Solar Power

[T.C.]

So......no clear cutting anywhere in Oregon?, yea I believe that, lol

I didn't say that. There are a few clear cuts. Some are private property as well as Forest Service. It is ugly, I agree, but it is also replanted.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Agony and Death on a Gold Rush Steamer: The Disastrous Sinking of the Side-Wheeler Yankee Blade - Grab it through Amazon!

[Al D]

When I lived in Oregon, I traveled from Sandy to Portland every day for work, many times my job would take me off that main highway, and every time I traveled off of that highway, I would encounter huge areas which were completely clear cut, usually within one half a mile of the highway. But the land right next to that highway had full dense trees.
maybe, the state owned that land next to the highway, but a half mile easement seems a lot.

 

[T.C.]

I know I was just stating the fact of... TREES
TREES Everywhere.....
I get it, I'm on your side. Damn... the multiple people that get lost... should be able to find a clear cut for the chopper... right? I'm on a search and rescue team and many...many city folk go missing some never to be found ... it's called "wilderness"

I agree with you 100% We just need to get AlanM straightened out...how about a drink??

 

[T.C.]

When I lived in Oregon, I traveled from Sandy to Portland every day for work, many times my job would take me off that main highway, and every time I traveled off of that highway, I would encounter huge areas which were completely clear cut, usually within one half a mile of the highway. But the land right next to that highway had full dense trees.
maybe, the state owned that land next to the highway, but a half mile easement seems a lot.

I think it's called a "buffer zone." I've seen them as well.
Also, if you lived and worked in Sandy and Portland, no wonder you don't like the state. You were right up there with all the useless libturd/lemmings.

 

[Oregon Viking]

I agree with you 100% We just need to get AlanM straightened out...how about a drink??

Well I agree and I have already a few!!!!
Sandy to Portland? NONE of that is even a close comparison to where I live... Or where T.C. lives.
Ask Delnorter... Redwoods EVERYWHERE!!!

 

[Al D]

I agree with you 100% We just need to get AlanM straightened out...how about a drink??

I hear you.....I also recall a person who died up near Mount Hood, he got stuck in the snow and tried to wait for rescue, but it never came, the sad part is he was only 100 yards away from where the state stopped plowing the road, it was just around the bend.
I know there are a lot of trees in Oregon, my point was the way the clear cutting was being hidden, just seemed shifty to me.

 

[T.C.]

Well I agree and I have already a few!!!!
Sandy to Portland? NONE of that is even a close comparison to where I live... Or where T.C. lives.
Ask Delnorter... Redwoods EVERYWHERE!!!

Almost all of the Oregon coast and most of the northern California coast is absolutely beautiful. Jed Smith state park is just one of the gems of NorCal.

 

[Al D]

I think it's called a "buffer zone." I've seen them as well.
Also, if you lived and worked in Sandy and Portland, no wonder you don't like the state. You were right up there with all the useless libturd/lemmings.

Gresham would make a good Nuclear waste dump IMO

 

[Duckshot]

As an experienced game hunter I can attest that if you are looking for biodiversity, you won't find it in the old growth forests. You won't find it in the clear cut either. If you want to see a lot of game to prey on, look in the edges between clear cut and old growth. That's the "sweet spot" for both predator and prey.

 

[Oregon Viking]

As an experienced game hunter I can attest that if you are looking for biodiversity, you won't find it in the old growth forests. You won't find it in the clear cut either. If you want to see a lot of game to prey on, look in the edges between clear cut and old growth. That's the "sweet spot" for both predator and prey.

Sure with close to a million acres literally in my back yard (my property borders the Kalmiopsis wilderness..) We get elk, deer, bear, boar and duck. We also have 5 rivers... a few famous within 50 miles. Steelhead, salmon... and that ultimate smorgasbord... the Pacific ocean. Anti hunters? OK but I do not have to buy my beef.pork from the local grocery stores.(processed)

 

[Kantuckkeean]

I mentioned logging, coal mining, and drilling for oil, because they share a common theme. And you missed the entire point.

So let me put this in very basic terms..............If you care about the PLANET, stop shipping your pollution to other nations, then claiming it is "environmentally friendly". It's NOT. If you really cared about the environment, you would support MORE logging, mining, and drilling here at home where we have the strictest law in the world.

But heck..........As long as you can't see it anymore, and if it makes you "feel" good, then it must be good for the planet. Right?

I'm sorry. I thought that you were just being sarcastic.

I hate out-sourcing my pollution. I think that I mentioned "buying locally" earlier to help alleviate some of the problems. It's not just us, but we're definitely a big part of the problem. All other countries outsource some of their pollution as well. I've seen plenty of trains loaded with coal that were to be put on barges to go to the Gulf so that they could be loaded onto ships bound for China. Same with logs. Then they send back poorly made furniture. I hear that they love our hackberry because the light color takes any kind of stain (walnut, cherry, oak, whatever color you like).

I try to support less mining, less logging, and less drilling everywhere. However, I recognize that to maintain our current way of life and standard of living, these things must be done, and when they are, they should be done as responsibly as possible.

Kindest regards,
Kantuck

 

[Kantuckkeean]

I think it's called a "buffer zone." I've seen them as well.
Also, if you lived and worked in Sandy and Portland, no wonder you don't like the state. You were right up there with all the useless libturd/lemmings.

In WV, they used to do a pretty good job of keeping view screens along the main thoroughfares so that the surface mines weren't so prominent. Driving through, it looks like a lot of nice forest. Sure, you can catch a glimpse of a mine now and then but you have to get off of the main roads to really see them. In Kentucky... not so much and in Ohio, some of the largest shovels in the world crossed I-70.

Kindest regards,
Kantuck

 

[Oregon Viking]

Where I come from. 15 minute drive.

 

[Al D]

Where I come from. 15 minute drive.

View attachment 1902576

Looks like the final resting place of one eyed willie.........beautiful

 

[T.C.]

Where I come from. 15 minute drive.

View attachment 1902576

It is beautiful!

 

[T.C.]

The High Desert of Oregon...about 130 miles east of my house.

 

[Kantuckkeean]

As an experienced game hunter I can attest that if you are looking for biodiversity, you won't find it in the old growth forests. You won't find it in the clear cut either. If you want to see a lot of game to prey on, look in the edges between clear cut and old growth. That's the "sweet spot" for both predator and prey.

You're spot on about edge for game. If you're into edge habitat for hunting game, you should try Pennsylvania. The Game Commission manages a lot of State Game Lands across the state specifically for hunting (deer, turkey, bear, pheasant, etc.) and they manage a lot of acreage for edge habitat. They really don't need to though. Fracking has created more than enough. The aerial photo below is from, I believe, Elk County, although there are spots like this in Bradford, Tioga, and other counties as well.


Excessive edge is actually very bad for biodiversity though. There is very little of what one can call "intact" forest remaining in that photo, if any. The gas lines, road cuts, and well pads create openings for invasive, exotic plant species (multiflora rose, Japanese knotweed, honeysuckles, Japanese stilt grass, etc.). Invasive exotic plants out-compete native plants and they don't provide the same benefits as our native plants because native insects, including pollinators, aren't adapted to them as a food or nectar source. Doug Tallamy compared a white oak and Bradford pear (an invasive exotic tree that is widely used in horticulture). He scoured leaves on branches up to head height, counting caterpillars. He counted hundreds of caterpillars of 19 different species of moths and butterflies on the white oak. He found only one caterpillar on the Bradford pear. The research was repeated and showed that oaks, maples, cherry, and other native trees harbor hundreds of native species of moths and butterflies and Bradford pear, very, very few. Why is this important? Because for many species of birds, it takes thousands of caterpillars to raise their young. The recent State of the Birds report found that there are approximately 2.9 billion fewer birds in the US when compared to 1970 populations, an overall decrease of 29%. When we lose our native plant species, we also lose our native animals.

Many species are known as "forest interior dependent species." That is, they rely on large, unbroken blocks of contiguous forest for breeding and suitable habitat. This includes many species of migratory Neotropical songbirds (e.g. scarlet tanagers, very many warblers, others) as well as bobcats, wood thrush, and other animals. When the forest is opened up like that, areas can actually become population sinks for songbird species because their nests can become parasitized by starlings and brown-headed cowbirds, which kick eggs out of nests, then they lay their eggs in the nests of other birds and have those parents tend to the eggs and young. So keeping forests intact is much better from a biodiversity and conservation perspective.

Kindest regards,
Kantuck

 

[Phil]

I'm sorry. I thought that you were just being sarcastic.

I hate out-sourcing my pollution. I think that I mentioned "buying locally" earlier to help alleviate some of the problems. It's not just us, but we're definitely a big part of the problem. All other countries outsource some of their pollution as well. I've seen plenty of trains loaded with coal that were to be put on barges to go to the Gulf so that they could be loaded onto ships bound for China. Same with logs. Then they send back poorly made furniture. I hear that they love our hackberry because the light color takes any kind of stain (walnut, cherry, oak, whatever color you like).

I try to support less mining, less logging, and less drilling everywhere. However, I recognize that to maintain our current way of life and standard of living, these things must be done, and when they are, they should be done as responsibly as possible.

Kindest regards,
Kantuck

Let's apply this concept to you personally.

Very soon, all of the coal mines in your area are going to close down (again). When that happens, Indiana Michigan Power will be forced to buy coal from South America, where there are ZERO environmental laws. And as mentioned before, they are going to load that coal on ocean freighters that SPEW diesel as they travel up the Atlantic Ocean. Then they will load that coal onto trains that SPEW diesel across the country as it travels to the coal fired power plants in Indiana.

In short, every time you turn on a light in your house, you are outsourcing your pollution. Even worse, it is being done as IRRESPONSIBLY as possible. You understand that right?

I realize coal is not environmentally friendly. However, as you said, it must be done to maintain our way of life. What I want to know, and I am asking this very sincerely, what exactly is the goal of environmentalists? It's obviously not to save the planet from global warming because nearly everything proposed produces MORE CO2.

Wouldn't it be better to reduce CO2 by mining here so there is no carbon footprint for transporting coal to the plants?

And wouldn't it be better to create jobs here at home, then spend the increased tax revenue on R&D for new energy sources?

 

[GoDeep]

Regardless of ones stand on climate change, oil, coal and natural gas will run out. Humans have been on earth about 200,000 years, yet we will effectively use the majority of fossil fuels up in only a few hundred years. We as humans, have done absolutely nothing to treat it as a non renewable resource. The world consumes it with reckless abandon at an unprecedented rate as if it's a infinite resource.

The fact of the matter is, the earth is grossly overpopulated. Humans and their livestock make up approximately 95 percent of the earths mammal biomass now, when only a few hundred years ago we were only a few percentage of it. Our oceans are becoming depleted of fish, most major waterways are so polluted, they barely support rough fish, if any at all. I live on the once mighty Mississippi, a silted in mud slough now. There are accounts of fisherman in the mid 1800's who reported crystal clear waters in the Mississippi, and abundant Trout in it. Trout can no longer survive there, they can barely now ever survive in the spring fed tributary streams. Where i live in south eastern Minnesota, there was once Bear, Cougar, Elk and Bison, we killed them all off as we over harvested them and destroyed their natural habitat to put in endless fields of beans and corn to feed our livestock, to, ironically, feed ourselves.

Humans continue to breed, consume and waste as if they are hell bent on destroying themselves within only a few hundred years.

A wise man once said, "You can't have infinite growth in a finite world" yet our economies are based on growth, which requires an ever increasing population, and ever increasing production and ever increasing consumption. Simply put, WE ARE DOOMED as we are flawed organisms, who are just smart enough to rule the consumption chain, but not smart enough to control our unchecked impulse to ever expand.

Maybe when the collapse comes, it will be large enough and kill off enough population to shake up our self serving destructive arrogance, yet not be big enough to completely make earth uninhabitable and then we can rebuild a society that lives in sustainable and renewable harmony with nature.

Time for some pancakes. Highly processed flour, devoid of nutrients and high fructose corn syrup poured on top seems rather fitting.

 

[Fat]

The vast majority of trees in Nebraska were planted by man in the last 200 years. I never hear any credit for that. The whole national forest was planted by man.
Coal creek, Louis and Clark named carbon creek, Nodak the last time I took a tour, at current production 1.25 million homes, 1600 years.