Ancient Vaults, mines and crypts

[Deleted member 110535]

So, does anyone see a Lion in the top of this picture? Can someone give me an interpretation? It's sitting on a capped cave definitely a death trap. The entry has two hearts one visible from the front and below and one in the excavation in the entry. It also has a face on a turtle (maybe) looking rock, a couple arrow shaped rocks pointing at the entry and the main trigger stone has a circled star.
If anyone could help with an interpretation that would be great, I am usually ignored around here. My friends too think I am just a babbling old fool, but in all actuality I am just intrigued, maybe a little obsessed. Mostly curious.

 

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[Quinoa]

Your historic symbology is interesting and certainly could be applied to manmade objects used as trail signs, whether they were created long ago by the ancients or by modern man wanting to use ancient symbols as markers. The problem for me with the photos in Post #132 is that the "Xs" on those rocks are clearly the result of natural local cross-faulting, which is extremely common in many areas. They are certainly not carved.

That's only my opinion, and of course I could be wrong, but I see this stuff all the time - it's the manner in which magma cools and sets. You clearly see it exposed on the surface, but also underground in mines, caves, etc. As far as potential "treasure clues" go (there really aren't that many), I am personally alerted by clearly carved rocks, immovable placed rocks, out of place tree locations/patterns or obvious natural pareidolia objects that could be easily recognized as landmarks.

It was never meant to be that obvious to the uninformed such as you or I. More or less illusion is the rule.
But it won't matter anyways 20-30 years from now when we are all probably gone. I have some great trips planned with my wife this year.... Sedona in June and meet up with my cousins and his wife that we haven't seen in 20 years, and 9 day jeep trip with wife thru utah monument valley area in September. I'm not getting totally caught up in things that may not pan out in this lifetime. If they work out, they work out. I see the terrain for what it is and what I can do on it.

 

[Quinoa]

View attachment 2012341
So, does anyone see a Lion in the top of this picture? Can someone give me an interpretation? It's sitting on a capped cave definitely a death trap. The entry has two hearts one visible from the front and below and one in the excavation in the entry. It also has a face on a turtle (maybe) looking rock, a couple arrow shaped rocks pointing at the entry and the main trigger stone has a circled star.
If anyone could help with an interpretation that would be great, I am usually ignored around here. My friends too think I am just a babbling old fool, but in all actuality I am just intrigued, maybe a little obsessed. Mostly curious.

I sort of see it if I squint. Can't make anything of one picture. It would be very old..

 

[Quinoa]

Btw the "X" rocks are pretty obvious... It's just using a natural features to mark something. This one is a granite boulder in an area of only basalt for 20 miles. Where did it come from , the sky? An ice age? It was placed there.

 

[Deleted member 110535]

I sort of see it if I squint. Can't make anything of one picture. It would be very old..

I only have two pictures, the next is just slightly to the right. I was shooting into the sunlight from the south. I was interested in how loose that stone at the top of the arch was and didn't even notice the (maybe) lion figure. My eyesight is tuned to distance, the people I show the pictures to usually see and point them out to me. Same with the original heart pics from 2007. We didn't notice the heart and (maybe) lightning bolt until later on the computer screen then went back to verify. The heart is carved in 3D is the only way to describe it. The face it is in isn't nowhere near flat, but you can follow the lines up close in the chisel marks.
I have more pictures of the features I have described. Any slight coaxing and I'll post them. I also have a really short video on YouTube under my username RobertDraw labeled "Mesa Death Trap". I have permission from the property owner in the statement "I don't want to know about it and be careful!" From years ago.
What I mostly want to know is what next? Everyone I have taken there gets scared and refuses to go back. I'll admit a few of the factors make it scary. It is very steep. And yes I have found very old trails using the lidar maps that go it's direction but terminate at the rubble pile best I can tell.
I can also see just about exactly how it was built and it is right in the area of the Native Revolution that chased the Spanish away and killed quite a few according to the texts from their own (Spanish) writing as they fled.
I also take into account what Sandy says on here that one would never be found above ground (?), also the books which pretty much contradicts those statements. But I too am at least intimidated by it all, which is making me more careful and feeling stupid at times.

Anyway... Thanks for the response Q.

 

[sdcfia]

It was never meant to be that obvious to the uninformed such as you or I. More or less illusion is the rule.
But it won't matter anyways 20-30 years from now when we are all probably gone. I have some great trips planned with my wife this year.... Sedona in June and meet up with my cousins and his wife that we haven't seen in 20 years, and 9 day jeep trip with wife thru utah monument valley area in September. I'm not getting totally caught up in things that may not pan out in this lifetime. If they work out, they work out. I see the terrain for what it is and what I can do on it.

I'm glad you've got 20 or 30 left. I've been in Sedona in June - it's hot.

The rationalization for the alleged gold caches, whether "ancient" or "KGC" era, is that they will be retrieved following some sort of worldwide social collapse, with the cache owners then clearly in charge of their domains. Whoever owns the gold makes the rules, as they say. This seems plausible, I guess, but since ancient times there have been plenty of such chances for retrievals and it seems that if ancient caches did exist, they've either already been recovered or knowledge of their whereabouts has been lost. We can speculate about all sorts of ancient mojo, but it's just theories based on guesswork and squinting at rocks.

As far as the more recent alleged American-based caches are concerned, the same general principle is said to exist. Since the Civil War, and especially since the passage of the Federal Reserve Act in 1913, stalwart patriots are said to have stashed bullion to be retrieved if and when the American government collapses. There was allegedly a big upsurge in this kind of activity during the 1930s Great Depression when the US currency was radically debased and new gold caches were created to protect the metal from government confiscation. I know of one of these events here in about 1937 where a very wealthy mining man melted down many thousands of gold coins, poured them into crude bullion bars, hid them in a secure location, then fabricated a "Spanish treasure cave" story to send nosy people searching in the wrong area. Again - patriots waiting to make their political move later.

Can curious guys like you, me and many who read these forum posts figure out where all this loot is allegedly hidden? We may believe we can, but the results speak for themselves. We may not be rich, but hopefully we've learned a lot of interesting things along the way.

 

[Quinoa]

Yeah, it's tough to do and it's no walk in the park and you are not going to be "rich " and live the high life after. I am aware of the gold thing from the 30's . If you find something , ancient or modern , It's likely going to be black market type transactions and small increments , even if you make landowner deals or own the land. In most states, the state owns all treasure trove , even if you own the land. Laws were written into mining claims in that if it was loose ore or bullion that you found on your claim , it did not belong to the claim owner, but rather the state or the fed. (so they actually are acknowledging the existence of this stuff)

I used to talk to an old timer (now dead)that would come into a metal detector shop of a friend of mine that owned it. One time he pulled a 4-5 oz nugget out his pocket that he recently found and dropped on the counter top.. He knew quite a bit about the monuments and stuff as well as how to find naturally deposited gold. He told me about A local monument I asked about that he said was used in the 70's to gunsite over to 3 different caches that were dug up. He didn't say what they were. He didn't talk much if you asked too many questions. I knew of another large cache someone pulled in the same areas I frequent that it took 3 backpack loads for the person to get it out. He died very unusually at a gas station not long after finding it , at a gas station filling his tank, from a heart attack. Seemed to be in pretty good shape. He used to run around with Charles Garrett of Garrett electronics. Everyone used to hound his widowed wife for his diary, she said she lost it or something.

Yes a lot of these were dug in the 70s and 80s that were shallow by the monument spots. The deeper stuff is what is mainly left, and its hard to get at. That's what we are working on , methods, electronics, etc.
I'm also aware of a lot of other whacky stuff from friends whose relatives have dug up some wild stuff back in the 70's and 80's, some before many of the dams were put in and covered it all back up with backwater. One 12 foot skeleton, the guy was digging for pots and artifacts illegally, and found the skelly, got scared and left it and quit looting cause he got paranoid the feds were going to come after him. It's under water now. I am familiar with the general vicinity. But not interested.
There's way more. I guess it's all who you happen to talk to. But I've spent much of my time figuring things out on my own.

 

[Quinoa]

Robertdraw, your carving symbol in the first video you mentioned @ 27 seconds would be upsidedown and it would be an ancient symbol for God. Looks like a flag. You may have a mine there, the cinnabar is an indicator medium for gold, but you have to look at the base of the rock out-crops. It will be tunneled under it, but covered up if it's still good, because they followed the metals/mineralization/faults/dikes/veins back down under the outcrops.. A lot of them eventually pinched out and were abandoned.

 

[Deleted member 110535]

Robertdraw, your carving symbol in the first video you mentioned @ 27 seconds would be upsidedown and it would be an ancient symbol for God. Looks like a flag. You may have a mine there, the cinnabar is an indicator medium for gold, but you have to look at the base of the rock out-crops. It will be tunneled under it, but covered up if it's still good, because they followed the metals/mineralization/faults/dikes/veins back down under the outcrops.. A lot of them eventually pinched out and were abandoned.

Wow! I always wondered! Thank you Quinoa! In your opinion what era do you think it's from? I always suspected the Native Revolution era because I have heard the christians didn't use the crucifixion style cross yet in that era and no elongated leg crosses are anywhere I see, just the "t" one.
That monument was so cool. I remember it like yesterday (Feb 14th 2007). This about 4x6 plat of flat rocks in the gypsum type sand, with one standing in the middle with the carving facing south. I scraped the dried lichen off the face and found the symbol. What the symbol said to me was, whatever is there is down the Mesa.
On the 16th we traversed the steep and loose Mesa side, backtracked, then found the feature. One of the high points of my life actually. I have never spent a day without thinking about it. Then we climbed straight back up (not easy or safe) and boom there was the original monument.
I bug my friends to go all the time, but no one I know has any ambition except to sit around waiting for illicit substances. The capable ones aren't willing and the willing ones aren't capable.
I don't tell my friends I have permission so they don't get comfortable in the field. Even with permission I don't want to attract attention from their security or any interlopers.
For anyone listening, I ain't found a damn thing except what I described. If I had I wouldn't be here, I'd be out enjoying it.
Thanks again Q!

 

[sdcfia]

... I have some great trips planned with my wife this year.... Sedona in June ....

See if you can find this guy while you're hiking around Sedona.

 

[Quinoa]

I can't make it out yet what it is you have there.. but yeah, we will be there about during the summer solstice, going to be a lot of interesting things show up no doubt.. Upper right of your picture I see a peep hole along a cliff though... those can turn out to be something... show a place to stand, show a place over spot that's tunneled from below....
Mainly in Sedona we will be recreating and enjoying the company of my cousins we haven't seen in like 15-20 years. Cigars , wine etc will be the norm...
I will be looking for this sort of stuff though as I can't ever un-see it anymore. It stands out to me anymore.

 

[Quinoa]

Is it looking kinda to the left and upward? I thought that outcrop would look to the right at first, but I don't see anything image wise for to the right.

That's not one I can confirm. But.. if looking left and up...

The eye might be looking at an image of something on itself, like the shape of rocks making the peephole in upper right picture, which is often done, telling you what to look for.
Pretty abstract..... I'd maybe wait for the solstice...see what pops up.

 

[Quinoa]

Time passes faster than you think. This is actually educational on vaults and such and how old things are or how you can't tell....

 

[RuahFire]

Time passes faster than you think. This is actually educational on vaults and such and how old things are or how you can't tell....

You are making a parallel between how vaults are found and how the gold was hidden in this movie? The grave marked with the name "Arch Stanton" would be the parallel to the Criss Cross Spot, and the the grave marked "Unkown" would be the parallel to the actual digspot that is within 50 ft of the Criss Cross Spot?

In this movie the gold was actually just a few feet away from the final marker (invisible CC spot). My father loved this movie and I remember watching it with him as a kid. I had no Idea this scene was filmed in Spain. It brings back memories of better & different times.

 

[Quinoa]

No. it shows how fast the landscape changes.

 

[sdcfia]

Looks like a suspension of boots-on-the-ground for a couple weeks for many people - it's Juniper pollen season in the Southwest. This stuff is a killer for folks with any allergies. Multiply the one tree in this video by hundreds of thousands of male trees in the Pinon-Juniper zones and you can't avoid the stuff.

 

[Quinoa]

Oh...... I saw that happen where I live around mother's day.. all the trees in the parks had so much pollen coming off them, it was in clouds when the wind picked up a little.., my eyes were burning so bad we had to go home...

On another note, certain pine tree pollen is useful in tincture for a testosterone clone that you can hold under your tongue and get free hormonal benefits if you collect it yourself... the benefits can be soreness relief and recovery.... something you may want consider if you dig a lot and are over the age of 40. I just take the shot, and have for about the last year, made huge difference in pain and recovery from hiking ,old injuries that wouldn't heal, etc. It's a game changer when you are 45-50 and over. Wish I would have known about it earlier and the cost, which is cheap now. 40 bucks a month , low dose. Very safe. Should be part of every T-hunters resources, especially us older guys.... I'm not kidding.
If you can't roll out of bed the next day.....

 

[sdcfia]

Oh...... I saw that happen where I live around mother's day.. all the trees in the parks had so much pollen coming off them, it was in clouds when the wind picked up a little.., my eyes were burning so bad we had to go home...

On another note, certain pine tree pollen is useful in tincture for a testosterone clone that you can hold under your tongue and get free hormonal benefits if you collect it yourself... the benefits can be soreness relief and recovery.... something you may want consider if you dig a lot and are over the age of 40. I just take the shot, and have for about the last year, made huge difference in pain and recovery from hiking ,old injuries that wouldn't heal, etc. It's a game changer when you are 45-50 and over. Wish I would have known about it earlier and the cost, which is cheap now. 40 bucks a month , low dose. Very safe. Should be part of every T-hunters resources, especially us older guys.... I'm not kidding.
If you can't roll out of bed the next day.....

Well, one thing's guaranteed for nearly all humans - our body parts flat begin to wear out with advancing age, just like with any other machine on earth. At a certain point, a guy recognizes that he can't strain those parts like he used to. We need to keep moving but not as fast or far.

I agree with you that the natural world provides cures for practically any malady we need to deal with, and your experience is likely worth considering, although I've blown by your age cutoff point. I've always resisted pharma meds of any kind, even though I did get a prescription filled last year for human dose Ivermectin to have on hand, "just in case". Two years ago when the plandemic began, I began taking a teaspoon daily of powdered chaga mushrooms stirred into my morning coffee. It's a traditional immune system enhancer from the northern latitudes. A weak immune system is an open door to all sorts of trouble.

 

[Quinoa]

There's no cutoff age, people are taking it into their 70's and beyond.

 

[sdcfia]

There's no cutoff age, people are taking it into their 70's and beyond.

Depends on the activity. Assuming one remains healthy and physically active during his life, IMO he may begin noticing a decline in his abilities roughly as follows:
- Heavy pick & shovel work: about 55/60, then an accelerating decline to about 70, when he's pretty much done.
- Strenuous hiking in the mountains: about 65 or so, then less often and fewer hours to about 75, when half a day at a slower pace is enough.

You want to keep moving at all times, even at a slower pace, because if you stop at an older age level, you may not be able to start up again. The key is pacing. My theory is that the body has an abuse limit and that the owner is better served by allowing it to recuperate between strenuous events. Repeated every day heavy workouts does long term damage, IMO, than spurts of challenging effort sandwiched between rest days. When you get old enough, this becomes obvious.

Long distance trail walking is a good example of this. The successful straight-through CDT hikers (Mexico to Canada) are not in a hurry, but slow and steady with sometimes a week or more off along the way. If they push too hard, they may burn out and just quit. The strangest I've heard about is the ultra runners (100-mile and more foot racers). Some of them have trained too relentlessly and pushed themselves to the limit every day, trying to build and keep their edge. Unfortunately, their bodies can suffer permanent and irreparable damage to their legs, joints, feet and in some cases, experience a strange sudden body revolt that refuses to allow them to ever run again.