Which deep detector??

[noz03]

Some people might remember my old post, well I'm still looking and after a month of research Ive narrowed down to 3 detectors. Although mostly the first 2.

Baiscally I'm going to be searching inside extremely old houses for relics and boxes of coins etc up to 1m deep. There might be a lot of junk but most of these houses are so old only some of them have modern pluming and electric cables etc.

So I'm trying to decide which would be best for me.

Fisher Gemini
FISHER METAL DETECTOR Gemini-3 (Two Box Unit) | eBay


Whites TM 808
TM 808 Metal Detector


Or

Blisstool LTC64X
BLISSTOOL LTC64X v3 Metal Detector - Coil Combo - Shipped Fast - Free | eBay


So what do you guys think?? Ive looked at the etracs but they don't seem to have enough depth for what I want, Ive seen a few field test vids on the blisstool though and it seems to be a decent bit deeper than the standard detectors, though still not really up to a meter or more. Though the first 2 are definitely deeper I'm worried if they will have enough accuracy and descrimination for me. I'm a complete newbie in this field so any advice would be much appreciated!!

Thanks!

 

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[woof!]

Using a Gemini 2-box unit, it's gonna be pretty tough searching for a cache inside a house that has metallic plumbing and wiring or has rebar in the floor or foundation.

--Dave J.

 

[Terry Soloman]

You are going to be searching INSIDE old houses? I don't understand how that is going to work out for you - Like THROUGH floors?

 

[Dixiegal]

The 808 is great for finding stuff in the ground but not so hot for walls. We have used ours many times on the walls of holes and the walls of old ruins in the woods etc. We love the 808 but would not recommend it for walls.

 

[Frankn]

I have never tried my Hays, which is practly the same as the Gemini, inside a house, but I have used it inside and outside foundations. It has found a 50 cal. ammo box in a stone wall foundation. What you have to remember is that the 2 Box detector picks up in a circular pattern around you. In the ground items will only pick up when you are practically standing on top of them, but above ground items will pick up anywhere in a circular radius around you. In a house with plumbing, it would sound off constantly because of the mass of iron and/or copper surrounding you. Frank

 

[Tom_in_CA]

reply

You've gotten some good information about the limititations of 2-box detectors so far: That they're more suited for ground, than walls. Otherwise, if you were looking for your "boxes of coins", the 2-box would be the way to go. Because it will inherently simply not see the little stuff (anything smaller than a soda can or so).

You keep saying you want super depth, but .... if you're talking about stuff hidden in walls, or under secret floor panels, and such as that, then Why or Why would you think you need ultra depth? I mean, think about it: A wall is only a foot thick? So what you're saying doesn't make sense. And if you're talking about in-the-ground searching, the same thing: Why do you automatically think something is .... of necessity, buried more than a few foot deep? Remember: whoever hid it, had it in mind that he was going to retrieve it someday, afterall. So what the h*ck difference did 1 ft. deep, vs 5 ft. deep make, if the only thing that mattered was that the top of the ground presented a sufficient disguise?

If you try to use a standard coin detector (like the etrac or blisstool you allude to), then the downside of that, for use in "walls" is going to be that every little nail, plumbing, wires, etc... will all give signals).

A possible option for you is to get a dumbed down all-metal TR, like the "Viking" (sold in England). Or an American version of this is the older vintage Compass 77b, or auto-legend, etc... Those machines could scarcely get a coin to 6" deep, .... HOWEVER, they inherently saw through small iron, as if it wasn't even there. And their "lack of sensitivity" is a good thing when cache hunting, so you're not bothered with nuisance little things. However, big things (jar or box sized things) had no problem beeping at deeper depths. Oh sure the all-metal TR machine will still get the pipes, but with a little common sense logic, you can trace out their signal, and know it's a linear wall-frame or pipe, or whatever.

 

[Rick59]

Get a Garrett GTI 2500 extremely versitle green machine it will do almost everything, it has its detractors but that is because they do not know how to set up the green unit for hunting!!!

 

[noz03]

You've gotten some good information about the limititations of 2-box detectors so far: That they're more suited for ground, than walls. Otherwise, if you were looking for your "boxes of coins", the 2-box would be the way to go. Because it will inherently simply not see the little stuff (anything smaller than a soda can or so).

You keep saying you want super depth, but .... if you're talking about stuff hidden in walls, or under secret floor panels, and such as that, then Why or Why would you think you need ultra depth? I mean, think about it: A wall is only a foot thick? So what you're saying doesn't make sense. And if you're talking about in-the-ground searching, the same thing: Why do you automatically think something is .... of necessity, buried more than a few foot deep? Remember: whoever hid it, had it in mind that he was going to retrieve it someday, afterall. So what the h*ck difference did 1 ft. deep, vs 5 ft. deep make, if the only thing that mattered was that the top of the ground presented a sufficient disguise?

If you try to use a standard coin detector (like the etrac or blisstool you allude to), then the downside of that, for use in "walls" is going to be that every little nail, plumbing, wires, etc... will all give signals).

A possible option for you is to get a dumbed down all-metal TR, like the "Viking" (sold in England). Or an American version of this is the older vintage Compass 77b, or auto-legend, etc... Those machines could scarcely get a coin to 6" deep, .... HOWEVER, they inherently saw through small iron, as if it wasn't even there. And their "lack of sensitivity" is a good thing when cache hunting, so you're not bothered with nuisance little things. However, big things (jar or box sized things) had no problem beeping at deeper depths. Oh sure the all-metal TR machine will still get the pipes, but with a little common sense logic, you can trace out their signal, and know it's a linear wall-frame or pipe, or whatever.

Well to be honest I kind of agree with you but my friend insists we need deeper! Originally he wanted 3 meters of depth, I convinced him that was basically impossible. As for how many pipes and so on there will be, i will talk to him tomorrow and find out but he said there shouldnt be any. Although there might be nails and stuff, maybe even bars in the walls when we are trying to search in the ground, would that affect it?

When you say a dumbed down all metal TR you mean just because it can see though iron? How deep can they search though? I took a look for the viking but a bunch of different stuff came up.

 

[Sandman]

What Tom says is true. If you are looking for a detector that can reach 3 meters down take note that that also means it will reach 3 meters on each side to "see" any large metal near by. This means it will see about 18 foot all around you. You should study what metal detectors are capable of to understand what you can or can't do.

 

[noz03]

Is that true? That a detector can only detect as deep as the diameter of its coil? That info needs to be published a bit more haha, i had no idea.

 

[rossman85]

Being new to metal detecting and checking out this thread, all i have to say is those 2 box detectors do not look like fun to swing around, or whatever you do with them..lol

 

[Frankn]

The 2 Box is a specialized detector for cache hunting. It goes deep, over 6' and ignores the small junk. You don't swing it. I use a shoulder strap and run the unit at about arms length down from my shoulder. This avoids all the weeds and tall grass that would stop a conventional detector. Don't knock it if you haven't tried it. Frank

 

[rossman85]

The 2 Box is a specialized detector for cache hunting. It goes deep, over 6' and ignores the small junk. You don't swing it. I use a shoulder strap and run the unit at about arms length down from my shoulder. This avoids all the weeds and tall grass that would stop a conventional detector. Don't knock it if you haven't tried it. FrankView attachment 664574

I'm not knocking it frank, just think they are interesting looking more or less, im sure they are good at what they do though

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Is that true? That a detector can only detect as deep as the diameter of its coil? That info needs to be published a bit more haha, i had no idea.

Noz03, to answer several of your questions:

The old addage that a detector goes as deep as the diameter of the coil, is true for coin sized targets. For example: If you have a 10" coil, you can get a coin down to about 10" deep, and so forth (with variables, of course, between machines/brands, but approx.). But no, this is not true for larger targets. For example: if whatever machine you're using can get a certain coin to 10" deep, TRUST ME: It will find a toaster sized or jar sized item much deeper.

As for your friends insisting that their supposed caches are "of necessity" super deep: this is a common misconception that your friends are taken with, as you can see. I encountered this assumption when cache hunting in Mexico too: Everyone is convinced that treasures are going to be super deep. So for example: if you go into a cave to hunt where they believe there's a treasure (which always turn out to be nothing more than superstition, haha), and if you show them that there's absolutly no beeps, barring a single aluminum can or something, here's what they'll do: They will never believe that there's "no treasure". Instead, they will immediately think it's because your machine "doesn't go deep enough", doh!

When I say "dumbed down", it's referring to sensitivity: If I were cache hunting walls of houses, the LAST thing I would want is "more sensitivity". Because think of it: If there WERE a jar or box or something hidden in those walls, that is a big item, not a small one. So you want to dumb down whatever machine you're using, even to the point where it won't get a coin at more than an inch, for instance. By doing that, you'll nix out nails, wires, etc... But a jar or whatever will still come in, at even up to a foot.

Another thing to be aware of, is if there is rebar (within brick or cinder-block) or chicken screen with plaster/lathe. If the walls are completely laced with some sort of metal, then you're not going to be able to use any detector.

Ironically, there were more caches found back in the 1950s and '60s, with old and primitive insensitive machines. Back in the BFO days, when someone went to a ghost town, or poked around ruins, he probably had a machine that wasn't sensitive enough to find coin sized things, unless they were only an inch or two deep. However, those old BFOs and surplus mine detectors however, could still find hubcab sized things quite nicely So as cumbersome and in-sensitive as those old-school machines were, yet more caches were found in those days, as the insensitive machines were .... in essense ...... the perfect discriminator so as not to be bothered with pesky coin sized things.

And lest you think you can "get the best of both worlds" by having a "balls-to-the-walls" sensitive machine, yet somehow just "ignore" all smaller coin-sized targets, ...... think again: In the real world, when you get out there in junk riddled ruins, where the ground is one giant un-ending signals of junk and iron, you will never be able to magically pass up the little stuff, and "only go for the big signals". The only place where selectivity like this is possible, is in something like the wide open beach, where you can compare individual isolated separated signals. Then yes, the difference between a coin-sized signal, and a deep can or whatever, can be differentiated via audio. But when you're in a carpet/chorus of signals at some junky ghost town ruins, you'll be forever digging stuff "just to be sure". So if caches are your goal, you're much better off with a two-box (if working the ground), or a dumbed down all-metal-TR (if working walls).

 

[Frankn]

Tom, lot of good info in your post, but I must disagree with the coil to depth relationship. I have used a goldbug II that belonged to a friend. It had a small nugget coil and I was finding nuggets much deeper than the diameter of the coil. I would also say that this does not apply to PI detectors. I have found rings on the beach with my surfmaster PI at 11". There is also the case of 2 Box detectors where a 1'sq coil goes down over 6'. Frank