A Challenge for the Skeptics! ;)

[Oroblanco]

If Oro could actually dowse, then he would welcome the Skeptic organization based in Tucson to give him a “dowse the bucket of water” pre-test. If Oro passed that pre-test, then he should qualify for the Million Dollar Challenge.

Oro stated they are low on funds, and here is his chance to rectify that problem. Sounds simple enough, eh?

Ah, heh. My "chance to rectify" a monetary problem, by traveling to Randi's location (can't afford that, for your info - want to lend me the traveling costs? ) or to Carl's location in order to take a "pre-test" on buckets of water, which I have never claimed to be able to dowse, nor even attempted (yet - if the winds die down here today I will try it though.) I have tried to state this as clearly as I possibly can, I feel no need to "prove" that dowsing works, I have seen it and done it, I have also seen that several skeptics have a desire to post sizable amounts of money to 'test' claims of dowsing, it seems quite logical (and can be supported by numerous negative posts here) that these same skeptics really desire to "prove" that dowsing does not work. I don't have the funds to go buy my own drill rig to drill a water well, (saving up for it though) and though heck if some skeptic only wants to be able to claim a "victory" in "proving" that dowsing doesn't work, and would not mind getting a drill rig and hauling it here to drill a spot I have marked, I won't mind one bit - so long as I can get that hole drilled. It is NOT a real "test" - in fact I am absolutely certain that the hole drilled will produce water, which would really "prove" that the dowsing "worked" - but don't mind the skeptic claiming it did not work since my purpose is to get the hole drilled. This is why I also offered to toss in the $500 (amount saved) to help defray expenses of the skeptic.

I have also stated my opinion that offering cash 'prizes' for 'tests' or contests really is not going to end well - either the person(s) taking the test will be unhappy or the person paying out will be unhappy - and I have not been able to find any skeptic's organization here for that matter. I think we should keep our 'tests' for fun, forget the money and keep our friends.

Have I made this clear enough? It is NOT a real "test" and I have zero doubt the first hole drilled will produce water, which would actually be a successful result of dowsing IF IT WERE A REAL TEST - but regardless of outcome the skeptic has my written permission to claim a victory and that I failed! How is this a "test"? Where did I claim that I can dowse water in buckets, for that matter - I don't see a "need" for such a "pre-test" since the 'test' to follow is NOT A REAL TEST - a publicity gimmick if you want to call it that, the publicity being for the skeptic's use, the water well being my "reward". If you want me to dowse buckets, I will sure try it but I have made no claim that I can do this and have NO idea if it will even work - for what I believe water dowsing with L-rods to be is an electrical phenomenon, and I don't know if a bucket of water will have enough of an electrical charge to cause a reaction on L-rods. Perhaps it might require a lighter-gauge of wire rods to work I just don't know and have not experimented along this line. What point would a "pre-test" be, for a NON-test to follow it?

Oh well, I don't expect there are any skeptics who would want to go out of their way for the sake of a guaranteed 'victory' such as I am offering, but who knows? If none take the offer by the time I save up enough to buy my own rig, the offer will be withdrawn - but if any T-net 'skeptic' member here still has the curiosity they will be welcome to come and watch, free (but no $500 offer, sorry but that will be going into the rig).

Oroblanco

 

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[aarthrj3811]

If Oro could actually dowse, then he would welcome the Skeptic organization based in Tucson to give him a “dowse the bucket of water” pre-test.

With the new criteria in place, the foundation will, at its option, dispense with the preliminary test and move right to the money game.

It again seems like Randi has stuck again. You and him can't seem to get on the same page. ..Art

 

[Oroblanco]

What is there for me to prove to you? I have stated this before, I don't feel any need or desire to try to "prove" dowsing to you or to anyone else. You want me to go try to "win" some kind of "prize" money, using dowsing - which will entail a pre-test doing something I have made NO claims to be able to do, and don't even know if that works. I might as well buy lottery tickets. Yeesh. I would sooner try a marksmanship contest - anyone want to post a $10k prize, if I can shoot as well as I claim?

Let me repeat this - I AM NOT TRYING TO PROVE ANYTHING - my purpose is to get a hole drilled. Period. When I have saved up enough to just buy my own drill, the offer will be recanted - however SWR or any one else would then be welcome to come and watch, free. Be forewarned though the "road" (cowpath) to here is pretty rough, 4WD is recommended.

Oroblanco

 

[aarthrj3811]

I guess that is a no.....To tough of a test for them...I guess you don't want to dig the $200,000 in gold coins I passed on either....Art

 

[aarthrj3811]

SWR....How many times have you posted that we do not dig our finds? Here is one of many chances to prove us wrong. I say there is $200,000 in gold coins at this spot. Why will you not go and at least run some test on this spot? It is simple.....When you find that I am right you will have spent a lot of money. When you want to recover the coins you will find that to get permission to dig is very expensive. When you dig up the coins you will find that they are not yours. After many years in court you will find that you have spent a lot of money for nothing....So: are you going to dig the coins or do what I did....Art

 

[aarthrj3811]

Gee Jean...I GUESS you don't read very well. At least 3 people confirmed Sandsteds find. My find has only been confirmed with a GPR. So whats your problem. Your welcome to come and dig it...Art

 

[PBK]

WARNING!

Accusations of lying absolutely will not be tolerated.

If you must make such comments about another member, do so directly to him in a PM— not in an open forum.

I'm not interested in hearing any excuses or explanations for it...

DON'T DO IT AGAIN!

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

try http//wikipedia.org type in "misuse and using false data in computing statistics". There areover 3015 pages

Like Marks, I am a sceptic, but of a different kind. His scepticism is directed towards anything he regards as "paranormal", taking as normal that which lies within the limits of ---- "current" -- scientific understanding.

"My scepticism is directed towards the --------"assumption that we know enough to proclaim what is possible and what is not".

Tropical Tramp

 

[ClonedSIM]

SWR....How many times have you posted that we do not dig our finds? Here is one of many chances to prove us wrong. I say there is $200,000 in gold coins at this spot. Why will you not go and at least run some test on this spot? It is simple.....When you find that I am right you will have spent a lot of money. When you want to recover the coins you will find that to get permission to dig is very expensive. When you dig up the coins you will find that they are not yours. After many years in court you will find that you have spent a lot of money for nothing....So: are you going to dig the coins or do what I did....Art

This is such an odd way to show that dowsing is real. First you tell us where you "think" there is $200,000 in buried coins, then you tell us that since you have no plans to retrieve them, maybe a skeptic should try. Then you tell us that it would be more expensive to retrieve them than they are worth, and they would be taken away once unburied? How about this, Art? Tell everyone here where you think a treasure is buried in an accessible location. You know, a treasure that can actually be retrieved?

 

[aarthrj3811]

Tell everyone here where you think a treasure is buried in an accessible location. You know, a treasure that can actually be retrieved?

Whan we don't dig a target you jump up and down and tells us there is no prove that we found something...When I give you a target that you can dig you won't dig it because of the same reason I won''t dig it...The ones that are accessible are not there now....Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

Tell everyone here where you think a treasure is buried in an accessible location. You know, a treasure that can actually be retrieved?

Whan we don't dig a target you jump up and down and tells us there is no prove that we found something...When I give you a target that you can dig you won't dig it because of the same reason I won''t dig it...The ones that are accessible are not there now....Art

Ummm, I'll try to decipher this for you, Art.

Whan we don't dig a target you jump up and down and tells us there is no prove that we found something... That's the normal and rational response you can expect to get.
When I give you a target that you can dig you won't dig it because of the same reason I won''t dig it... Because they're not accessible?
The ones that are accessible are not there now....Art Um, then how are they accessible? Something that is not there is not accessible.....

So, basically when you tell us the location of a treasure, it's either impossible to dig or it's already gone...... man, I wish I had those skills.

Oh wait, I do! Let's see.....there is $50 million in gold bullion buried in a river in Colorado, but someone dug it up in the 1950's. And there's another billion in gold buried in a vault only 100 feet down, but it's under Fort Knox. Go check for yourself, it's there!

Let's try this again, Art. Can you tell us about a dowsed treasure that someone can actually dig up to verify?

 

[aarthrj3811]

The ones that are accessible are not there now....Art

Sorry af1733....That statement was an error. I do have a $40 cache that is easy to dig. I am using it as a test site...I am waiting for a Red Alert for the Sun with the moon up to do more testing...Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

The ones that are accessible are not there now....Art

Sorry af1733....That statement was an error. I do have a $40 cache that is easy to dig. I am using it as a test site...I am waiting for a Red Alert for the Sun with the moon up to do more testing...Art

.........

 

[ClonedSIM]

The ones that are accessible are not there now....Art

Sorry af1733....That statement was an error. I do have a $40 cache that is easy to dig. I am using it as a test site...I am waiting for a Red Alert for the Sun with the moon up to do more testing...Art

Is this $40 you buried and are using for a test target, or is this something you think is worth $40 and you actually dowsed it?

I was curious about that myself, since you referred to it as a "test site". And, Art? Are you serious about the red alert from the sun? That sounds like Mike(mont) talk.

 

[ClonedSIM]

Is this $40 you buried and are using for a test target, or is this something you think is worth $40 and you actually dowsed it?

I was curious about that myself, since you referred to it as a "test site". And, Art? Are you serious about the red alert from the sun? That sounds like Mike(mont) talk.

Well, maybe Mike....... but when he mentioned the Sun and the Moon playing a part in his dowsing, I immediately thought of Max Finklestein, from Down Under (dowser501).

Speaking of that, here we are just into Feb. 2007, and it seems to me Max said he thought he could start dowsing in early 2007. I think that's when his "season" opens up down there. He's been a little quiet, I wonder if he's out dowsing and digging up all that Jesuit treasure.

Oh shoot, that's right. Mike(mont) is the conspiracy paranoid, and dowser501 is the sun flare theorist. Maybe he is off dowsing since he can now, I don't know.

 

[aarthrj3811]

Is this $40 you buried and are using for a test target, or is this something you think is worth $40 and you actually dowsed it?

My research ( from the son of the man who buried 40 silver dollars in 1912) lead me to the site. I see this find as a chance to do some experiments on long time buried objects. I have already used the site to test some new equipment. I also am going to test some of Max's theories on this site. The last two Red Sun Alerts have shown me that Max's theories are valid and there is something to learn and perhaps use. ...Art

 

[aarthrj3811]

Gee Jean...I won't know the value until I take them to my coin man....There is tons of silver dollars still in curculation....Condition of the coins and the mint stamp are the key things. Until I do this they are just 40 silver dollars....Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

Gee Jean...I won't know the value until I take them to my coin man....There is tons of silver dollars still in curculation....Condition of the coins and the mint stamp are the key things. Until I do this they are just 40 silver dollars....Art

Ummm, no. You won't know the value till you dig them up. This is one part of the answer. The other is that Jean was right in saying that it is a $40 face value. You have 40 coins with a marked value of one dollar apiece, for a total of $40. The numismatic value is entirely different.

And, no, there are not tons of silver dollars in circulation. You'd be lucky to find one silver dollar in circulation.

 

[aarthrj3811]

And, no, there are not tons of silver dollars in circulation. You'd be lucky to find one silver dollar in circulation.

That may be right where you live...Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

And, no, there are not tons of silver dollars in circulation. You'd be lucky to find one silver dollar in circulation.

That may be right where you live...Art

Ummm.... Do you know what "in circulation" means when you're talking about coins, Art?