Animas River, Colorado - HUGE Environmental Disaster!!!

[jcazgoldchaser]

If you frequent the waters of the Animas, an EPA accident has released 1 million gallons of mining waste into the waterway.
Animas River fouled by 1 million gallons of contaminated mine water - The Denver Post

The La Plata County Sheriff's Office has closed the river from the San Juan County line – including Durango – to New Mexico. Authorities say they will re-evaluate the closure once the EPA tests are confirmed.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/08/us/wastewater-spill-in-colorado-turns-a-river-yellow.html?_r=0
The EPA spilled 1 million gallons of waste water - Business Insider

Be safe out there!!

 

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[fowledup]

Now that you guy's got that off your chest LOL, I sure hope so what has the EPA done about all the sediment that I saw a tv reporter dancing in or the businesses that depend on the river for their livelyhood? I'm on the east coast and seems out here it kinda' got lost in the wild fires the west is dealing with. Are they accually cleaning anything? or helping any of the businesses? Or more realisticly hoping it will all wash away. What's the old saying for spills "dilution is the solution for pollution"? Who know's? Would be shocked to see an Exxon Valdez type clean up that for sure would open them up to a whole new level of admission of guilt. US MINERS WILL CARRY ON WE'RE A TUFF BUNCH, WE'RE THE KIDS YOUR MOTHER WARNED YOU ABOUT![/QUOTE

 

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[nh.nugget]

I'm not trying to be a wise azz! just asking a question. I know this has been a heated thread. sorry if I upset people, not doing it to aggrevate anyone. I know here in NH. because it has to be so politically correct some one would already have been crucified. We've had a few cases with oil recyclers and a few old factories dumping lets just say not so enviromentaly friendly things. Just exspressing concern for the people affected by it.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Fouldup, please stop quoting members and adding your comments in middle of quote.. You can quote parts of post, answer it then quote another part and answer it.

 

[fowledup]

Sorry seen it done many times without issue. It seemed like an easy way to address only the parts of a persons post I wished to address. Guess I'm just screwing up all over the place. You could have pm'd me that instead of dressing me down in front of everyone, I'm a very sensitive individual, now I feel all singled out and bullied!

 

[Goldwasher]

I'm sorry I didn't mean to cause a "heated thread"...certain things get mentioned that strike a chord so I chime in then respond sometimes not thinking about the original thread topic...I'm a terrible cyber citizen
I promise fowledup up I didn't mean to insult you...upset you talk down to or insult...your one of the fellas here I would really like to meet in person.Im sorry I didn't drop it and go th side tracked

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Sorry seen it done many times without issue. It seemed like an easy way to address only the parts of a persons post I wished to address. Guess I'm just screwing up all over the place. You could have pm'd me that instead of dressing me down in front of everyone, I'm a very sensitive individual, now I feel all singled out and bullied!

?.. There was no dressing down....

 

[fowledup]

I'm sorry I didn't mean to cause a "heated thread"...certain things get mentioned that strike a chord so I chime in then respond sometimes not thinking about the original thread topic...I'm a terrible cyber citizen
I promise fowledup up I didn't mean to insult you...upset you talk down to or insult...your one of the fellas here I would really like to meet in person.Im sorry I didn't drop it and go th side tracked

No worries, things that matter get heated, I wasn't insulted at all. I respect your passion and willingness to speak your mind, wish more folks were like you. I didn't figure you were directing anything personal towards me and didn't take it as such. Hopefully you feel the same way. I do admitt that I fit a few of those postng type profiles you mention from time to time- I'm working on that, lol. I also share your frustrations and know from previous conversions that we are more aligned in our thoughts and ideas than different.
Ditto for me, I would love to have you and the crew up our way for a weekend get together, you have an open invitation anytime you'd like just holler! In fact I plan to be over at the claim for most of October, so if you have some free days let me know.

 

[fowledup]

?.. There was no dressing down....I was joking

........Sorry couldn't resist, won't happen again, honest I promise!

 

[fowledup]

Looks like the Animas spill is a repeat performance of their cleanup efforts 5 months ago on a Georgia Cotton Mill.

Another EPA disaster, this time in rural Georgia - Watchdog.org

 

[goldenIrishman]

Ok... Now that Fowled and GW are playing nice again I have a question that I'd like some ideas on from everyone.

We all agree that this fiasco was caused by poor management by the EPA brute squad on site. Names have been named so I won't repeat them yet again.
Now here is the question. How do we make sure that the four individuals in charge are held accountable for their mistakes and how do we make sure that the remaining sludge isn't given a chance to escape into the watershed?

This is what we SHOULD be talking about instead of picking at each other no matter how much we may want to argue with another member at times. We're miners, not senators and congressmen. Let's leave the B.S. to the politicos and get the job done!

 

[bobw53]

how do we make sure that the remaining sludge isn't given a chance to escape into the watershed?

I'm not sure that you can... If you leave it where it is...

I've read too much on this I think... They plugged the lower tunnel, the American Tunnel... Of course that filled up, and then the Gold King went from I think
7 gallons an hour to 250 or something like that..

The owners of the American Tunnel claim that there is no way that the water backed up there could ever
possibly make it to the Gold King... There seems to be some discrepancy as to weather or not the mines are
actually connected, and even if they aren't, rock isn't solid, cracks and fissures and all that...

I'm not a mining engineer, or a chemist, but it seems to me that if the water coming through there is simply allowed to go through and drain out, then
it wouldn't have the time and the contact to turn into an acidic heavy metal soup.

My take, they need to pump all that water out, and then un-plug the American Tunnel. Let the water roll on through, treat with lime stone beds if need be.
If there are shafts up top that water is rolling into, plug those, trying to hold all that water back, and letting it stew is just a recipe for another big spill.

Also, in most articles they keep referring to it as mine "waste". As in the miners brought lead and arsenic and cadmium to the mine and left it there... I've
even seen comments that the people responsible for bringing lead and arsenic and cadmium to the mines should be prosecuted... Where the heck do they
think Lead and Arsenic and Cadmium come from? Do they plan on prosecuting Mother Nature?? Idiots.

 

[KevinInColorado]

Sorry seen it done many times without issue. It seemed like an easy way to address only the parts of a persons post I wished to address. Guess I'm just screwing up all over the place. You could have pm'd me that instead of dressing me down in front of everyone, I'm a very sensitive individual, now I feel all singled out and bullied!

Suck it up buttercup!

PS thanks For volunteering (!!) as a Moderator Treasurehunter

 

[fishnfacts]

So I just heard that the EPA will be receiving Billions with a B to clean up their mess. Wow, I think I will piss in Lake Michigan and request monies to clean it up to make it safe to swim in again.

 

[boogeyman]

And here all this time I thought that dams and drainage were under the Army Corp of Engineers! WHAT was the EPA thinking when they punched a hole in the dam of the retaining pond? Who ever gave the order to do any work on that dam should be in BIG trouble unless they just happen to be a qualified engineer with a background in dam construction.

This story was pointed out to me last night just before I hit the sack so I've had a bit of time to think this one over. This situation raises more than one question in my mind...

1. Why was the EPA messing with the dam in the first place when they're not qualified to do so?

2. Why did they wait so long before getting the word out on the spill?

3. Why did the headlines for the article I read make it sound at first that miners were responsible for the accident?

4. What is the EPA going to do to help the people down stream from this spill that depend on the water in that river for their daily existence? Maybe call in FEMA? We learned how effective they were after Katrina...

This is going to require everyone to keep tabs on this story as it develops. They're already trying to cover up the incompetence of the EPA in this fiasco. This is a golden opportunity for the mining community to show just how worthless all this governmental regulation has become. I mean come on folks... EPA is supposed to be protecting the people from this kind of stuff and here they go and cause a major spill. Even if it is proven that there is nothing really bad in the water, the spill NEVER should have happened in the first place. Yet another example of an agency overstepping their authority, getting themselves into trouble and doing their damnedest to cover up their screw up.

Starting to wonder if the conspiracy people might have a good grip on this. EPA is rumored to be trying to get Super Fund money so they can siphon some to other projects. Another theory is they're trying to divert attention away from the incidents with the Navajo & the taking of one of their sacred places just outside the reservation. These are just theories but to me they're starting to make a lot of sense! Also, the contractors that breached the dike are the one of the EPAs pets. Can't recall the time frame, but the contractors have made around $300 million from EPA contracts. As most of us know ANYTHING with EPA is like a nugget in a dog turd. Gotta scrape down deep to get to the good stuff. Like I said these are just stuff out of the conspiracy community, and my under caffeinated memory.

 

[nh.nugget]

Irishman, I totally agree with you. I asked what was being done felt like I got my head bit off. east coast doesn't get the same news as west coast. Not a CNN fan. I have a huge swamp, bog ,marsh, whatever it's called around the country that is federally protected for endangered species of grass OKAY STOP LAUGHING! It's one of the largest in the state part of it is on my property. And NHDES and EPA come out every couple of years and inspect it. They accually told me I couldn't pick blue berries on my own property because I might step on the grass even though they couldn't find any on my property. So between my one man polluting body shop and a protected swamp I know what a pain these agencies can be. And what they can and can't do. Myself I think they should be doing something to clean their mess now not 5 years later. Hey if I had a spill I had to clean it immediately why should they be any different?

 

[Goldwasher]

The water is highly acidic due to the mineralization in the area....its acidic when it seeps into the tunnels...and makes its way out...there is gonna be some enrichment.....the thing the local anti crowd doesn't know...or doesn't care to know....or doesn't want to admit...is that there is acidic waters in creeks locally that aren't mine related. it turns into more ammo for them. Sort of a "see we told you so".....The only reason these people know there was mining in the area is that the C.O.C. tout it as a reason to visit and appreciate the area.....the locals who are waaaaaaaaaaaaay less affected then they want everyone to believe get to be local activists and feel good about themselves....they can't accept the fact that one of their heroes...EPA MORONS.....would ever do anything to cause a problem...or even make a mistake.....
There are people that have the attitude that we have a p.c. time machine that a current situation...should create enough energy to go back and change the past....They hop on their modern communication devices that were absolutely and specifically available because of industrial mining........and they hope to use the "shame" of the past to prevent future events....without and actual knowledge of mining or the true impacts of historical mining.
I am not being naïve there are mines that were not shutdown properly and the original owners aren't here to make it better...But those huge numbers of abandoned mines are misleading. Those numbers include named mines and prospects.....you will be hard pressed to find the majority of them....lucky to find a depression in the ground or a small ditch.....doesn't matter to an activist...they just want it to say " there are hundreds of thousands of abandoned mines in the west"..." TAKE MY MONEY....OH.... AND THERES AND FIX IT....Epa answers with" Oh thanks we sure will you can count on that"...."we'll send out our best guys"
When we purchased our house there was a report generated letting us know about the mines in the area so we would be informed of "potential" hazards..its a mandatory legal disclosure.....within a mile and a half 400 KNOWN MINES!!!!!!!....you would think you couldn't go for a walk without falling in a hole......it's very difficult to locate any but, a few of the bigger ones and that's because they have better documentation...and/or operated longer.....Either way they are barely a depression in the ground now....and a lot less harmful then implied by a computer generated report!!!

I don't live in Colorado though I have been all over the state and have family there...I will lend whatever support I can...we don't need to win each-others support obviously its the normal population that is being misled.
Barry is this a situation that someone downstream could sue over...or is that going to be difficult considering the fact that I haven't read a single thing about ACTUAL harm
Is this going to be a situation where they gain major financing to put, in a treatment plant like up at the ARGO......and get out of clean up in the water by stating that there is no pollution?....The Irony being that miners digging may cause pollution....but, when the EPA discharged " Mine waste " its un-harmful...has minimal impact...or however it will be worded?

 

[fowledup]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ellow-sludge-spilling-into-a-colorado-creek/- GOod article with a little more historical background on the area

How about a new approach to mine clean up all together. Give it back to the industry that created the probelm make it a part of the industry. How modern mining handles it's byproducts and aftermath is a far cry from its original origins. Enhance the divisions of mines or the like to encompass clean up, without the EPA . Create programs where if feasible a mine in need of clean up or waste management is reopened and the money generated from mining pays for the on going waste management and/or cleanup of that site and others that can't produce. Most of these places aren't a one time clean up. So why not work with nature instead of against it. Entire communties are destroyed, and folks put out of work, yet the problem still exist. Put these same folks back to work mining and doing the clean ups concurrently. The government is spending billions with no gain or offset. Let the production from reopening these mines be the offset. If a mining coroporation is willing to spend its resources and employ more people to take on a problematic mine operation with known waste issues- Subsidize them, they have the experience to deal with it an may actually fix some of these problems. Currently we just put people out of work, stop production and throw money at it a hole with little to no result- or create bigger problems as we have seen. There isn't anything the EPA contractors are doing that a miner dressed in the same bunny suit can't do.

 

[goldenIrishman]

I like it but there is only one problem with that approach Fowled. IT MAKES TOO MUCH SENSE!!!! The government will never go for it for several reasons. First, as I said it makes too much sense. Second is that it would actually cost the American people little if anything in tax dollars. Last but not least is that it isn't wasteful enough to meet basic government spending requirements. Our government has become so entrenched in its ways that thinking outside the box is not something they are no longer capable of. Miners cleaning up mining messes? Why that's unheard of!

Now the question is how do we get the idiots in Washington to even consider this kind of approach when they already have a bunch of know nothings from the EPA itching to take charge and do their best to make an even worse mess out of an already messy situation.

 

[Mad Machinist]

You guys might think I am nuts here, but there is one sure way to control prices. You simply control the supply.

This is being done in the oil market right now. Brent crude is at $45.46 right now as of close of the markets today. There is no end in sight due to no one in OPEC wanting to cut production and lose market share.

The same thing is happening here. To control the price, areas need to be taken "offline" so no one else can get to them right now. And if miner's were allowed to jump in here and help clean up the mess, then it proves that the little guy can mine in a responsible and environmentally friendly way. This IS NOT acceptable in a market that is built to maximize returns to investors. They WILL NOT make any money on the mom and pop mines.

You get someone like Soros or Turner who are heavily invested in mining or "renewable" energy and they will make "contributions" to politicians to make it impossible for the little guy to do anything. Let's face it, very, very few here are ever going to have a mining company listed on the stock exchange that could make these people money off of stock process, so we are basically non-existent to them and they could care less about us.

Everybody needs to understand that all the crap surrounding the little guy mining is purely political. Politicians will only listen to the big donors to their campaigns funds, which by the way they get to keep when they leave office. So in order to control both supply and pubic opinion, money is paid to both politicians and to eco freak groups in order to control prices. And if we want to change this, we need to put ALL differences aside and get our heads out of our "collective" rear ends. This applies to all the pro mining groups too, like the PLP and all the others.


The more and more that I read about this incident, the more and more I believe the incident was both set-up a long time ago and then they "staged" a "blowout" that would both shock and enrage the public to push an "anti-mining" agenda through increased regulation, permitting, and royalties that only the big mining companies can afford to pay.

The question still remains that if there was an active treatment system in place that was effective and being maintained, then why in the nine he!!s did the EPA FORCE their way in to plug the tunnels if it was not to set something like this up?

Especially when anybody with half a functional brain knows that any mountainous area is riddled with cracks, fissures, and fault lines. So effectively any mines in the same mountain are more than likely hydrologically connected. And until the EPA and the rest of the eco freak groups, that are trying to force through a non-liability policy for those cleaning up the mines, understand this and get REAL miners involved, nothing good will come of any of this and more harm than good will be done.

 

[2cmorau]

EPA double standards
EPA threatening Wyoming man with $75K per day fine over homemade pond | Deseret News