Season 7 - The story goes on...

[lokiblossom]

I disagree that if it is coir, which may or may not have been formed into rope, that was found on an island, that it would indicate specifically Templars in any meaningful way.

Why not some group that was commonly actually using coir and not just may have because they could have if perhaps they wanted; even though there is no other evidence that they physically were present. Too speculative and too many "ifs".

Than you at least believe that somebody visited Oak Island before the 15th century that used "coir"?

And it isn't that they could have, the fact is they would have because there would have been no other choice. Outremer was a complete world unto itself during the period in question.

Cheers, Loki

 

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[ECS]

... I do hope that the moderator can see these last two posts for what they are, nonsense directed at me through the use of "coconut coir" and an angry response to that nonsense.

That parody was a take off on what Charlie P.(NY) posted, and has nothing whatsoever to do with you, unless of course you own the rights to the words "coconut coir", which you do not.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Than you at least believe that somebody visited Oak Island before the 15th century that used "coir"?

And it isn't that they could have, the fact is they would have because there would have been no other choice. Outremer was a complete world unto itself during the period in question.

Cheers, Loki

No. It is possible. Same as you cannot rule out that Polynesians might have visited Oak Island at that time. They had the ability and material.

The island has likely been visited by humans for tens of thousands of years (Mi'kmaq, Scandinavians, Basque, Portuguese, French, English, etc). It could also have been so degraded and contaminated that C-13 ions leeched in from seawater gave a false reading. I still have not seen or found what calibration database they used to C-14 date the meager sample; that may or may not have been coir. If it had been brought to Oak Island some time ago from some other region they would have had to use the calibration database developed for that region rather than the Oak Island area. Makes a BIG difference. Hundreds of years difference.

Here's an example - this is the calibration graph for Oak Island. (INTCAL13). There is also MARINE13 for marine life.


By Source (WP:NFCC#4), Fair use, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?curid=43152705

See that nice straight line running diagonally of how the ratio of C-13 vs. C-14 ions predict age? No, because it is very much not a straight line. They interpret the sample result against the calibration database to come up with an age; and also give a probability (i.e. 80% chance it is 600 years old +/- 100 years). If they used the North Atlantic database for something that lived on the equator the results would be much, much different.

 

[ECS]

You can slam the use of "coir" by Templars all you want, but you can't refute that it is indeed evidence of a 14th century presence of a small group of Knights Templar's on Oak Island...

Without any hard outside collaborating evidence of a Templar voyage across the Atlantic to Oak Island/Nova Scotia, the found sample of coconut coir is indeed NOT EVIDENCE of any 14th century presence of Templars or any other non indigenous groups visit to Oak Island.
That, my friend Loki, is known as force fitting non related circumstantial evidence to support one's personal pet theory.

 

[lokiblossom]

Without any hard outside collaborating evidence of a Templar voyage across the Atlantic to Oak Island/Nova Scotia, the found sample of coconut coir is indeed NOT EVIDENCE of any 14th century presence of Templars or any other non indigenous groups visit to Oak Island.
That, my friend Loki, is known as force fitting non related circumstantial evidence to support one's personal pet theory.

You must be a lawyer eh? Most of them are paid to deny circumstantial evidence and you do well at it.

I have shown scientific proof; of coconut coir dated to before the 15th century found on Oak Island, proof; the Knights Templar were in the only area where it could have been picked up in the Atlantic Basin and used on vessels during that time period, proof; that they had a large number of vessels at the same time, proof; that those vessels left the area from where the coir would have been used by those vessels, its common knowledge that all of those vessels disappeared in that same period with good reason not to be discovered, and its a fact that anybody else who had the ability or reason to make such a voyage would have made note of it,as in later voyages all of them did.

Even the Vikings who did not write about their earlier voyages left a well known record of their travels.

I have some more and interesting information on the use of coconut coir by the Arabs and their trading with the Christian nations of Outremer if you wish to hear it, but I will only post any more of this on my own thread "abbreviated theory" and leave "gazzahk's" thread alone. In other words, if you wish to answer this post do so on my thread because I won't answer you here!

Cheers, Loki

 

[ECS]

You must be a lawyer eh? Most of them are paid to deny circumstantial evidence and you do well at it...

...and you are well at fabricating proof from totally unrelated facts to support a pet theory that lacks actual real proof.

 

[lokiblossom]

You must be a lawyer eh? Most of them are paid to deny circumstantial evidence and you do well at it.

I have shown scientific proof; of coconut coir dated to before the 15th century found on Oak Island, proof; the Knights Templar were in the only area where it could have been picked up in the Atlantic Basin and used on vessels during that time period, proof; that they had a large number of vessels at the same time, proof; that those vessels left the area from where the coir would have been used by those vessels, its common knowledge that all of those vessels disappeared in that same period with good reason not to be discovered, and its a fact that anybody else who had the ability or reason to make such a voyage would have made note of it,as in later voyages all of them did.

Even the Vikings who did not write about their earlier voyages left a well known record of their travels.

I have some more and interesting information on the use of coconut coir by the Arabs and their trading with the Christian nations of Outremer if you wish to hear it, but I will only post any more of this on my own thread "abbreviated theory" and leave "gazzahk's" thread alone. In other words, if you wish to answer this post do so on my thread because I won't answer you here!

Cheers, Loki

Like I wrote, I will not answer you here!

Cheers, Loki

 

[Raparee]

Did Daniel McGinnis beat Samuel Ball to find the treasure, or did they both find parts of it? I find it hard to believe Samuel Ball could have become a leading landowner otherwise - perhaps comfortable middle class by hard work, but not a major wheeler dealer.

Bell’s wealth has been greatly exaggerated. At the time he was described as being no more prosperous as any other farmer in the area. He was certainly not the richest man in the province, as described by the show, or even a “major wheeler dealer”. He was just a hard working farmer.

 

[Raparee]

You can slam the use of "coir" by Templars all you want, but you can't refute that it is indeed evidence of a 14th century presence of a small group of Knights Templar's on Oak Island.

I can absolutely refute that. In the absence of any other corroborating material evidence supporting the claim that KT were responsible for depositing that coir (if that’s what it is), your premise is completely unsupported.

 

[lokiblossom]

Bell’s wealth has been greatly exaggerated. At the time he was described as being no more prosperous as any other farmer in the area. He was certainly not the richest man in the province, as described by the show, or even a “major wheeler dealer”. He was just a hard working farmer.

I know you live in the Province Raparee, but do you live near the Chester area? Just curious is all, no ulterior motive intended. I have only visited that area once and may ask for a few landscape type facts. Btw, I see that you posted a response to my earlier post, but as I mentioned I don't wish to continue to argue that point on someone else's thread.


Cheers, Loki

 

[lokiblossom]

I can absolutely refute that. In the absence of any other corroborating material evidence supporting the claim that KT were responsible for depositing that coir (if that’s what it is), your premise is completely unsupported.

Oh, what the hell: Yes, you and anyone else can refute that. You can refute that Pilgrims landed in North America in 1620 or that American men walked on the Moon in 1969, but that doesn't in any way prove it didn't happen. For years many historians refuted Vikings visiting North America before Columbus, how did that turn out?

Now, this is my, for sure, last post on this subject on this thread, Lol!

Cheers, Loki

 

[Raparee]

I know you live in the Province Raparee, but do you live near the Chester area? Just curious is all, no ulterior motive intended. I have only visited that area once and may ask for a few landscape type facts. Btw, I see that you posted a response to my earlier post, but as I mentioned I don't wish to continue to argue that point on someone else's thread.


Cheers, Loki

I’m in the Valley. Not quite an hour north of Chester.

 

[franklin]

I’m in the Valley. Not quite an hour north of Chester.

Raparee, Can you find any information on a man by the name of Pierre St. Martin Sr. and Pierre St. Martin Jr. They could have went by the name of just "Martin" instead of St. Martin. They lived up in your neck of the woods around 1730 to 1790. I would like to find out if they left any written records such as a Diary or Journals or even business papers. They may hold the "KEY" to Oak Island.

 

[gazzahk]

Bell’s wealth has been greatly exaggerated. At the time he was described as being no more prosperous as any other farmer in the area. He was certainly not the richest man in the province, as described by the show, or even a “major wheeler dealer”. He was just a hard working farmer.

Some interesting info on Sam Ball in this older thread

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/oak-island/531253-mystery-samuel-ball.html

 

[ECS]

Like I wrote, I will not answer you here!

...but you just had to take a look and respond. Cheers Loki!

 

[Raparee]

Raparee, Can you find any information on a man by the name of Pierre St. Martin Sr. and Pierre St. Martin Jr. They could have went by the name of just "Martin" instead of St. Martin. They lived up in your neck of the woods around 1730 to 1790. I would like to find out if they left any written records such as a Diary or Journals or even business papers. They may hold the "KEY" to Oak Island.

From what I have read, those St Martin’s left Cape Breton for Louisiana in 1750. Pierre Jr was born there. Any journals that might exist would probably be found down there.

 

[franklin]

Thanks.

 

[DaveVanP]

I have shown scientific proof;

No...not "PROOF".

PROOF cannot contain any ambiguity; in order to be considered PROOF, it MUST be DEFINITE. It cannot utilize the phrases "could have", "possibly", "likely", or even "probably".

The fact that POSSIBLE coconut coir was carbon-dated to approximately 600 years ago is only EVIDENCE, not PROOF. It hasn't even been PROVEN to be coconut coir.

I was in Dallas on Nov 22, 1963...in Dealey Plaza around 12:30 pm...by your (and franklin's) standards, that "proves" I (at the age of 6) was involved in the JFK assassination.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Come on now. What's the first thing that comes to mind when I say "coconut". Everyone instantly thinks "Templar!" because . . . um . . . 'cause . . . well, no, I guess they don't usually.

Some old section of fishing net washes up after drifting in the current and gets buried at the tide line. Zzzzzzzz.

 

[gazzahk]

Something to help people get through the last few episodes for the season....



Guaranteed to leave you smashed every episode....