After a ton of Electrolysis baths cleaning and repeat..Identify this

Beeps in my sleep · Nov 20, 2013

After quite a few long electrolysis baths, careful cleaning, having a friend help that specializes in cleaning up old things, I need to find out what these markings are. I can't find any info on Google. ( Note: One Electrolysis Machine died in the cleaning of this...moment of silence)

NHBandit · Nov 21, 2013

The backside tells a story as well. It's OLD. Has a hand forged look to it. The 4 leaf clover marking on the back means something but I'm not finding it in my Google searches. Still on the fence whether or not the "crown" looking thing on top of the "0" is a proof mark or a rust pit. There is a small letter "P" though just above the screw hole that I see when I enlarge the pic. Anyone got an old Bannerman catalog ?

huntsman53 · Nov 21, 2013

Tejaas said:
Whatever it was, American Revolution, Civil War, Etc...
It IS military. The only reason these buttplates get marked like this is for catalog, inventory, or issue... Even back then Uncle Sam (or her majesty) had to account for battlefield losses, captures, and statement of charges were issued! Haha

I agree! The markings are definitely Regiment or other.

Frank

DCMatt · Nov 21, 2013

This is for Beeps and DCMatt!

This is absolutely interesting. I am not saying "I am right, you are wrong" at all, but I'd like to state my facts! No offense to anyone!

Absolutely NO offense taken. Opinions and ideas are part of the research process. If anyone is going to be offended when someone disagrees with them (or proves them wrong) they need to go play in someone else's yard.

I still think it is a crown. There is a mark below it that almost looks like an inverted 'V'.

Still searching.

DCMatt

huntsman53 · Nov 21, 2013

I also believe that it is a Crown on a Staff and not a hit such as damage! See edited and cropped pics below.

Frank

NHBandit · Nov 21, 2013

I don't see anything like it here but that dosn't mean it's not a proof mark.

huntsman53 · Nov 21, 2013

Could the Crown signify "Royal" as in 10th Royal Infantry Regiment?

Frank

pippinwhitepaws · Nov 21, 2013

ok..we are looking at at least two(2) sets of proof marks here.

the first, the manufacture, is the crown over a stylized e...do I see another mark between those two locations?
the second set of marks are armor's marks...unit designations...
I thought it was a 1853 enfield...but the enfield has three screw holes on the plate...
I believe the style of proof prove this piece to be pre civil war...no later than about 1830...but I have been wrong with alarming regularity...

Goldiver · Nov 21, 2013

The buttplate looks very similar to the French Charleville musket buttplates. Cool that it is marked like that too. 10th Jaeger (riflemen) unit?

Steve

pippinwhitepaws · Nov 21, 2013

http://www.nramuseum.org/media/940944/proofmarks.pdf

NHBandit · Nov 21, 2013

pippinwhitepaws said:
http://www.nramuseum.org/media/940944/proofmarks.pdf

I already posted that link and there are none exactly like his. It's also not an 1853 Enfield. This is the mantle above my bedroom fireplace... 1853 Enfield dated 1857. And yes it's a real one, not a replica. I also have the matching bayonet in my display table. Brass buttplate although they did make them in steel as well. They look nothing like what the OP found.

pippinwhitepaws · Nov 21, 2013

geeze..I admitted it wasn't an enfield...just the proofs reminded me of some early English pieces...so I went hunting the proofs...
sorry I missed your post.

NHBandit · Nov 21, 2013

pippinwhitepaws said:
geeze..I admitted it wasn't an enfield...just the proofs reminded me of some early English pieces...so I went hunting the proofs...
sorry I missed your post.

It's all good. Just trying to help same as you are. I love a good mystery and I'm bored. Been trying to solve this ever since I opened this thread. I just saw the opportunity to show off my Enfield and I took it... LoL Here's some more of my junk. The belt & buckle came from an estate auction in Southern Alabama and they are both the real deal as well. We all know the buckles aren't all that rare but finding an original belt that hasn't turned back into dirt is tough. Luckily it sat in someones home since the end of the war. The centerpiece is an actual bill of sale for a slave named Jacob dated 1848.

DCMatt · Nov 21, 2013

NHBandit wrote:

auction in Southern Alabama

I'm originally from Mobile. We call it "Lower Alabama" as "Southern Alabama" seems redundant. So when people ask I usually them I was born in L.A.

:tongue3:

Love the collection - especially the P53 in the bedroom. Is it a shooter or a wall hanger?

DCMatt

NHBandit · Nov 21, 2013

DCMatt said:
NHBandit wrote:

I'm originally from Mobile. We call it "Lower Alabama" as "Southern Alabama" seems redundant. So when people ask I usually them I was born in L.A.

Love the collection - especially the P53 in the bedroom. Is it a shooter or a wall hanger?

DCMatt

Matt there's no reason it couldn't be fired I suppose but I've never tried it. The nipple for the cap is kinda beat from people dry firing it over the years and that should be replaced though. I got the belt & buckle from an estate auction in Foley while we were spending a Winter in Fairhope at a campground. Also got the slave bill of sale in that same area but in an antique shop. It's certified by the guy that does the Civil War appraisals for Antiques Roadshow. Fun stuff but there are ALOT of fakes out there so you have to be careful.

mustangpalmer1911 · Nov 21, 2013

I am just getting into BP weapons and starting to learn about that era of weapons. Exp the pre 1800s era. I am apprenticing under a gunmaker who makes American Longrifles and specialises in Jeager rifles and European weapons. I have just enough educationn in the era to look dumb. It looks iron, not many of the US made Rev era guns had iron hardware, it was to expensive. Even many of the European arms only lords, ..the rich had iron mounted weapons. Shortly after the Rev war the southern and mid west (TN, KY, VA, ect) state gunsmiths used iron more than brass because that was easier to get for them in the frontier than the brass made hardware mostly from Europe. Also the lines and curves don't look right for the Rev era. I am no expert by any means but I have to agree with Tejaas on the era of the weapon its from, but as to what weapon NO idea.

In fact I will email him and see what he thinks.

Beeps in my sleep · Nov 21, 2013

I want to thank everyone for continuing trying to help me identify this. I cleaned it best I could and my friend that restores old things did her best. I am learning a lot just listening to you all. This is why I love Tnet! Maybe I will have one of those Tnet Mysteries like that "E" button

mustangpalmer1911 · Nov 21, 2013

Can you take a pic of the face of it, and a side pic to see the curv of it?

Beeps in my sleep · Nov 21, 2013

mustangpalmer1911 said:
Can you take a pic of the face of it, and a side pic to see the curv of it?

Absolutely, I get off work in about an hour. I will retake the photos for you folks and upload them immediately. I should have them up by 5:30 P.M. EST.