrete vs. abstract thinking and then later on moral decision making. This is why it doesn't bother us when children have imaginary friends, believe in Santa Clause, or are scared of monsters under the bed. Obviously, if it continues past a certain age then we start to consider the possibility of schizophreniform ds....or prodromal schizophrenia.

If you are worried about yourself having schizophrenia...forget it. Having met you and "chatted" this long it is an impossibility. I would have known it within five minutes of meeting you.

Much love sweetheart! I'm going to check out the other thread and then figure out where I want to continue my train of thought on this matter.

Crispin

 

[worldtalker]

Were it be possible to see the Spirit world there would be a LOT of activity,Children see this.

GodBless Chris

 

[pippinwhitepaws]

Were it be possible to see the Spirit world there would be a LOT of activity,Children see this.

GodBless Chris

most religions that accept the use of medicinal plants to induce visions believe it is possible to see/visit the spirit world.
peyote religion, sun dance, 40 days in the desert...ect.

 

[Dave44]

PTC: There is so much to respond to in your reply that I'm just going to pick the first one. Children cannot be diagnosed with schizophrenia. Although, we do not know what causes schizophrenia we know a lot about what contributes to the disease. Excess dopamine in the brain is a huge factor; hence, most antipsychotics target blockade of dopamine receptors. Another role is the poor organization of thoughts in the frontal lobe. Children's brains have not developed enough to have organized thoughts. I'm sure you are aware of the work that talks about what age children become able to understand concrete vs. abstract thinking and then later on moral decision making. This is why it doesn't bother us when children have imaginary friends, believe in Santa Clause, or are scared of monsters under the bed. Obviously, if it continues past a certain age then we start to consider the possibility of schizophreniform ds....or prodromal schizophrenia.

If you are worried about yourself having schizophrenia...forget it. Having met you and "chatted" this long it is an impossibility. I would have known it within five minutes of meeting you.

Much love sweetheart! I'm going to check out the other thread and then figure out where I want to continue my train of thought on this matter.

Crispin

That is exactly the reason I feel scattered on this subject!

I feel it.

By the way, you asked so.
If I sympathize with you- it is a polite thing to say. But do I feel it, really? Is sympathy is a term that simply describes empathetical feelings? I think one can be taught to say it, but mean it?

I hate when I spin in circles! But occasionally I love the chicken and egg thing.

 

[pat-tekker-cat]

That is exactly the reason I feel scattered on this subject!

I feel it.

By the way, you asked so.
If I sympathize with you- it is a polite thing to say. But do I feel it, really? Is sympathy is a term that simply describes empathetical feelings? I think one can be taught to say it, but mean it?

I hate when I spin in circles! But occasionally I love the chicken and egg thing.

Dave, WE ALL SPIN, in circles, at times! LOL! Some of us have a more challenging task at staying on track, also. Guess what? It's ok, too!
It's part of a normal process of discovering ourselves, and teaching ourselves. Any of our views and outlooks can be changed, when presented with new info and/or conditions. This is why man can be oxy-moronic, in that, what may have applied today, tomorrow does not serve as well. Gotta learn to role with them changes, my friend.
I like eggs and chickens, too! LOL!

My Mom was older, and maybe knew how to better train a childs mind, than a younger parent. Even though I would go ballistic when watching Omaha's Wild Kingdom, I would cry and scream, when animals had to do what animals do to survive. To me, it was way too traumatic at 4 and 5 yrs old. BUT,
I could walk right outside and stick my finger in the dogs eyes(and he let me, which mom was amazed at), and pick up my cat by the tail and swing him like a helicopter blade(sorry Blacky, you know I was young). Now, when my mom CAUGHT me doing that to Blacky, she ran out there, grabbed me by my hair,(yes, they used pain as a deterrent), and yanked me away from the cat. She said to me, "How would you like someone to swing YOU around by your tail/hair? I can do it RIGHT NOW! Would you like that"? Then she would tell me to go SIT AND THINK about what she just said, and not bother her, till I come to realize, why I should apologize for how I THOUGHT, I was gonna treat Blacky.

If I tried to appease to her for love and acceptance, she would with hold my reward, until I could explain(to the best of my understanding), my actions. I was made to THINK. Now, if I came back with misunderstandings, she knew how to direct the thoughts for the proper outcome. These are not things, I believe people are "just born with". These are things that are learned and can be taught.
But, tell me what parent has time, nowadays? We want "others" to teach and mold our young minds. That's what worries me, is that no one thinks these things are important enough, to address in the here and now.
I can remember hearing my mom say to herself, under her breath, "don't hit the kid in anger, don't hit the kid in anger......" Even she, had to practice control. Sometimes waiting for my pucishment to come(while she dealt with her anger), was more torturous than the punishment! She would always explain to me, why I was being punished, too. ARG! LOL!

You wonder why phychs and big pharma got a corner on the market of our minds? Because we will not take the grip on it, ourselves!
Ok, The tides going out, I may have messed up everyone really bad here, so I will go see of there's any treasure out there, and report back later! Good luck ya'll!

 

[Dave44]

Great Post Patkr!

I have been part of that myself. I watch parents, amazing what you see in public. What I expect to see is what you described! What I usually see when a child is misbehaving badly is cajoling, begging and bribing. But no ramification for the offense. Some say it has to be subtle, Maybe, I still contend children are instinctively Empathetic, and it could be used to advantage, but is it the right way? If you are always plucking the strings do you stand to destroy natural empathy?
( I know crispin, you say it is rare, and you have alot more training than I do, but just watch, quietly, people with their children and the kids reactions.)

I used to train horses.. you would be amazed at what a horse can pick up on in a persons demeanor as they are simply walking toward them.

 

[pat-tekker-cat]

LOL! Dave, My best metal detecting friend, her and her husband has a horse racing farm down here! They are racing at Gulf Stream right now. I'm leaving to meet her right now! They are always wanting good trainers! Did you see the girl trainer on the tv the other day? The blonde that had the heart transplant? My friends know her real well, and love her(I can't recall her, the blondes name, atm).

Her(my friends) son-n-law is a world famous jockey from Belize, or was till he got all busted up. I laugh recalling him going to care for the kings' horses in Dubai, lol! Said they take you passport from you, the minute you step off the plane. They MAKE SURE, you gonna treat their horseys right! Said, you don't get your passport back, till you start to step back on the plane! LOL!

Ya'll have fun, I'm gonna go try to get some treasures! mew mew rawr!

Oh, I almost forgot. We, my friend and her husband, because he knows kinesiology, we will watch the way ppl walk on the beach boardwalk. He can always tell, from how a person walks, what and where they may have problems, or could have problems, in the future. He been with horses for 60, 70 years!

 

[bill from lachine]

Crispin,

Since I tripped over this thread.....I guess I'll add my 2 cents to the discussion.

Until you told me I was an empath....heck I didn't even know it....lol.

But I always wondered why coworkers, friends even acquantances would open up and share their hard times with me.

Heck even during my single party days I'd go for a quiet beer or 2 and have the barmaid crying on my shoulder and telling me her life story.

Like Crispin I've learned to dial it down a bit and try to avoid people who are users or drain my emotional batteries.

If you're an empath you have to selectively choose how much of yourself you can give without burning out.

Hope that gives a bit of layman's version of the whole empathy issue.

Regards + HH

Bill

Dave: Simulated violence in children is not a new thing. Compare it to the gladiators of Spartacus' time, the Uncle Tom's of 19th century america, public beheadings in 16th century france, or hangings in the Wild West. In some ways, our children are exposed to less violence.

The other day one of my nephew's friend met my puppy (in the avatar.) He is about three years old and was playing with a toy gun. He was not familiar with dogs and a little put off by her friendliness. He followed her around the room yelling "bad dog, bad dog" and shooting the gun. I didn't have to say a word...his parents were on him immediately and scolded him. Children have been playing cops and robbers, cowboys and indians, and other simulations of violence for many years. Granted it is a lot more high tech now. What a children is exposed to is not as important as how his/her parents and role models respond to it. Just like you did with your niece.

I am not avoiding your question about children being exposed to a lifetime of violent videos...I just don't know the answer. I don't think anybody does.

When it comes to children there are two predominant theories in psychology I find of the utmost importance:

1. "Unconditional, positive regard." Carl Rodgers, from Humanism. Simply put, it means never tell a child they are bad. Tell the child their actions were bad, tell them they did a bad thing, but never tell them they are bad. Always give them unconditional love.

2. "Good enough mothering." Dr. Winnicot, pediatrician. Simply put, no mother/father is a perfect match for any baby/child. However, as long as the match is 'good enough' the child will develop into a normal, moral human being.

Empathy is boundless, it can never be undone, it can only be burned out...Bill can explain this if we are lucky enough for him to grace us with an explanation.

I'm done for the night. My emotive neurons are drained. I need sleep to recharge.

God bless,

Crispin