beach hunter or surfmaster?

[colorado14ers]

I am thinking about getting a water detector but I want to get a whites, can someone tell me the difference between the Beach Hunter 300 and the Surfmaster Dual Field? Which is a better detector? Any info would be great. Thank you!

 

[PA John]

Depends on where you are going to hunt.

In the water: The PI machines do not discriminate but, go very,very deep. The Beach Hunter will but you lose depth the more you discriminate beside you might lose gold. Most guys, I hear, just try to discriminate out iron which the Beach Hunter will do.
The further from shore you go the less and less trash you find.
I just got a Dual Field machine and like it a lot. I got mine because I can't tell you how many times I have read on this site "Dig Everything!" So I do. I also read that gold goes into the sand very fast so, the deeper I detect, the more likely I will find it. . . right? Haven't found any yet but only used it for a total of 10 hrs, not in prime locations. I am still learning it.


In the dry sand with the sun bathers: Get a land machine for this but, don't get it wet!!!

 

[Silver Surfer]

I am no pro, but can tell you that the Beach Hunter ID is basically an MXT that has been housed in a waterproof box.. Surfmaster is a Pulse Induction machine (BH ID is a VLF machine)... One uses a constant energy field (BHID) and one uses Pulse's of energy.. The PI will look quite a bit deeper, and has a broad "window" for searching, while the VLF machines (BHID) is more like a cone, and at depth the cone comes to a pretty sharp point, so the PI does a better job of covering the area within the coil diameter while sweeping..
The BHID tunes out Iron, the PI does not.. The only thing you can do with the PI is adjust the pulse signal (fast or slow) to discriminate out things like bobby pins, but it is really just discriminating out the size, not type of metal..
I just bought the PI (have an Excal in never never land, i.e., Minelab Service) and I am really liking it so far.. Sure, digging a lot of Iron, nuts and bolts, washers, and stuff, but already have learned the tone for a nail and bobby pins (beep-beep as you sweep over them)... Today, I found 3 .925 Hoop earrings on my short lake hunt... All were over 10" deep... Have been finding clad too, and yesterday I found a $20 bill over a foot down.. A VLF machine would have nulled the magnetic strip out... My vote is for the PI, but since I have both kinds of machines for water hunting (VLF and PI), my advice may not be the best for someone just starting water hunting..
Best of luck, and make sure and tell us what you decide...

 

[U.K. Brian]

Hi Silver,

I hate to say it but you have just about everything wrong in your post. The Beach hunter I.D. is a cut down DFX in a waterproof box. So twin frequency to deal with salt water effects rather than pulse.
Wide v cone detection patterns also can't really be applied as VLF can be wide or narrow, as can P.I.'s depending on the design.
As for the other posts you can get discriminating P.I.'s but until recently you only had ferrous/non ferrous discrimination.

To get back to the original question even with its newer large coil the Beach Hunter still lags behind the D.F. but has the big plus of tone and coloured lights for target I.D. I have the original version with the smaller coil which performs better where there's lots of iron/old chains etc dotted about as I can get in and between the ferrous. The bigger coil of the 300 and D.F. won't allow this.

If you want the best depth go pulse which will tire you out more with the increased digging though there is a degree of audio discrimination with all P.I.'s BUT its not a 100% even on bobby pins as you get a double blip in one direction of sweep but a good signal cross sweeping (so make certain you sweep from different directions). But the bobby pin could be length down in the sand giving just one note or you could have coins on edge giving two.
The Beach Hunter lacks the depth. Doesn't cope as well on black sand but has its discrimination which means you can use it on the dry sand as well. Don't forget less depth could mean more finds as with the P.I. you will be digging deeper holes that end up containing rubbish.

A Pulse Devil when it gets into full production will give the best of both worlds. Pulse depth and full range discrimination.

 

[Lou from downunder]

Brian, with all due respect...

I've been reading about the "Pulse Devil" for about 3 years now.

I, along with MANY fellow Aussies are starting to believe that its, how can I put this delicately?
Lets just say that the claims about the PD are, fanciful?

Lou.

 

[U.K. Brian]

Hmmmm....Here's one on my settee at home.

 

[Silver Surfer]

Hi Silver,

I hate to say it but you have just about everything wrong in your post. The Beach hunter I.D. is a cut down DFX in a waterproof box. So twin frequency to deal with salt water effects rather than pulse.

I'm confused here... I was told by a Whites Rep that the MXT and DFX were basically the same, except that the DFX could have additional programs put in it, where the MXT was a "fixed program machine".. Thats why I chose the MXT, I didnt want to bother with programs, tweaking, etc...

Wide v cone detection patterns also can't really be applied as VLF can be wide or narrow, as can P.I.'s depending on the design.

Well I must be reading the wrong books then, because the MXT Edge, and Pulsepower both show diagram's that illustrate wide vs cone shaped electromagnetic fields..

As for the other posts you can get discriminating P.I.'s but until recently you only had ferrous/non ferrous discrimination.

Tit for tat, yeah, even the PI Dual can be "discriminate" if you count adding pulse delay which will "hide' the smaller signals, but it will also "hide" small gold, which is not really true discrimination (in my view), but target size selectivity. Can you name a PI Machine that has true discrimination such as a VLF, which actually nulls all iron, even at high sensitivity settings?

To get back to the original question even with its newer large coil the Beach Hunter still lags behind the D.F. but has the big plus of tone and coloured lights for target I.D. I have the original version with the smaller coil which performs better where there's lots of iron/old chains etc dotted about as I can get in and between the ferrous. The bigger coil of the 300 and D.F. won't allow this.

Now thats some good info.. I have found that to be very true at the one "trashy" lake near my home.. I couldnt even hunt the dock area, as the big coil could not separate signals at all..

If you want the best depth go pulse which will tire you out more with the increased digging though there is a degree of audio discrimination with all P.I.'s BUT its not a 100% even on bobby pins as you get a double blip in one direction of sweep but a good signal cross sweeping (so make certain you sweep from different directions). But the bobby pin could be length down in the sand giving just one note or you could have coins on edge giving two.

Cant disagree with that, but in all honesty, since i was new to the Excal, I dug nearly as much trash as I have with the PI so far... No iron (but bottle caps are magnetic, and often when rusty dont sound like a bottle cap), per se, but most of the trash I find in or near beaches are pull tabs, bottle caps, and aluminum slaw... So I dig plenty of garbage anyway..

The Beach Hunter lacks the depth. Doesn't cope as well on black sand but has its discrimination which means you can use it on the dry sand as well. Don't forget less depth could mean more finds as with the P.I. you will be digging deeper holes that end up containing rubbish.

Also dont forget, that they (unless they have now solved that problem) have a reputation on many boards of being "leakers".

A Pulse Devil when it gets into full production will give the best of both worlds. Pulse depth and full range discrimination.

Who, when, and where? That will be the ticket...

 

[Silver Surfer]

Hmmmm....Here's one on my settee at home.

Is that a waterproof unit? Doesnt look like it.. Looks nice though..

 

[tnt-k9]

Well. I am no expert by no means. I have owned a Whites M6 for 2 1/2 years and it has done me well. It's paid for itself. A year ago when my wife suggested I throw my name in the hat for this current position I hold, I told her that if I got it I would have to buy an underwater machine and she said no problem. I looked at the BH300 and the PI machine, read the reviews and banked on the BH300. I didn't want to dig up bobby pins.

If you hunt in the "all metal" mode with the BH300 you get depth. I have done that and feel I have no more success than running it in the disc mode. I am in a target rich environment and just today I realized that if you consider the replacement value of the jewelry I've found in the past 7 months I'm pretty close to $30,000.00.

The BH300 is an easy machine to operate and get to know and it produces!!! Even still one of my coworkers after hearing of all my finds has opted for a "Fisher" model.

Good luck on your decision.

 

[Silver Surfer]

So are you saying that a BHID in all-metal mode is as deep as PI machines?
If that is so (and I dont know enough about machines to know), why wouldnt everyone just go with a VLF machine that has the ability to hunt in all-metal mode? I know you can with the Excal, and I can with my MXT, so I am sure most modern VLF machines have that capability..
To think I could have bought a machine for the same money, that hunted as deep, AND have iron disc if I wanted it, makes me wish I would have investigated more thoroughly (can hardly imagine how, I scoured the net for a couple weeks)...
But I guess after today, I dont regret buying the PI one bit..

 

[tnt-k9]

With the BHID in "all metal", according to the subject matter experts. The folks who run in that mode a lot. I seldom go "all metal". They say it adds depth. Not that it exceeds the depth you'll get with a pulse unit. I really can't tell if it adds or not because I'm generally in the water. Regardless of the type I think the most important thing for success is knowing how your particular machine runs. As a novice I think a made the right decision with the BHID and it has been very very good to me. Whenever I talk to people who voice an interest in buying a detector I sing the praises of the BHID (I'm biased), but I always end the conversation with the fact that they have to research and find the machine they think is right for them.

 

[Silver Surfer]

Good info... Is it more expensive than the PI Dual?
Also, when I was looking at a backup machine, I read a lot of reports of leaking problems.. I have to wonder, why would that one leak, but the PI's dont have a reputation of leaking... Same brand.. Doesnt make sense why one would leak and not the other.. Boxes look the same, no?
Thanks for your input, learning a lot from you folks.

 

[tnt-k9]

Good info... Is it more expensive than the PI Dual?
Also, when I was looking at a backup machine, I read a lot of reports of leaking problems.. I have to wonder, why would that one leak, but the PI's dont have a reputation of leaking... Same brand.. Doesnt make sense why one would leak and not the other.. Boxes look the same, no?
Thanks for your input, learning a lot from you folks.

From Whites' the PI Dual is $100.00 less than the BHID. As far as leaking. If I can paraphrase/quote "Sandman" "They tweaked the BH300, switching out the coil to make it less bouyant although it's still a little boutant. They also switched the gasket."

Apparently the first models had a black colored gasket and the newer ones have an orange colored gasket. Mine has an orange gasket and [knock on wood] haven't had any leakage issues. I'm in the water at least 3 times a week for the past 7 months, not including the hosing down it gets when I return to the house. The bouyancy thing doesn't bother me at all. I guess because that's all I know, so I don't miss a coil that doesn't have a little float to it.

 

[U.K. Brian]

The mistake with the machine types is down to the fact that they share one frequency but the MXT remains one frequency and the DFX and Beach Hunter twin frequency.

The Pulse Devil Nemesis has a dual control. Wells its one knob that can be used for full range discrimination say for the top of the beach or at the flick of a switch the full 360 degrees is used for the ferrous range only. This allows us in Europe to be able to run the maximum iron reject without the loss of small hammered silver some of which registers in the minus numbers/part of the meter on I.D. machines.

There's going to be a waterproof version, the Surf Devil which is the Artemis (a cut down version of the Nemesis) in a waterproof case.

Re the leakage problems that Whites had if you look at many of the Beach Hunters you can see that the holes that take the securing screws to hold the two sections together are often off centre with small fragments missing. Plus the old black rubber seal was a pig to fit correctly.

There's some more on the Pulse Devil on the British forum www.ukmdforum.co.uk under General Discussion.

 

[Sandman]

I would say if you wanted to use one of these White's detectors to choose the Dual Field because of it's increased depth. When you are in an area where the sand comes in an goes out you need the extra depth the PI will give over the BHID 300 even in all metal mode.

Both of these coils will float on you, some more than others it seems. This light weight coil is great for dry sand searching and only bothered me in the water where the waves would push the coil around to much. If this bothers you, you can place a sand filled sock on the coil and remove it if you decide to do some dry sand searching on the way back to the car. The addition of the Orange O ring is a definite plus. We have to remember that all these reports of leakage might be from people that didn't clean the sand off the O ring before closing it up guys that used if beyond its limits.

Both are fine detector, but White's bought my BHID back from me because of the advertised "near neutral Buoyancy Coil" when in fact it floated like a cork. Very fine detector other wise.

 

[colorado14ers]

wow, thank you everyone for your help! The people on this site are really helpful! Im saving up right now and i dont think i will get the detector for a few months but now i know more about each detector. thank you everyone for your help!!