Possible Ramrod Tip??

[BioProfessor]

I have been looking for the site of an old fort built in the early 1700's in Blue Earth County Minnesota. I have located the confluence of the two rivers where the fort was built. I cannot gain access to the area where the fort was most likely built and it may actually have a subdivision built over it now - main subdivision road is River Fort Drive. I decided to hunt a large pasture across the river from the possible site thinking that the 20-30 soldiers at the fort probably wandered around hunting, fishing, or whatever. I found this item in that pasture. It is iron (magnetic) and seems to be filled with iron (or something dense because it is heavy for its size). It has a grove that runs around the middle if the item. It is not very deep or has rusted over. The material filling it is not as soft as lead should be but 300 years in the ground may change the characteristics. The top of the item is slightly convex. My first impression is that it is part of a ramrod but I'm just not sure. I am trying to identify it and possibly tie it to the fort and the time frame. If it is from the fort or the period, I plan to search the pasture in greater detail. The only other item in the pasture that is possibly related was part of a horse halter (iron ring). I would appreciate any input you may have.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A History of Mining on the Kenai Peninsula, Alaska - Grab it through Amazon!

[TreasureTales]

Welcome to TreasureNet! It's nice to have you aboard. Your hunting site sounds interesting. You're right to hunt the pasture for things left behind by the soldiers. They would have wandered all over the area, so don't let the subdivision dampen your resolve to seek treasure!

This thing almost looks like some sort of plug to me, but I really have no idea. There are some excellent relic and militaria hunters on TNet, just give them time to find your thread and I'm sure they will be able to help you.

 

[EDDE]

its a knockout/plug of the sorts
i find them now but of aluminium

 

[pgill]

BioProfessor, the item you have found is from a press. When they press a hole into thick steel or whatever material the punch pushes that plug out. The hole in the centre of the plug is the line up hole that the operator will use to make sure that he is in line correctly. I have used these presses, and you cannot believe just how thick steel you can push a hole through.

Hope this helps you.....

God bless
Peter

 

[hasbeen]

pgill nailed it .I know because I have a punch press in my shop, if I had a penny for every slug I've punched ,I'd be a rich man.

hasbeen

 

[fairfinder59]

Sorry, I don't believe pgill nailed it! I worked in a Manufacturing plant and here are a few pieces from a punched piece that are 3/16" thick and the punch is the same size as the piece being punched. There is no center that would make a indentation like the one that Bioprofesser displayed. So with that, consider how deep it was and being that it was found around with the indian head I would have to believe that it could be a rod tip, it would make more sense considering the age. But this is just one mans opinion. Thanks have a great day!!

 

[l.cutler]

I don't think it is a ramrod tip, but may be a cleaning jag for a muzzleloading musket. It looks like it may have ridges around the edge, if so I think this may be it.

 

[fairfinder59]

Possible? That would be more of a better guess then a rod tip..

 

[BioProfessor]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the help. I guess this is one of the things that make this hobby so interesting. You find stuff you have never seen before and you meet new friends to help you out. My response to the idea that it is the end of a press punch. I can't afford a real press so I have a small manual one I put in a vice to punch out round pieces of metal. The cutting end of the punch is very flat and the edge very sharp. The piece I have has a convex (domed) top and the edge seems to be somewhat rounded (again 300 years in the ground changes things). If this were in a press to cut circles, wouldn't it put a pretty good indentation in the blank? Wouldn't it come out sort of domed itself? Also to finding ones made of aluminum. Again, I just have a real cheap press but the whole thing is made of hardened steel. Would aluminum be too soft to cut other metal. The outside of the item is steel and is filled with something. It doesn't seem to be machined out of a single piece. Is that the way punches were made in the "olden days?" Just an observation from an amateur metalworker and maybe I'm missing the point of what you are saying. I'm on my first cup of coffee today. I'm in no way trying to be disrespectful to anyones help. I just trying to input some more information.

I really do appreciate the help. I've got a feeling this is going to be a good site to be a member of and might be as much fun as finding stuff (not the gold stuff though).

Daryl

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

I don't believe it is a ramrod tip. No way of securing it (They are normally sleeved to fit over a wood rammer and pinned in place). I also doubt it is a cleaning attachment for a rammer. Steel or iron would be a bad choice as it is as hard as the barrel and would scratch. The ones that are made of iron are usually designed to hold cloth or tow as the cleaning scrubber and have a lot of ridges or are corkscrew shaped. The double helix version is what was issued fror the Brown Bess of the 1700's

The originals were forged - this copy has seperate wire tines. And this basic design was used right up through the CW Springfields & beyond.

That would be what it isn't, which is only a slight help in what it is.

 

[hasbeen]

That slug was punched on the type of press known as an ironworker. Ironworker punches are made with a pointed tip in the center of the punch to align with a center punched mark or even an x mark made with a pencil.When the locater tip is broken from the punch it will leave cupped impression similar to ypurs.The dommed top on the pictured slug is due to the fact that ironworker dies have more clearance to allow for punching thicker material.

I have no doubt that the pictured slug is from an ironworker punch press.

hasbeen

 

[BioProfessor]

Yeah!! Thanks!!!!

Wouldn't expect to find a punch press in the middle of a horse pasture in the middle of nowhere but I guess you can.

Thanks for the help. Now I know the site may not be producing what I was hoping.

Is this a great forum or what!

 

[hasbeen]

Slugs from an ironworker are notorious for getting caught in pant's cuffs,almost every time I'd use the press for more than a few holes I'd have to empty my pant's cuffs.

hasbeen

 

[BioProfessor]

I was looking at some sites for metal detecting and came across some items that might be put in the mix to be considered. Not to say that it isn't from a metal press but The size for the Pin Box is correct (5/8"). The brush for the Oil Bottle would have been attached to the top and left a "hole" where it was attached.

Possible??

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

The caps for both of the oil bottles are threaded. In female (threads inside) and the lowe one male (threads outside). Does your piece have threads?

As for finding it in a field . . . did kids use slingshots in that region in tha last 100 years or so?

Trouble with Civil War sites, or Revolutionary, or Pontiac's Rebellion, or F&I War, or what have you, is that only Gettysburg was set aside to be left relatively untouched. More were set aside in the early 1900's under Teddy Roosevelt when it became aparant that nature and history was being destroyed at alarming rates. The rest have had almost 150 years of activity on them. Plowing, lumbering, picnicing, etc. I've found clad coins from the 80's in 9" of soil where I hunt. Things get jumbled up where the soil is worked.