The Peralta Stone Maps, Real Maps to Lost Gold Mines or Cruel Hoax?

[sailaway]

Eldo,
No not some dreamed up rant,(have seen the video when you posted it before). I was talking about two years ago you said you were going to film your site, I told you then that you found a Uranium mine. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/lost-dutchman-s-mine/447362-new-show-dutchman-125.html#post4469262 told you then that there are even photos of Park Service personnel on the steps. Seeing lines drawn and circles does not impress me. You titled your google earth photo the "Lost Dutchman Mine", then you should have photos of 89% Jewelry Gold at the site, according to the assay from the Dutchman's ore.
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/lost-dutchman-s-mine/461199-legend-stone-maps-132.html#post5313897
You even thought you would get your repelling gear and go make money at another site I posted. My search is documented here with actual photos because I believe in the areas that I search. If you have found the Lost Dutchman Mine, why would you want to visit anything I found and posted?
Your claims of protecting your site by not posting anything of value is not an answer because neither you nor anyone else can legally take anything from within the Wilderness. Those claims usually mean there is evidence that proves your claims are invalid. Here is something for you and others to ponder, in your GE photo there is an ore cart by the steps. Was Waltz using an ore cart to work his ledge of gold? What was the time frame that ore carts like that were used? You claim it to be a Spanish Mine, what mule brought that ore cart in there? I wonder what the logistics would be like to transport a ore cart like that through the La Barge Box to your site. (E. Truax's Silver State Ore Car with the 1892 patent date)
Now some support on your line of thought about the codes. General James Wilkenson wrote the code to communicate with the Spanish. He was a long time supporter of using codes for military communications. Was there communications between Wilkenson and the Spaniards about finding a route around Santa Fe to the mines? yes, and even though the search north of Santa Fe was supported by the king, Pike was directed to not be seen by the Mexicans
http://wardepartmentpapers.org/sear...=Political relative situation&orderBy=&page=5
Beale spent his time drunk, chasing the madam in a whore house in Santa Fe.

 

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[sailaway]

Along the same ledge in Rogers Mining District as the other photo. I am finding there are more deposits along the elevated side of the fault line. More can be seen in this area but blocked by the trees.

 

[cactusjumper]

Because the Stone Maps could be laid out accurately on a topographic map and matched many of the landmarks on the ground, I always believed them to be authentic. What I found when I followed the map, was that they did not lead to treasure or a mine.

My conclusion was that the map was reverse engineered using actual canyons, landmarks, old mines/caves and mountains. This was further enforced when a trusted old timer and friend told me that Travis had tried to sell the maps to a number of locals.

Many of you know who my friends and sources have been over the years, so take if for what it's worth.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[somehiker]

Because the Stone Maps could be laid out accurately on a topographic map and matched many of the landmarks on the ground, I always believed them to be authentic. What I found when I followed the map, was that they did not lead to treasure or a mine.

My conclusion was that the map was reverse engineered using actual canyons, landmarks, old mines/caves and mountains. This was further enforced when a trusted old timer and friend told me that Travis had tried to sell the maps to a number of locals.

Many of you know who my friends and sources have been over the years, so take if for what it's worth.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

Hi Joe:

All part of the ever-growing legend I guess, and likely factual since Ryan has reported both the existence of at least four sets of copies made by Travis himself, along with some " blueprints ".
We also know of and have seen the receipt for those sold by Aileen Tumlinson to Clarence Mitchell....one "sucker" who was willing to pay $ 1,200.00 for what all those old timers already knew were nothing more than what you yourself have figured out. So, while Travis may not have had any marketing success with the locals, some who merely waited until they could buy what everyone knew were copies of the stones at the AMMM, it's possible he had better luck elsewhere.
Maybe even in Mexico

Regards:Wayne

 

[cactusjumper]

Hi Joe:

All part of the ever-growing legend I guess, and likely factual since Ryan has reported both the existence of at least four sets of copies made by Travis himself, along with some " blueprints ".
We also know of and have seen the receipt for those sold by Aileen Tumlinson to Clarence Mitchell....one "sucker" who was willing to pay $ 1,200.00 for what all those old timers already knew were nothing more than what you yourself have figured out. So, while Travis may not have had any marketing success with the locals, some who merely waited until they could buy what everyone knew were copies of the stones at the AMMM, it's possible he had better luck elsewhere.
Maybe even in Mexico

Regards:Wayne

Good Morning Wayne,

I have, pretty much, lost all interest in the Ryan saga. Better minds than mine are steering clear of that fiasco, and I have no doubts of their assessments. Too many "red flags" keep popping up on the Stone Maps. The LaFrance cave of gold bars has more going for it, in my mind, than just about any of the other stories. I am more than positive that his gold bar existed, although there may be some questions as to how he found it. These stories have a way of growing in leaps and bounds as time goes by.

Take care,

Joe

 

[sailaway]

Oro, being as I do not agree with any of the answers you gave, so I will post my answer to your poll here.
I believe the stone maps are copies of an original stone that was so weathered that Travis felt no one would believe it was not just natural weathering of the rock surface. For this reason he felt that he had to show copies that were clearly marked. He even got things like the word voy wrong and spelled it boy because that is how it sounds in Spanish, would go as far as he had a Mexican in Texas read it to him, as he could barely make out the writing. To me if he got words wrong it also means there are even details that are missing or wrong on the maps we know today. These maps do not lead to a mine or treasure but are maps to private property that without proof of ownership would be lost by the Mexican family who were living there. The date on the stones tell the story as it was the date in which Crook was passing through before finalization of the Gaddson Purchase. If followed properly, the map should lead to the foundation in Brads Canyon, that Roy Bradford found. Why is this area important? because it is one of the few places that year round water can be found in the tanks. What is more important than gold in the desert? WATER
I still feel the horse/priest stone is a depiction of Angel Basin at the Cliff Dwellings, being as you have to look 180 degrees to see one or the other of the features.
Both the Foundation in Brads Canyon and the Cliff Dwellings are exactly on the 33 degree line, strange? or Masonic?
However as I know there are repeating geologic patterns in the wilderness, and I have not been in Brads Canyon, there could be the exact same pattern there as in Angel Basin of the Horse / Priest.

 

[somehiker]

Good Morning Wayne,

I have, pretty much, lost all interest in the Ryan saga. Better minds than mine are steering clear of that fiasco, and I have no doubts of their assessments. Too many "red flags" keep popping up on the Stone Maps. The LaFrance cave of gold bars has more going for it, in my mind, than just about any of the other stories. I am more than positive that his gold bar existed, although there may be some questions as to how he found it. These stories have a way of growing in leaps and bounds as time goes by.

Take care,

Joe

I've also had some interest in the stories of Harry's cave of gold bars Joe, as well as that of Bob Brady, who Tracy Hawkins said had an identical gold bar to that of Harry's.
And Ray Diamond's discovery and subsequent loss of another gold bar under similar circumstances added a bit more to all that went on back then.
In fact, I've previously posted about a cave I found in a brush filled canyon, although I wasn't there to take shelter from a downpour. Like them, I also decided to crawl through the smaller passage at the back of the larger part of the cave to see where it went. And as they, also found it led to a place where it was easy to stand up, and had a second opening at the top.

Back of cave showing smaller opening.....



from about 20 ft. in, with standing room at end not far ahead.....



Unfortunately, the presence of a diamondback that had slithered away and into that room, kept me from going in for a good look around myself.

Regards:Wayne

 

[sdcfia]

I've also had some interest in the stories of Harry's cave of gold bars Joe, as well as that of Bob Brady, who Tracy Hawkins said had an identical gold bar to that of Harry's.
And Ray Diamond's discovery and subsequent loss of another gold bar under similar circumstances added a bit more to all that went on back then.
In fact, I've previously posted about a cave I found in a brush filled canyon, although I wasn't there to take shelter from a downpour. Like them, I also decided to crawl through the smaller passage at the back of the larger part of the cave to see where it went. And as they, also found it led to a place where it was easy to stand up, and had a second opening at the top.

Back of cave showing smaller opening.....

View attachment 1429879

from about 20 ft. in, with standing room at end not far ahead.....

View attachment 1429883

Unfortunately, the presence of a diamondback that had slithered away and into that room, kept me from going in for a good look around myself.

Regards:Wayne

How curious are you about that back cave?

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Of course, always wear leather boots in the mountains too - not those sissy suede/fabric things.

 

[deducer]

 

[azdave35]

How curious are you about that back cave?

Snake chaps Snake Chaps- Lightweight & Comfortable Protection

Puncture proof gloves/gauntlets https://www.amazon.com/HexArmor-Hercules-Puncture-Resistant-Gloves/dp/B007TUVPLC?tag=hix-20

Of course, always wear leather boots in the mountains too - not those sissy suede/fabric things.

nice little smoke bomb should run them rattlers out

 

[somehiker]

nice little smoke bomb should run them rattlers out

Did something like that with the bees in another hole out there. Lighter fluid and a package of wiper rags from the dollar store. Lit them up for a bit, then stomped the flames out and tossed the smouldering heap into the drift. Cleared them right out and gave me enough time to look it over. Last time I was there, the hive was abandoned, dried up and pretty much gone. Not a bee in sight.
I'm not all that spooked by snakes, and will probably go back when it's a bit cooler in there. That tends to slow them down and keep them tucked away in their hiding spots, where they aren't a problem. I did get a brief peek into the room at the end.....didn't see any obvious stacks of gold bars though. Just a rectangular area about 8 x 10 with a flat floor of rocks like you can see scattered around the tunnel. But got to thinking after.....too neat looking, and why no bigger chunks of rock ?
In fact it looked empty, but maybe it was supposed to ?

 

[somehiker]

View attachment 1429991

Paul might remember a scene like that.....

 

[sdcfia]

.....didn't see any obvious stacks of gold bars though. Just a rectangular area about 8 x 10 with a flat floor of rocks like you can see scattered around the tunnel. But got to thinking after.....too neat looking, and why no bigger chunks of rock? In fact it looked empty, but maybe it was supposed to ?

Where would you hide a bunch of gold bars? Stacked on the floor in the back of a cave ("Nothing here, let's move on"), or buried under the floor of that cave?

 

[nobodie]

Look for a good size pile of dirt against a wall, any where from the entrance to the back mostly closer to the entrance. If there is then check pile, there may be a couple of gold bars in it. If there is or not, start digging behind the pile at the wall. It was a trick to find the bars in the dirt, find nothing else and you will go away happy with what you have found. Behind the wall at the dirt pile would be a room filled with gold bars and bags of gold.

 

[sailaway]

Remember the story of Doc Noss? Another shaft in floor under a fitted lipped flat stone.

 

[somehiker]

Where would you hide a bunch of gold bars? Stacked on the floor in the back of a cave ("Nothing here, let's move on"), or buried under the floor of that cave?

Yes, that's more or less what I was thinking. Guess I'll have to go back in for a closer look.
It's all up against a vertical rock face.... about half way up one side of the canyon, so there might be another passage somewhere in that direction, but concealed.
Might also have been used for temporary storage, but empty now.

 

[Azquester]

Fella's,

I once read a story somewhere about a cave that "Pinched out" in solid rock near the end. When you crawled up in there at the end you needed to turn over and lay on your back. In the ceiling was a trap door made from natural looking rock carved and fitted in the roof of the cave which had to be lifted up as you slide on your back into the pinched out bed rock dead end looking crawl tunnel.

This was one of secret ways of hiding treasure rooms! They did it that way as the pinched out areas were natural places for snakes, rats, and bee's to congregate thus providing the deterrent to explore or find the hidden room. When someone looks in there all you see is a dead end with hardly enough room for one to squeeze into so you wouldn't bother. The ceiling usually hung down enough that in didn't show or reveal the natural looking cracks of the tombstone thick trap door at the end. If you looked hard enough you could see the scrapes in the ceiling where the door was slid into position from inside the Treasure Room.


Just my two cents.

 

[Real of Tayopa]

morning Bill, That brings up the question, " How'd they do that, with only squirming room"?

 

[sgtfda]

With a laser

 

[Real of Tayopa]

Ah yes, sgt