SEASON 8

[ECS]

Well true history has established that Henry Sinclair never departed Scottish territory with a crew of geriatric Templars and their alleged treasure, so Samuel Ball did not recover that supposed treasure.

 

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[ECS]

... So you do admit S Ball was well off. Did he pass off gold coins in town as the stories go?

Does this Samuel Ball passing around gold coins story describe the gold coins as in dates and country of origin, or is it just "gold coins"?
During that period, gold coins would have been unusual in Canada and in Colonial America as a common use currency.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

S'true. A coin is one thing. An ancient and foreign coin would have raised a few eyebrows.

 

[n2mini]

Does this Samuel Ball passing around gold coins story describe the gold coins as in dates and country of origin, or is it just "gold coins"?
During that period, gold coins would have been unusual in Canada and in Colonial America as a common use currency.

I've never read anything other then him using gold coins in town to buy goods.. but you see, if he did have gold coins where did he get them if what you say about then not being common currency in the area!! falls in line with what the nay sayers were saying in that he was well off and just MAYBE he did find a treasure of gold coins!! which made him well off!!

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Do you have any contemporary accounts that state he was using gold coins? Not just something added to make a better story to attract investors or sell rag publications centuries later?

"Well I heard he had red eyes." Human nature to add to stories as they get gossiped around.

 

[n2mini]

S'true. A coin is one thing. An ancient and foreign coin would have raised a few eyebrows.

maybe it did raise eyebrows in town.. even if it was a new gold coin that would have raised eyebrows as well since it wasn't common currency in the area...

 

[Singlestack Wonder]

maybe it did raise eyebrows in town.. even if it was a new gold coin that would have raised eyebrows as well since it wasn't common currency in the area...

Rationalism is a tool used as a crutch when no real facts are available...

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Who's eyebrows? What "town"? What date? What is the first written record of such a claim? When was this feature first added to the "Oak Island" legend?

 

[gazzahk]

If S Ball did find gold coins on OI it didn't have to come from the MP area. Maybe he stumbled upon the "backdoor" as some theories claim there is. Maybe he found it in the swamp which back then would have looked much different...

Here is an interesting article re S.Ball

https://michaeleastwriter.medium.co...cabbage-farmer-or-something-more-1bf3d1f626a9

And this one shows his will

http://www.oocities.org/heartland/meadows/5699/lunwilla.html

As in the article there are other explanations offered for his relative affluence. The will also shows he was not what can be considered "rich" when he died. Owning land on OI would not have had much actual value at the time.

I have also read other accounts that place him with the original three when the pit was found (as mentioned in the above article)

Even if he did find treasure it obviously wasn't very much.

Nothing like the "fabled" hoards of the Knights Templar.

As discussed in the linked to article his "wealth" could of come from his share of loot when he was in the army (or any other source - he could of been a pirate or a highway man etc). I do not see anything really in Sam Balls life that supports significant amounts of treasure being found on OI. Certainly nothing to justify the millions of dollars spent looking for treasure there.

 

[n2mini]

but if he did find it regardless of how big or small it was the OI story was over just after it got going..
based on those articles it does not look like he had much money to start with after the war. Sometime after coming to OI he "somehow" keep buying land and a island but that was cheap actually. Got some free land for being a slave.. Then suddenly was able to afford a butler a time after coming to OI and getting married... Maybe she had money who knows...

 

[n2mini]

Who's eyebrows? What "town"? What date? What is the first written record of such a claim? When was this feature first added to the "Oak Island" legend?

Same eyebrows you mentioned a few posts earlier.. Whatever the nearest towns name was. Sometime after 1795. No idea...

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Ok. So if he used a gold coin it may have raised some genetic eyebrows. But if he never spent a gold coin then probably they were not raised.

I go with the latter.

Now, he was a British volunteer (to become "freed") and did serve through operations in New York. Perhaps his modest wealth came from a share of the looting or something that was a war trophy (not shared around)? That WAS a common practice at the time. Doesn't even need to be all thay mysterious top require Templars, burials, vaults, or even chests. And maybe something not so proud to admit afterwards.

Why make it fantastic? Much more simple answers work. Or, just plain hard work and good business sense/investments/luck could explain it as well.

 

[n2mini]

Any of that is possible, but so is him finding gold coins of some sort... My thinking is some of those old stories most likely have some truth to them. Most of the stories deal with the original 3. Which ya'll claim are completely lies and never actually happened... Samuel Ball is a side story so why make up outlandish stories about him. Granted in the links that gazzahk posted 1 page back it claims that he might have also been part of the "gang" digging in the original MP... He was definitely friends with them or atleast a couple of them as he bought an island from one of them and owned land beside one of the others. Heck Vaughan was one of his executors of his will. What better way to keep things a secret then to have him by your side. The article says he only paid 5 pounds to Vaughan for an island. Maybe that was all they put in the paper work to keep things quite about any wealth he does have. ( like we used to do when selling a used car when you paid taxes based on the selling price not what DMV valued the car at ) or maybe he was a hitman like ya apparently believe and he was paid well for that?? His Will never mentions money. Something I also noticed that in the first link it says he married a young lady named Mary and had 3 kids with her, Andrew, Samuel, and Mary. In his Will none of them are named. Granted maybe they had died by then. In his Will it says his wife is named Catherine. Ok maybe he got a divorce. It does name a grandkid and some "other" lady by the name of Elizabeth Best. Who is this lady who gets the house if she out lives his current wife.. I admit all of these and other old stories probably don't have all the facts correct but some parts of them I'd like to believe are truthful.. I just see no reason for old stories about S Ball to be completely made up. Why do that when all the other stories are about the original 3 and the MP, if none of that is true why bring in S Ball to the conversation...

 

[ECS]

... I just see no reason for old stories about S Ball to be completely made up...

Yet it happens, n2mini, all the time, especially with Oak Island treasure stories.
Just consider Diana Jean Muir's several series of books about Henry Sinclair and alleged descendants.
Muir claims to have found "COPIES" , NOT ORIGINALS of what she claimed were "THE LOST TEMPLAR JOURNALS OF PRINCE HENRY SINCLAIR" that detail a voyage from Scotland to Oak Island to bury Templar Treasure.
Well Sinclair was NOT a Prince or Templar, and Medieval documents contemporary with Sinclair have him NEVER leaving Scottish territory, including a family history by his grandson, which never mentions him being a prince, a Templar, of this fantastic fictional voyage to Oak Island.

 

[n2mini]

but the difference here is your talking about stories of someone who may or may not have even been to OI. I can see how you or someone either does or doesn't believe in those stories. Not sure why anyone would want to make them up but here we are.. S. Ball and the original 3 for a fact did visit/live on OI for years apparently...

 

[ECS]

...and stories do received creative embellishments with the telling and retelling growing bigger and bigger.

 

[Singlestack Wonder]

but the difference here is your talking about stories of someone who may or may not have even been to OI. I can see how you or someone either does or doesn't believe in those stories. Not sure why anyone would want to make them up but here we are.. S. Ball and the original 3 for a fact did visit/live on OI for years apparently...

Anyone can visit hoax island at any time with frankin’s space/time warp machine.....

 

[Keith Jackson]

I saw a clip, I am guessing from tomorrow's show, which showed Gary finding a couple quarrying hammer heads on lot 121. Significance? I have no clue.

 

[Singlestack Wonder]

I saw a clip, I am guessing from tomorrow's show, which showed Gary finding a couple quarrying hammer heads on lot 121. Significance? I have no clue.

Hmmmm.....Narrator: "Hammer heads?...Found at a lot on oak island?...could it be that these were left by the original depositors?".........

 

[MikeN]

I saw a clip, I am guessing from tomorrow's show, which showed Gary finding a couple quarrying hammer heads on lot 121. Significance? I have no clue.

Possibly the ordinary, but identifiable object they find in the swamp turns out to be a blacksmith shop, complete with buggy harnesses, horse shoes, and ox shoes. (and treasure chest hinges?)