So.... Let's keep it simple.

[OldManOfTheRiver]

God all I have done is read for years on here and nothing has still been found. I am certainly ramped up for the upcoming trip we are taking out there and have devoted way too much time to revisiting most of these old threads and posts. I sincerely hope no one misunderstands my humor with respect to the Stones and much of the (in my opinion) over analyzing maps drawn by semi-literate people 150 years ago.



Hope everyone has a great day!!

Dusty

 

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[cactusjumper]

God all I have done is read for years on here and nothing has still been found. I am certainly ramped up for the upcoming trip we are taking out there and have devoted way too much time to revisiting most of these old threads and posts. I sincerely hope no one misunderstands my humor with respect to the Stones and much of the (in my opinion) over analyzing maps drawn by semi-literate people 150 years ago.



Hope everyone has a great day!!

Dusty

Dusty,

If you are just getting started, build up a fat wallet.

LDM authors are really the best sources for anyone today. They have done most of the leg work for you. Those who know the truth are long dead.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Terry Soloman]

With all due respect to Mr. Ribaudo, the authors that have written about the Lost Dutchman's mine, are nothing more than snake oil salesmen. They don't know any more than you do, but they prostitute themselves parroting the same bull manure floating around the Superstition Mountains since the 1920s. For those of us who actually KNOW the mountains and have spent a lot of time hiking and riding them, we understand the real treasure of the Superstitions is their ACTUAL history.

 

[azdave35]

My post does not attack forum members, it strongly states my opinion based on personal knowledge of the Superstition Mountains, a gateway to and from Mexico since recorded time. I am a "forum pet," new person (welcome from New York RealWorld), I have my Charter Membership smoking jacket and Fez, and no longer have to put my name on the Charter Member men's room clean up schedule because of my seniority.

Look, if you want to go into the Supe's looking for gold - Go! Be sure to stop by the museum, restaurants, and tourist traps along the way, because those are the REAL gold mines.

contrary to what you believe terry...most people that come to this area are not here to look for the ldm...they come for the weather..scenery...the history...the apache trail and the lakes get way more attention than the superstition mountains..most people that come here looking for the ldm are broke miners and treasure hunters that contribute nothing to local business's ....you guys seem to think that all the local tourist shops and restaurants around here get rich off the tourists..they make a living and thats about it.....they have a 6 month time slot to make this said living....once it gets blazing hot here the tourist's run back home like they were on fire and the local shops have to live off what they made during the cooler months...you should know this terry...you are in the same type of business...its seasonal for you too...you shouldn't really be bashing the people around here for trying to make a living off tourists...isn't that kinda like the pot calling the kettle black?

 

[somehiker]

contrary to what you believe terry...most people that come to this area are not here to look for the ldm...they come for the weather..scenery...the history...the apache trail and the lakes get way more attention than the superstition mountains..most people that come here looking for the ldm are broke miners and treasure hunters that contribute nothing to local business's ....you guys seem to think that all the local tourist shops and restaurants around here get rich off the tourists..they make a living and thats about it.....they have a 6 month time slot to make this said living....once it gets blazing hot here the tourist's run back home like they were on fire and the local shops have to live off what they made during the cooler months...you should know this terry...you are in the same type of business...its seasonal for you too...you shouldn't really be bashing the people around here for trying to make a living off tourists...isn't that kinda like the pot calling the kettle black?

Just so you know, it wouldn't be the heat that would send me back home Dave.
Or even the ornery attitude of somayu older Apache Junctioners.....
It would be the total loss of all that medical coverage, which we had to pay for thru our taxes every year, if we are out of country for more than half the year.
Bad enough that it no longer covers us outside of Canada, anyway.
'sides, it always seems to hit 100 plus when I show up, anyway.

 

[azdave35]

Just so you know, it wouldn't be the heat that would send me back home Dave.
Or even the ornery attitude of somayu older Apache Junctioners.....
It would be the total loss of all that medical coverage, which we had to pay for thru our taxes every year, if we are out of country for more than half the year.
Bad enough that it no longer covers us outside of Canada, anyway.
'sides, it always seems to hit 100 plus when I show up, anyway.

wayne...if you had to stay here in the hot sun during the summer you'd be ornery too

 

[Terry Soloman]

contrary to what you believe terry...most people that come to this area are not here to look for the ldm...they come for the weather..scenery...the history...the apache trail and the lakes get way more attention than the superstition mountains..most people that come here looking for the ldm are broke miners and treasure hunters that contribute nothing to local business's ....you guys seem to think that all the local tourist shops and restaurants around here get rich off the tourists..they make a living and thats about it.....they have a 6 month time slot to make this said living....once it gets blazing hot here the tourist's run back home like they were on fire and the local shops have to live off what they made during the cooler months...you should know this terry...you are in the same type of business...its seasonal for you too...you shouldn't really be bashing the people around here for trying to make a living off tourists...isn't that kinda like the pot calling the kettle black?

DAVE! I'm not attacking Apache Junction - Tortilla Flats business people. They are living the all American Capitalist dream and simply taking advantage of the increased customer base in the winter months. I'm saying that the people that write these books on pure speculation, or by parroting "research" in other books by "experts" are responsible every summer when some idiot treks in, only to be found a month after his death, propped up against a rock with an empty Monster Energy can in its hand..

 

[azdave35]

DAVE! I'm not attacking Apache Junction - Tortilla Flats business people. They are living the all American Capitalist dream and simply taking advantage of the increased customer base in the winter months. I'm saying that the people that write these books on pure speculation, or by parroting "research" in other books by "experts" are responsible every summer when some idiot treks in, only to be found a month after his death, propped up against a rock with an empty Monster Energy can in its hand..

terry...i agree with you on the fact that some authors print a bunch of bs..its actually quite easy to write a book...read every book you can find on a subject and grab the highlights from all of them...edit it all into one writing...thats the easy part...promoting and marketing the book is the hard part ,,its the same with books on gold prospecting...there is never anything new in them...same old stuff they plagiarized from other books..,..i know most of the local authors around here and believe it or not MOST of them put in alot of time doing research for their books...now if some idiot is dumb enough to go in the mountains in the summer with only a 16 oz bottle of water....blame it on their greed and stupidity...not some author...i would say that is natures way of weeding out the idiots...i dont go out in the desert in the summer..i have sense enough to wait until fall....every time someone turns up missing or dead in the superstitions it is almost always someone from another state..most of us dumb hillbillies around here stay out of the mountains when its hot

 

[Lucky Baldwin]

terry...i agree with you on the fact that some authors print a bunch of bs..its actually quite easy to write a book...read every book you can find on a subject and grab the highlights from all of them...edit it all into one writing...thats the easy part...promoting and marketing the book is the hard part ,,its the same with books on gold prospecting...there is never anything new in them...same old stuff they plagiarized from other books..,..i know most of the local authors around here and believe it or not MOST of them put in alot of time doing research for their books...now if some idiot is dumb enough to go in the mountains in the summer with only a 16 oz bottle of water....blame it on their greed and stupidity...not some author...i would say that is natures way of weeding out the idiots...i dont go out in the desert in the summer..i have sense enough to wait until fall....every time someone turns up missing or dead in the superstitions it is almost always someone from another state..most of us dumb hillbillies around here stay out of the mountains when its hot

Idiots is a rather harsh term. The way I see it, they're more ignorant than idiotic. The problem isn't that they choose to go into the desert mountains in 100+ heat with only a 16 oz bottle of water. The problem is they don't turn back when 8 oz of it are gone.

It's like my grandfather told me when I was young, "Son, you'll find that common sense isn't all that common."

 

[cactusjumper]

With all due respect to Mr. Ribaudo, the authors that have written about the Lost Dutchman's mine, are nothing more than snake oil salesmen. They don't know any more than you do, but they prostitute themselves parroting the same bull manure floating around the Superstition Mountains since the 1920s. For those of us who actually KNOW the mountains and have spent a lot of time hiking and riding them, we understand the real treasure of the Superstitions is their ACTUAL history.

Terry,

Harsh words for the mountain of work that people like, Blair, Corbin, Kollenborn, Glover and others have done.

Take care,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Terry Soloman]

Terry,

Harsh words for the mountain of work that people like, Blair, Corbin, Kollenborn, Glover and others have done.

Take care,

Joe Ribaudo

False prophets, with nothing to show for the words they wrote. I'm willing to bet I have more time in the Superstitions than any of them. Outlaw stashes and turquoise, not gold, is what has been found in the mountains.

 

[Cubfan64]

False prophets, with nothing to show for the words they wrote. I'm willing to bet I have more time in the Superstitions than any of them. Outlaw stashes and turquoise, not gold, is what has been found in the mountains.

I imagine you're just trying to get a rise out of people with that statement. It's not possible to prove but if it could be done, I'd take that bet any day of the week.

As an aside, it seems like such a waste of your time to come to this forum since it's clear you have no interest at all in the topics. The only input we see is negativity, sarcasm and disdain. It's a strange phenomenon and doesn't reflect very well on someone who's trying to run a business.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Realworld was the troll kemper, posts deleted.

 

[Cubfan64]

DAVE! I'm not attacking Apache Junction - Tortilla Flats business people. They are living the all American Capitalist dream and simply taking advantage of the increased customer base in the winter months. I'm saying that the people that write these books on pure speculation, or by parroting "research" in other books by "experts" are responsible every summer when some idiot treks in, only to be found a month after his death, propped up against a rock with an empty Monster Energy can in its hand..

You really feel book authors are responsible for people dying in the Superstitions?? That's like saying authors of books on scuba diving are responsible for divers who drown due to carelessness or like blaming writers of books on rock climbing for people falling to their deaths due to poor preparation or faulty equipment.

I forgot we live in an age where personal responsibility and accountability are a rarity.

 

[OldManOfTheRiver]

Wow folks, we even attracted a known troll! By keeping it simple I was hoping to avoid dissent. I tend to fall in line with Terry in that most of the books are great history but full of inaccuracies. If a book could tell us where the LDM is it would have already been found, if it ever existed in the first place. I really love this community here and from all the posts on this forum and the other big two, there are more resources than any one book ever thought of having.

Personally I am not so certain J. Waltz even knew he was dying. If you had the way but didn't want to be murdered in your sleep after you tell someone the exact directions you'd purposely obfuscate the directions with just enough kernel of truth that someone could find it if they got lucky. I don't see why Waltz would just tell the exact way to whatever he found. Now, I am all for tourists and tourist traps and people making money on this thing. It's the 'Murican way. Hell my family has been in the restaurant business for 70 years so believe me, I understand.

But for this time with two kids and the girlfriend and 8 miles in in terrain they've never attempted I am going to keep it simple. J. Waltz gave clues that can be pretty much be put on a lot of spots in the Supes and it'll match up. I am sticking to the two skin maps and JW's oral directions as well as the German clues that supposedly are attributed to JW. At the least we are going to have a heck of a hike and spend the night under the desert sky and that may be the biggest treasure of them all. But, we are going to be prepared!

Lifestraws, MRE's, First Aid, a GPS locator and a firearm. No one should venture out into the desert unprepared. My kids are stoked, heck I've made them buy their air fare. It teaches a good lesson to work for things. Anyway, I am taking them to one area no one ever seems to go to or talk about. It's going to be a lot of fun, a hard hike and we'll have to be very careful. It's a long ways down in some places.

Hope everyone is having a nice day.
Dusty

 

[Lucky Baldwin]

Wow folks, we even attracted a known troll! By keeping it simple I was hoping to avoid dissent. I tend to fall in line with Terry in that most of the books are great history but full of inaccuracies. If a book could tell us where the LDM is it would have already been found, if it ever existed in the first place. I really love this community here and from all the posts on this forum and the other big two, there are more resources than any one book ever thought of having.

Personally I am not so certain J. Waltz even knew he was dying. If you had the way but didn't want to be murdered in your sleep after you tell someone the exact directions you'd purposely obfuscate the directions with just enough kernel of truth that someone could find it if they got lucky. I don't see why Waltz would just tell the exact way to whatever he found. Now, I am all for tourists and tourist traps and people making money on this thing. It's the 'Murican way. Hell my family has been in the restaurant business for 70 years so believe me, I understand.

But for this time with two kids and the girlfriend and 8 miles in in terrain they've never attempted I am going to keep it simple. J. Waltz gave clues that can be pretty much be put on a lot of spots in the Supes and it'll match up. I am sticking to the two skin maps and JW's oral directions as well as the German clues that supposedly are attributed to JW. At the least we are going to have a heck of a hike and spend the night under the desert sky and that may be the biggest treasure of them all. But, we are going to be prepared!

Lifestraws, MRE's, First Aid, a GPS locator and a firearm. No one should venture out into the desert unprepared. My kids are stoked, heck I've made them buy their air fare. It teaches a good lesson to work for things. Anyway, I am taking them to one area no one ever seems to go to or talk about. It's going to be a lot of fun, a hard hike and we'll have to be very careful. It's a long ways down in some places.

Hope everyone is having a nice day.
Dusty

If I may make a suggestion, there's one thing everybody should have with them, that I didn't think of before my first trip. A pair of gloves. Sometimes you have to hold onto rocks to be safe. Many times those rocks have been out in the sun all day and are too hot to touch.

I prefer the thin leather gloves. The heavy leather palm work gloves don't give me a good feel of what I'm holding onto and the cheap canvas gloves wear out quick. The one time I used them the fingertips had holes in them before the trip was over. Had to raid my 1st aid kit for white tape to finish the trip.

A rub-on bug stick is also a good idea. Some of the dry washes I've run into have clouds of little tiny flies. They look like a regular housefly but are only 1/16" long and the clouds number in the thousands. They don't bite and because they're so small you don't really feel them land and walk around, but they do swarm your eyes nose and mouth. Breathe a couple in and that sets off a nasal explosion. "Clean-up on aisle 3." One swipe with the bug stick to your forehead and both cheeks keeps the little buggers from playing Han Solo with your nostril.

Be safe and have a good time. If you find a rich mine out there do yourself a favor. DON'T TELL A LIVING SOUL!!! That's the only insurance you have of keeping the mine.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

Wow folks,

...........................<<<<SNIP>>>>>........................

But for this time with two kids and the girlfriend and 8 miles in in terrain they've never attempted I am going to keep it simple....SNIP......


Dusty

Hey Dusty,

I take it this isn't your first trip in, but if you think you are the only one in the group that could make it back out alone, 8 miles is a long way in that country...one thing I like is an emergency beacon for situations like that...especially if it's YOU that gets incapacitated, others in the group can activate the beacon, then everyone can sit tight until help arrives...I like the ResQLink, as there's no monthly fee or other charges, it 's reasonable in cost, and it lasts a long time...then everyone will have piece of mind just in case...have fun out there! Take care, Jim

 

[nobodie]

The little flies are gnats.

 

[somehiker]

Blackflies (noseeums) up here. But ours are 10 % whine and 90% teeth.
Look like pepper on your steak....especially rare.
Them down there are awful annoying though. Like having your harem on PMS all at the same time.
Not sure what's worse.

 

[OldManOfTheRiver]

Great advice all. I was going to bring a can of wasp spray for the bees if I had to exterminate a colony to get in a hole. I'll check out the ResQLink Jim! That is just what the proverbial doctor ordered. I'm a little worried about the distance to be honest but I have my kids working and we'll soon start training with weighted packs. Gonna take it slow out there, but I gotta get on top of that hill. Something in my soul tells me JW was there at one point.

I am starting to lose what little sanity I had. Lol.


We may find a frying pan! I imagine the light pollution from Mesa is pretty bad these days but really want some time lapse sky shots if the weather is good. If not there I'll grab the night shots from around Kanab I guess. And if I find anything I'll tell ya EXACTLY where it's at because after we walk out with 100 pounds of ore we won't need a second round.

I do hope this helps the story along just a little bit. Way too much secrecy and vagueness for my liking. I'll be sure to keep you guys up to date.