SPANISH COINS mean Spainish treasure..

[gollum]

Also,

I almost forgot about a friend's cache find I have been allowed to share:

I have a friend that lives in Tucson. He got out of the Army in 1956. He took some money he had saved up while in the Army and bought himself a new Willys Jeep (which he still drives to this day). He, his brother, and two friends (one a prospector and one an engineer) set out to hunt treasure. The fund some smaller things over the years, but the big strike eluded him for a long time. Then in 1983, when they climbed a hill to get a good view of their surroundings, they found a large volcanic rock with some barely visible markings of lines and dots. Nearby, they found a flat stone with a cross on it. It took a couple of years before they put all the pieces together. The engineer got the big piece first. The lines and dots were Mayan Numbers. Long story short, they tried different combinations of the numbers to different lengths, and eventually came out with a large cross. They ran metal detectors over the outline of the cross and found small deposits of smallish gold bars (some 2" x 2" and some 2" x 4"). Over some time, they managed to dig 82 pounds of gold bars from that site. The story made it into Treasure! Magazine in 1986. The magazine story doesn't say that they sold the gold to a refiner in Washington State for about $500,000 ($125,000 each).

Here's what the bars looked like:



Here's a link to the entire story on my website:

82 Pounds of Gold

Enjoy - Mike

 

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[Au_Dreamers]

I directly answered the written question posed as it was very simple and lacked various parameters.

I didn't read all the threads to quantify the intent of the question.

Again I'm not saying there is or isn't treasure on Oak Island just that the scenario has many of the similarities of those two successful hunts written in a previous post.

I believe it's very subjective and varies why treasure is buried and for intended duration. Also just because a treasure remains/remained undiscovered for a long time doesn't mean that those that buried it intended it to stay there that length.

Things happen, people become impaired and or die, even more so ages ago. People forget where things are hidden or can't relocate them.

There could be the possibility that a "raiding" was so successful that the raiders in greed wanted to keep more for themselves so it was stashed for later retrieval and again things happened.

Case history ala Captain Kidd...for one.

History recounts various captures of additional vessels that become part of the raiding squad. The endeavor of digging the money pit isn't so daunting for a combined crew of 50 - 500 men.

Taking their one ship to port and only having to split what is onboard is a primary example of why this would be done.

Yes the intent might be a short term to retrieve said treasure so why create something so extravagant?
Maybe it was made so extravagant because this depository wasn't intended for a one time use?

Maybe the hiders of something on Oak Island died while there? The island does have poisonous gas.

Just as laborious it is to dig the money pit to hide something it would be more so to dig it for a hoax.

I've dug ditches and holes by hand and I can tell you that I would get to maybe a 6x6x6 and quit if I was digging just for a hoax but if I thought I was digging for something of value I could probably tough it out to another 6 feet. lol

Maybe the hiders of something on Oak Island knew this from their study of human behavior.

If the wooden platforms are completely false I think the whole thing changes.
If the wooden platforms are true then someone went to some laborious endeavor for something more than to pass time or for a hoax.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Gollum - I'll count that one as well. ;-)

The islands in Mahone Bay are glacial drumlins. Oak Island is one of about 300 islands in the bay, though it is one of the larger ones. Most of the larger ones had oak trees. Most have been logged off repeatedly. The British Navy was lumber hungry from 1760 on and after 1776 lost much of their supply and so focused on the Canadian sources.






AU - pick up a copy of The Pirate Hunter by Richard Zacks for a good biography of Kidd. It accounts pretty well for his actual take. He was less of a pirate than Hollywood portrays.

 

[Dave Rishar]

DAVE RISHAR,

First Thanks for the compliment. I have always been pretty much a no $hit kind of guy when it comes to treasure hunting. Enough BS'ers, Egomaniacs, and Cloud Watchers out there.

OKay, I'll bite. Give me a better known treasure legend, and what problems you see with it. If it's one that I have spent time on, and can intelligently speak to, then we can talk.

Instead of a better-known one, let's go with one that's lesser-known, but not completely obscure - Victorio Peak. It seems fitting, as it's already been brought up in this thread.

I have a number of issues with this one, but let's start with Mr. Swanner. Was this the Orby Swanner born in 1925? (It can't have been the Orby Swanner born in 1871.)

 

[Old Silver]

AU - pick up a copy of The Pirate Hunter by Richard Zacks for a good biography of Kidd. It accounts pretty well for his actual take. He was less of a pirate than Hollywood portrays.

What makes you believe this book? I'm not saying it's wrong, just wondering why you usually can't trust anyone or anything, but this one you seem to hold as truth.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

He lists acknowledgements, manuscripts, sources and has a nice index. It can all be verified.

 

[Old Silver]

He lists acknowledgements, manuscripts, sources and has a nice index. It can all be verified.

Oh, I see. You did a follow up research and proved the guy was right? Cool. I'm glad you did that, because acknowledgements, manuscripts, and sources can be wrong.

 

[Au_Dreamers]

Yeah I've read lots of historicals outside of Hollywood or books written on opinions...

I'm not saying Kidd was or wasn't rolling in treasure but that he did hide some for later retrieval and things happened that kept him from getting to it himself. Was it his only one

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Nope. I trust others to do that. ;-)

 

[Old Silver]

Nope. I trust others to do that. ;-)

So when you said it COULD BE verified, you didn't mean it WAS verified? So there's a chance you were deceived by this guy?

 

[Leila]

I'm not a treasure hunter, but it's the mystery of Oak Island that fascinates me. I'm originally from upstate NY and my dad and his friends went to Canada frequently on hunting or fishing trips. I remember hearing them talk about Oak Island, and many years later I read the Reader's Digest story about the island.

I think it's obvious that something is or was buried on the island. The elaborate money pit with wooden platforms at 10 foot levels, the booby traps that flooded the pit, the tunnels in the cove that fed sea water into the pit once digging passed the 90 foot level, all point to an elaborate engineering project. Then add into this project the markings on stones and Nolen's Cross, and the strange triangular swamp that's fresh water and looks man-made, and the mystery deepens.

Spanish coins have been found and in Tuesday night's episode, two British coins from the early 1700s, so this indicates a presence by both the Spanish and English that pre-dates the discovery of the money pit in 1795.

Over the years, there's been stories told of the various searchers and there's some pretty intriguing stories. One that was brought up in Tuesday night's episode was that one of the searchers in the mid-1900s drilled down or dug down to about 130 feet and struck a large rectangle wooden box that was described as being about 7 feet long, with walls that were about 7 inches thick. The pit collapsed before it could be investigate further. This is one story I hadn't heard before. Does anyone here know any more about this particular story?

I think it's interesting that the Canadian government wants an archeologist on the site, and that over a hundred objects of interest have been found and are being preserved at a museum. Maybe we will eventually know what this mystery was all about.

 

[Au_Dreamers]

Spanish coin was used as a world wide currency up into the 19th century so finding an old one doesn't necessarily mean it was dropped by a Spaniard.

I believe the swamp is brackish water.

For me and maybe others the story of drilling into something that seemed as if the drill had hit loose material, they retrieved some gold chain links and a piece of parchment is probably the main driving force in a belief of treasure below.

Just one of many sources....
Treasure: Oak Island: The Story of Oak Island

In 1849 the next company to attempt to extract the treasure, The Truro Company, was founded and the search began again. They quickly dug down to 86 feet only to be flooded. Deciding to try to figure out what was buried before attempting to extract it, Truro switched to drilling core samples. The drilling produced some encouraging results.
​

First Hints of Treasure

At 98 feet the drill went through a spruce platform. Then it encountered 4 inches of oak and then 22 inches of what was characterized as "metal in pieces""; Next 8 inches of oak, another 22 inches of metal, 4 inches of oak and another layer of spruce. The conclusion was that they had drilled through 2 casks or chests filled will coins. Upon pulling out the drill they found splinters of oak and strands of what looked like coconut husk.
One account of the drilling also mentions that three small gold links, as from a chain, were brought up. Unfortunately no one knows where they have gone.
Interestingly, the earth encountered beneath the bottom spruce platform was loose indicating that the pit may have gone even deeper. A later group of searchers would find out how much deeper.
​

 

[Au_Dreamers]

So last night I watched some of the online exclusive videos, "special minis". Some of these are things not shown in the TV shows. One thing of interest is the one about the "McGinnis foundation"

The McGinnis Foundation, Part 1 Video - The Curse of Oak Island - HISTORY.com

The McGinnis Foundation, Part 2 Video - The Curse of Oak Island - HISTORY.com

 

[Dave Rishar]

I think it's obvious that something is or was buried on the island. The elaborate money pit with wooden platforms at 10 foot levels, the booby traps that flooded the pit, the tunnels in the cove that fed sea water into the pit once digging passed the 90 foot level, all point to an elaborate engineering project. Then add into this project the markings on stones and Nolen's Cross, and the strange triangular swamp that's fresh water and looks man-made, and the mystery deepens.

If we put aside folklore, there's no existing evidence of platforms, booby traps, or tunnels. I've pointed out problems with some of the marked stones in the past. The swamp is admittedly interesting, and if I were looking for something interesting, I'd look there. At the least, it's one of the few spots on the island that hasn't been torn apart and drilled into numerous times, so if there ever was something to be found, it's probably there.

Spanish coins have been found and in Tuesday night's episode, two British coins from the early 1700s, so this indicates a presence by both the Spanish and English that pre-dates the discovery of the money pit in 1795.

Probably inconsequential. If the Spanish coins didn't wash up (and they do wash up in that area from time to time), they were commonly used as currency outside of Spain's dominion for quite a long time as has been previously mentioned. I'd expect that the British coins could have a similar origin. However, I'm more than happy to admit that this is the first treasure recovery operation in the history of the Oak Island legend to actually turn up some form of treasure, and I'm quite pleased that this happened. (I must note that it doesn't jive with the more popular treasure theories of today, but from the beginning until a few decades ago, everyone was convinced that it was a pirate treasure and this jives perfectly with that. I found it refreshing to see a recovered find that didn't support the more popular contemporary treasure theories, which may be a first for Oak Island.)

Over the years, there's been stories told of the various searchers and there's some pretty intriguing stories. One that was brought up in Tuesday night's episode was that one of the searchers in the mid-1900s drilled down or dug down to about 130 feet and struck a large rectangle wooden box that was described as being about 7 feet long, with walls that were about 7 inches thick. The pit collapsed before it could be investigate further. This is one story I hadn't heard before. Does anyone here know any more about this particular story?

There have been all kinds of stories over the years. Run them down and run them down without mercy. What you find may shock you.

I think it's interesting that the Canadian government wants an archeologist on the site, and that over a hundred objects of interest have been found and are being preserved at a museum. Maybe we will eventually know what this mystery was all about.

Good on Canada. As a skeptic (TM) I'm not expecting any treasure there, but I do expect that there will be all sorts of historic artifacts...from earlier recovery efforts if nothing else. But there might be something else there as well. Having an archie tagging along is a good idea. If something significant is found, it will tend to make the find legit, something that has been lacking in earlier "finds."

 

[Old Silver]

Having an archie tagging along is a good idea. If something significant is found, it will tend to make the find legit, something that has been lacking in earlier "finds."

And this is where we fail. We think nothing can be legit unless it's endorsed by those who have degrees. When will we learn.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

And this is where we fail. We think nothing can be legit unless it's endorsed by those who have degrees. When will we learn.

It's the ONLY way... EVERYWHERE!

 

[Old Silver]

It's the ONLY way... EVERYWHERE!

It's the only way we accept, but it's not the only way.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

And this is where we fail. We think nothing can be legit unless it's endorsed by those who have degrees. When will we learn.

When you cough up blood do you go to a doctor, or the old lady down the street who says she once saw someone set a dog's broken leg so that must make her qualified to cure you?

Sometimes a degree is proof of a lot of research and learning. Granted, sometimes not. But usually the folks making a living at something have better exposure to similar events and are qualified to comment on them. If McGinnis had an archaeologist buddy with him in 1795 there'd be some record of the "log platforms" - depth, length, diameter, maybe composition, count of the rings so they could be dated, estimate load strength, etc. Now we don't even know if they were really even platforms as it is the 1856 account of what McGinnis' friend Vaughn saw as a teenager in 1795 before they gave up digging. If nothing else archaeologists document where things are before they are disturbed so it helps recreate a site later so it can be compared to similar sites.

 

[Old Silver]

When you cough up blood do you go to a doctor, or the old lady down the street who says she once saw someone set a dog's broken leg so that must make her qualified to cure you?

Sometimes a degree is proof of a lot of research and learning. Granted, sometimes not. But usually the folks making a living at something have better exposure to similar events and are qualified to comment on them. If McGinnis had an archaeologist buddy with him in 1795 there'd be some record of the "log platforms" - depth, length, diameter, maybe composition, count of the rings so they could be dated, estimate load strength, etc. Now we don't even know if they were really even platforms as it is the 1856 account of what McGinnis' friend Vaughn saw as a teenager in 1795 before they gave up digging. If nothing else archaeologists document where things are before they are disturbed so it helps recreate a site later so it can be compared to similar sites.

Your point is lost in the fact that archaeologists are not the equivalent to doctors when you're sick. It doesn't take a degree to know when you found treasure. I'm not against archeology, I sort of wish I had gone into that myself. But we've gotten to a point to where we can't believe anything that's not endorsed by a degree. And that just wrong.

 

[gollum]

When you cough up blood do you go to a doctor, or the old lady down the street who says she once saw someone set a dog's broken leg so that must make her qualified to cure you?

Sometimes a degree is proof of a lot of research and learning. Granted, sometimes not. But usually the folks making a living at something have better exposure to similar events and are qualified to comment on them. If McGinnis had an archaeologist buddy with him in 1795 there'd be some record of the "log platforms" - depth, length, diameter, maybe composition, count of the rings so they could be dated, estimate load strength, etc. Now we don't even know if they were really even platforms as it is the 1856 account of what McGinnis' friend Vaughn saw as a teenager in 1795 before they gave up digging. If nothing else archaeologists document where things are before they are disturbed so it helps recreate a site later so it can be compared to similar sites.

Charlie,

This is where we DEFINITELY don't see eye to eye. I am with Old Silver here. Doctors take a little thing called The Hypocratic Oath. By the nature of their profession, they are not supposed to have any biases. Just evaluate the symptoms, and choose the best method of treatment. Archaeologists are under no such restrictions. When known history is firmly entrenched, you literally have to beat most archaeologists over the head with new facts to get anything changed, and even then, if the new information is not from another archaeologist, it is 99% of the time ignored, shoputed down, or made fun of.

Case in point:

A man named Gordon Smith from Hurricane, Utah. A well known cowboy and packer in the North Rim Grand Canyon Area, found an absolutely amazing Painted Panel in the area of Tuckup Canyon in 1986. He took pictures and sent them to Dick Marks, the National Park Service Superintendent. Marks sent a letter back to Smith calling him a liar and that no such panel existed in the United States. Said the pictures were probably from Australia. He showed two archaeologists to the site. Six months later, the NPS asked him to pack in a rock art specialist named Polly Shasma. Even after all that, Gordon still gets no credit for the find. In fact, the NPS has tried every way they could to erase his name from anything to do with the panel.

Enjoy thanks to Gordon Smith: