Santa Susana Ca Stage Robbery

[Havilah_Springs]

Hello oldergoate,

I think you meant to address your last post to jdubau as he was the one asking the questions that you replied to. However I am confused, is the "Lizard Head Rock" above the cemetery as I have been all over the area and the only thing I have seen is what the locals used to call "Whales Mouth" which has Native American Pictographs painted at the base of it.

H_S

 

[motell6]

hs,I located a buried shack near lookout point,I have seen some very old pictographs high up on a cliff wall, if I ever get there again I will send you a email,and we will try and and the gold stash with the clues I have.og

 

[jdubau]

Hello Oldergoat!

So what your saying is that the small cave hidden by foilage and the dried up spring are both somewhat close together and they are both above "west" of the cemetery. Thank you in advance jdubau

 

[jdubau]

Hello H_S
I'm definitely up for New Years Day just let me know what your planning on doing I live in east simi (Katherine and Kuehner) my email is jdubau2147@yahoo.com hope to hear from you jdubau

 

[motell6]

jdubau,I aint saying that at all,you are ! but I do know for a fact that a large Chest buried near Castle rocks was unearthed one very late Christmas night in the late 1980"s...some silver dollars were found close to the stage trail,a slot machine was uncovered in a shallow cave,I know of a old army calvery outpost found by accident in someones backyard close to Woodland Hills,and the beat goes on.

 

[jdubau]

hey tapoutking

if you can give me more info on the location of the house on the bluff that you were talking about i might be able to get you some info on it, i have access to new and old property records..... let me know

 

[tapoutking]

Here it is before it burnt down. Find it on google earth:

LAT: 34°16'27.32"N
LONG: 118°36'26.48"W

 

[Vectorsumio]

In the 1800?s a stagecoach was robbed near stony point. the robber was shot. He road up in to the hills and buried the gold. Then road down to his girl friends house and He told her what I told you and died. Years later after she died the info was discovered in her diary.
Does anyone know the maiden name of the woman who died and what year?

Any info on this would be appreciated
Thanks
Bill

Hi there! I know this thread is pretty old but I have been coming here looking at all that has been shared about this "local legend." I am new to the forums and to the hobby. I did want to go ahead and share some of what I've learned about this particular legend though. I've been digging deep into the history of the area and also the potential credibility of the story. Here's a few interesting facts;

1. Don Jose de la Guerra was the only "land owner" outside of the Chumash tribes in the early 1800's in the Simi Valley. (meaning the only "rich" man with potential daughter(s))
2. Another "land owner" was Noriega but that was further west in the area of Santa Barbara. (Very well known military man and was also "rich")
3. American families didn't settle Simi until late 1800's between 1860-70. They weren't considered "rich."
4. I have two names of real bandits from this area that can be proven to be in the area at roughly the right time but no crimes of this magnitude are attributed to them.

I plan to travel to Santa Barbara's Mission Library to discover names and potential documents that may or may not point to creditable potential "rich daughters" in this area.
(would be fantastic to discover THE actual diary but I'm not keeping my hopes up)

I spoke with a Historian today (the reason I'm posting) who literally wrote a book about this area in incredible detail. I was disappointed to learn she hadn't ever heard of the story.
I have also spoken to a member of the Public Library here that attended the first Simi Valley church in the knolls who's Sunday school teacher talked much about that legend to her students.
I do have her (Sunday school teacher) name and also plan on talking to her soon assuming she's still around.

I will post my results; Havilah_Springs Your information was a fantastic starting point for me and the reason I will share here!

 

[flipstash]

Ghostdog
Was the spring a sulfur hot spring, or just a spring? I ask this because I have not found the sulfur spring. I have followed most streams public and private and found all kind of shells, musket balls and junk iron. I also found two places that I think the ranch might have been, but that is just a guess.

The slot machine I thought was stolen from the Pass club in the sixties. That is the place on top of the hill with the cell tower on it now. My grandfather was part owner of it until his passing in the early eighty's. I have asked about the machine to all of the family members and no one really remembers about a theft but they said there was some slots.


Thanks
Bill

UUmm...
You're a straight up liar!! My Grandparents opened The Pass Club in the fifties and MY grandfather died in 1955 and I have no cousins name Bill! Also, there were NEVER SLOT MACHINES there! EVER! It wasn't a casino...It was a cardroom.
I am just wondering...why would you lie about that?

 

[Phanntom]

The plot thickens.

 

[Jim in Idaho]

Here are more photos of the Chatsworth Stage Station:

View attachment 587886
Rocks in center are part of the foundation of the stage station

View attachment 587887
View looking N/E from stage station, Chatsworth in the background

View attachment 587888
Cistern / Well near station

View attachment 587889
Top of wall at cistern, 20’ in diameter

View attachment 589358
Inside cistern (4’ of exposed wall)

View attachment 589359
The stage station was perimetered with Olive trees

View attachment 589360
Aerial View of Chatsworth Stage Station

View attachment 589361
Butterfield Stage route through the Santa Susana Pass​

There is a great amount of history at this site from Early Horizon Culture, Chumash, Butterfield Stage Line, a Chinese camp, to a Depression Period encampment. Chatsworth Park South used to be a rock quarry for the breakwaters in San Pedro before it was discovered that the sandstone desolved in saltwater.

I have more photos to post, but I will wait a bit as this old fart needs a nap. Hope you enjoyed.

H_S

Great pics!...I'm looking forward to seeing more. I lived in Simi Valley from 1954-1965. Left after my junior year of high school. I lived on Cochran St most of my younger years. used to play at the old stage barn, which was located on a hill where the high school now stands. My dad worked at the Rocketdyne facility during the space-race years.
Jim

 

[OmegaMan]

Really? Straight up liar is kinda harsh. My Grandfather was a silent partner and screwed out of property ownership. I will not post his name on here. If you would have sent me a message, we could have compared notes. You came out and accused me of being a liar without really knowing the facts. I read over what I posted about him being part owner until his passing. I don't know what year he was screwed out of it. Now I'm only going by what the Family has passed down to me.

Next time try being a little nicer instead of being a complete DICK!

 

[jackrook]

Kinda d thread but maybe we can bring this back to life since its local

 

[Nicksan]

Kinda d thread but maybe we can bring this back to life since its local

The problem with hunting this area is that it is in a state park and there is no digging of any kind or removing anything from a state park in california. If caught you would propably have your equipment confiscated and suffer a large fine.

 

[trackerja@hotmail.com]

Yup been there done that and later found out it was a state park. You can go there and relax You can see most of the valley from some places up there it's A very interesting place to say the list.

 

[Joemandoo]

More family information.

Hi there! I know this thread is pretty old but I have been coming here looking at all that has been shared about this "local legend." I am new to the forums and to the hobby. I did want to go ahead and share some of what I've learned about this particular legend though. I've been digging deep into the history of the area and also the potential credibility of the story. Here's a few interesting facts;

1. Don Jose de la Guerra was the only "land owner" outside of the Chumash tribes in the early 1800's in the Simi Valley. (meaning the only "rich" man with potential daughter(s))
2. Another "land owner" was Noriega but that was further west in the area of Santa Barbara. (Very well known military man and was also "rich")
3. American families didn't settle Simi until late 1800's between 1860-70. They weren't considered "rich."
4. I have two names of real bandits from this area that can be proven to be in the area at roughly the right time but no crimes of this magnitude are attributed to them.

I plan to travel to Santa Barbara's Mission Library to discover names and potential documents that may or may not point to creditable potential "rich daughters" in this area.
(would be fantastic to discover THE actual diary but I'm not keeping my hopes up)

I spoke with a Historian today (the reason I'm posting) who literally wrote a book about this area in incredible detail. I was disappointed to learn she hadn't ever heard of the story.
I have also spoken to a member of the Public Library here that attended the first Simi Valley church in the knolls who's Sunday school teacher talked much about that legend to her students.
I do have her (Sunday school teacher) name and also plan on talking to her soon assuming she's still around.

I will post my results; Havilah_Springs Your information was a fantastic starting point for me and the reason I will share here!

I know this is an old thread, but I have lived a stones throw from the Devils Slide for a decade on the SFV side and now reside in Simi. Until just recently I haven't had the time to pursue the trail, but now with more time and the happenstance of finding all of the great information in this post, it has re invigorated me in the quest. Thank you all so much for the time and effort.
Maybe someone will want to join me sometime.

So heres what I know: On the Old Stage Station topic...Recently I re-visited the old stage station and found it now fenced off with signs saying "to protect natural features" The cisterns are what they are, but a recent burn has made the stage station more accessible if you're the fence crossing kind. Also the area just north has been recently plowed. So recently in fact that there isn't even a blade of grass growing yet. Curious...

But on to the real meat and potatoes. The above post is pretty accurate but with a one exception(please no offense intended), and I do have information to add.
Don Jose de la Guerra was the only wealthy land owner of some of that time, but the other name given is actually just an extension of his and often omitted in text. So his full name is, Don Jose de la Guerra y Noriega. He was the comandante of the Santa Barbara Presidio from 1815 to 1842. By about 1832 he had purchased El Rancho Simi from the Pico family. On that deed, about the second paragraph, they start to refer to him only as Senior Noriega which might explain the confusion.
Side note: The land sold for $1019.00 $819 in coin and the balance in goods.

His commanding officer while he was at Monterey had one daughter, Maria Antonia Julianna Carrillo y Lugo whom he married.
They had 14 children, and the best information that Ive found of the daughters are.. Dona Angustias, Rita de Jesus, Maria Teresa, Ana Maria and Maria Antonia.

I know on its face that this might not be a lot of help, but if the name of the girl ever pops up, at least there is a cross reference here. Also because Don Jose was of Spanish nobility it would be reasonable to assume that their marriages would be recorded at the Mission, and possible descendants traced.

One other thing...Santiago Pico the previous land owner shared the Rancho with a few other adults. Very little is known about them compared to Guerra, but his son Patricio married Beatriz Cota in 1799. Luis Pena and his wife Paula Segunda Cortez also lived there with their children, but I couldn't find their names or for how long. Seeing how the Spanish often include the fathers name in the children's after marriage, one might also look for these in doing any further research.

Conclusion: All of this information would really be used to support or debunk the story in the first place. For me I would really need to see the diary or a copy to really get excited. But absent that, I do have an idea of the only accessible area with any kind of spring or running water still left that the bad luck robber might have held up for the night. A cursory search is definitely in my future.
I hope my long windedness helps someone somewhere, and I apologize for any inaccuracies in the information. I look forward to any discussions.

 

[tapoutking]

Hoping to get out there soon. I would actually go tomorrow but I had something last minute come up.

 

[G-bone]

WOW...how awesome.
Thank you all for sharing what info you have on this area.
Very cool.

Hello all. Brand new to the site (first post actually)
Born in Santa Barbara and currently living in Thousand Oaks.
I have always been so fascinated with the past of my local surroundings.
Santa Barbara and Ventura in the 1800's and early 1900's and how the people lived is just amazing to me.
But even more so, was the life of the Chumash in these areas.

OK - why I am here....
Brand new to Treasure Hunting.
So I recently picked up a book by Frank L Fish.
It mentioned the Santa Susana Pass story.
And since my family and I have explored the Rocky Peak area many times, it caught my attention.
And after lots of internet searching, finally lead me to this web site and tread.

That whole area holds some very strong energy (And I don't mean the radiation from the 50's.... butum bum tiish!)
SO much history in and around these mountains.
I try to imagine the 1000's of years that the Chumash enjoyed these areas before Spain should up.
And can you imagine what the Spanish explorers must have thought of these valleys and mountains
In awe I am sure.

I could go on and on about my excitement of that history.

And it really sucks that it being a state park, keeps anyone from finding artifacts and potential treasures.
Particularly historical artifacts....why would you want us to find that stuff and bring it to light.
That was our history and our kids, and their kid's need to know it and see it.

I had heard that there was an old Indian Burial grounds in the area where they are now building new homes.
Right at the end of Kuehner (sp?)
Maybe not. But I know this area was very spiritual to the Indians.

in regards to the "Love Loot"
Lets bring this thread back to life!!
Would love to get this post going again and maybe getting a small exploring group together.

Is Havilah_Springs still out there?
I would love to just hook up over a cup of coffee with you some time and hear about your experiences.
And if your still able to explore? COME ON - LETS GO!! (thanks Jeff Williams)

Tapoutking too, if you're still into this stuff and want some company? PM me

PS, anyone know where to dig up some old maps of the area?
Older maps that may show the stage coach route etc, which may show old streams (now all dried up and overgrown).
Ventura County and SB county for that matter. Lots to explore that is NOT under government rule.


Thanks

G-bone

 

[Jkug]

New to the site and story. I'm down to go exploring though!!

 

[G-bone]

Boy oh boy - this is still getting me itchy and I want to explore some more on this.
Is anyone watching this thread and want to explore some more?
Lots of info here to follow on. I have been looking for old Spanish Topo's trying to find the lay of the land as it was back then.
Man the history alone of the area is remarkable to me and I always love trekking through the area.

The whole "state park" thing is a real hard pill to swallow for me.
The rules they impose seem a little extreme some times.
You can't even remove a rock from the area. WTF?!?!?

But - From the Maps I've seen, the State park is only on the south side of the 118 freeway into Chatsworth.
The opposite side of the freeway where Havilah_Springs took pictures of small stone hide out is NOT in "state park" boundaries (please correct me if I'm wrong here).

So if the Bandito stayed relatively level in his escape and went toward the north side of Simi (Entrance of Hummingbird trail area)
then there are no "state Park" regs.....right?!

If anyone is paying attention to this thread and wants to re-ignite a search party, I'm in.
Drop me a line.

G