State parks... FYI

[bdhoward]

Howdy ya'll. I just thought I would post this as I've found that some of the information that others have posted on state parks can be misleading. I have found that many people have posted that state parks are "off limits". This is not entirely true, or at least in PA, that is. I have called 2 state parks in the last 2 days to ask if they allowed the use of metal detectors on park premises, and to my surprise, they said YES. The only thing they asked at one state park was not to detect the beaches while lifegaurds were on duty and at the other state park they requested that if anything of historical value was found that you submit it to the park office and not to leave holes. Other than those minor restrictions, you can detect to your hearts content. I'm sure that in some cases particular state parks will not allow detecting under any circumstances, but some allow detecting. If you have questions about a particular state park in PA I suggest you use this website and contact the appropriate person. http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/stateparks/parks/index.aspx I thought this was good information to share to those of you that thought that ALL state parks were OFF LIMITS. Thanks for looking and HH. Bryan H.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Brian, good post. When people tell others to say clear of state or federal parks, it's probably more of a "general" rule, than a hard-&-fast one. Because you're right: Of the lists compiled years ago of the state-by-state, some of them simply had (and perhaps still have) no restrictions. And others said "yes, but inquire at each kiosk you come to", etc.. However, many others simply said "no", thus leading some persons, to this day, to simply lump them together, since very few said "yes", with no restrictions or exceptions.

Here is an example of one such state by state list:

http://www.fmdac.org/parks/parks.htm

However, lists like this, are sometime inaccurate, when it comes to actual in-field conditions of actual practice. Because think of it: when someone compliled a list like that, 10, 20, or 30 yrs. ago, guess how they did it? They simply sent off 50 letters to all 50 states, asking "is metal detecting allowed in your state parks?". And oddly, they got back some "no's", (or "only with permission", etc...) from states where, quite frankly, state parks had never had a problem. Ie.: it had simply gone on, and no one had ever cared. Obviously what was happening is that whomever fields a letter inquiry like that, passed it up the chain to some deskbound legal beaver in state capitol, who then filters it through cultural heritage verbage, and decides the best answer is "no". But in rank and file parks around the state (barring obvious historic monuments) it had never been a problem. Thus, when these lists started circulating (starting with a book by R. W. Grim) some people, in some states, were left scratching their heads, when grim-dire sounding wording was spelled out for their states. It was as if they asked themselves "since when?" Gee that's funny, I never had a problem

And it even continues to this day, where you might be in one of those states that the list simply says "yes" on, yet still get booted by someone who thinks you'll leave holes, or shouldn't be around a historic monument, etc... Or conversely, you might be at one state with a blatant "no", yet have no problem at all hunting, because no one cares at some particular one, and you're just ignored. And another odd out-come: you might get a "yes" from one person answering the phone, and a "no" if another person was to answer the phone the next day, because each of them are filtering it through their own mental perceptions of the nature of your question.

 

[bdhoward]

Exactly Tom. I had that exact issue at a historic college campus not long ago. I went to the campus security office one day and asked permission to metal detect on the grounds. After a few phone calls were made by their security office they finally spoke with the proper individual responsible for making these decisions and he granted me permission as long as I didnt LEAVE any holes/damage to the property. I was stoked! About a week later while detecting on the campus with a multitude of great finds, 2 campus security officers pulled up and asked me what I was doing. They said "metal detecting WAS allowed but NO DIGGING OF HOLES was permitted..." I informed them of my visit to their office and was granted permission by the proper authority, but they disregarded my claim and told me that I would have to leave the grounds until they further investigated my claim. I cordially left my contact information and left the grounds promtly, but have yet to hear back from the campus security office allowing me to continue MD'ing. This is so frusterating how you can do everything right, but all it takes is one guy with a "chip on his shoulder" to ruin it. In the week I was on site detecting I was seen by many different security officers that waved at me and passed me by. All it took was one guy that has a "god complex" to interperret the conditions of my presence wrong to ruin my fun. It just goes to show how you can get a "yes" from some, but a "no" from others. Just be sure that no matter where you detect you get a "yes" from the proper authority. I plan on going back up to campus security office very soon to restore my right to MD on the property. Thanks for the link and HH. Bryan H.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

bhoward, your college campus story, is very telling of some psychology of this hobby: There can be places where there are no prohibitions or ... in your case ... you got an outright "yes", etc... Yet this might not stop a nosy parker from seeing you out there, and complaining that you're hurting earthworms, or that the frequencies your machine emits bothers their dogs, or whatever And when the authority comes out and sees you, let's face it: the leshe digger you're carrying (or even if it's nothing more than a screwdriver) will conjur up images in their mind EVEN IF YOU PLAN TO LEAVE ABSOLUTELY NO TRACE! And you will certainly loose the battle of semantics of whether you were told to leave no marks, verses no digging whatsover, verses probing and popping out only shallow stuff, etc... It's going to be a loosing battle, because all they have to do is tell their higher ups: "he was digging", and you will loose the semantics battle.

Thus, it's gotten to where I do all my hunting in turf, at really odd/off hours. I mean, heck, if the park is full of people in the middle of the day, or it's the day that park is being mowed, etc... is the time to not go there. Heck, I've even gotten to where I hunt some parks only at night. Not because I necessarily think I'm doing anything wrong, but I just don't want a busy-body to make any assumptions, and get a rule written, where none existed before. We're in an odd hobby that draws stares, so we need to pick times where lookie-lous are not going to be there, IMHO. Perhaps you had no way to anticipate that security coming up to you, but ... I'm just sayin, for others, that out of site is out of mind. And the best way to keep a "yes" to stay a "yes", is to not stick out and draw attention to yourself thereafter.

 

[bdhoward]

I agree 100%. I always "recon" my site prior to actually deciding to hunt based on a number of factors. If I see any "red flags" that I might encounter during my hunt I simply move on to my next best site and size up that situation and so on... Having an absolute YES from "big man on campus" gave me a false sense of security to hunt there freely as it turns out. Although I'm still gonna try to get him to allow me to return, it was a valuable lesson to learn. I completely understand what your saying about "out of site, out of mind" and hunting during "off" hours and being as inconspicuous as you can, but sometimes that can be interpreted as suspicious activity in itself and can draw unnessessary attention. It's kinda like "Damned if you do, Damned if you dont". Its a hard wire to walk with our hobby. All that one can do is get permission and try their best to not draw attention to ones self and hope for the best. Thanks for the advice. Bryan H.

 

[Cool Hand Fluke]

Get the business card of the person who gives you permission to hunt. You can then show the card to prove you have permission to hunt. Preferably, who want a business card from a suppervisor or manager of the area in question. Most of the "busy bodies" will back off when they see their bosses name on a card.

 

[bdhoward]

Get the business card of the person who gives you permission to hunt. You can then show the card to prove you have permission to hunt. Preferably, who want a business card from a suppervisor or manager of the area in question. Most of the "busy bodies" will back off when they see their bosses name on a card.

Very true. Good info. Bryan H.