Bottle Caps are the Achilles' Heel of the XP Deus

[signal_line]

Looks to me like you can use the ID NORM in reverse also--like when you are searching in 4KHz (or 14KHz with HF coil), change to a higher frequency and the bottle caps VDI should go down.

 

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[Iron Buzz]

Deja vu...lol.

You proved it to yourself nearly 2 years ago, see this thread:
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/deus/552116-hf-9-5-coil-tid-normalized.html#post5519241

It was the first thing that popped up when I did a google search on "Deus HF coils and ID Norm". BTW - I didn't remember this thread either...

Getting old is no fun.

 

[vferrari]

Looks to me like you can use the ID NORM in reverse also--like when you are searching in 4KHz (or 14KHz with HF coil), change to a higher frequency and the bottle caps VDI should go down.

Yes, it works in either direction. You are simply looking for an inconsistent change in VDI with frequence. Non-ferrous targets behave as expected, ferro magnetic targets like iron usually do not.

 

[vferrari]

Getting old is no fun.

Lol - Man, you got that right. Do not beat yourself up over it. I had no recollection of the thread either, even after I read it.

 

[secondstar]

Lol - Man, you got that right. Do not beat yourself up over it. I had no recollection of the thread either, even after I read it.

I can't even remember what I posted last night ;-)

 

[Bharpring]

I have just posted my next video about differentiating bottle caps with the XP Deus as a new post on this Deus Forum. In this video I use both the HF round coil and x35 11" round coil to test some coins and bottle caps in my test garden. I try Frequency change, Silencer change, Profile change from Horseshoe screen to XY Screen, and pin pointing to see if they can help to differentiate a bottle cap from a good non ferrous.

 

[GeoW]

At what point will the bottle cap be discriminated and the silver coin still give a good response? At what discrimination setting number?

 

[Bharpring]

Around 87 at Frequency 14kHz and 93 at 26kHz

 

[1942 merc]

I gave up on the bottle cap thing and just use my equinox now .

 

[signal_line]

Haven't tried this but it says you can use Gold Field program with IAR as an Iron Check for bottle caps. "IAR in the USA"

Deus Gold field secrets - XP Detectors

 

[vferrari]

Gold Field with high IAR settings break up ferrous and mixed ferrous signals signals similar to what silencer does so it can be a useful BC telltale tool.

Problem is, in highly mineralized dirt or heavy black sand, everything (ferrrous and non-ferrous) tends to sound chopped up with IAR cut in due to the ferrous content of the dirt itself. Yet, in highly mineralized dirt, Gold Field tends to give audio signals on deeper targets where the other modes struggle (though you tend to not get a target ID or a ferrous ID on those deep targets so you don't know what you have until you recover it), so when hunting in highly mineralized ground, Gold Field with zero IAR is a good choice. But I digress...

Bottom line, though, yeah, you can use Gold Field with IAR in mild ground or at the beach as a BC check, but you need to be familiar with how a ferrous and non-ferrous targets sound in Gold Field because Gold Field audio is sort of like pitch or pinpointer audio, with only visual target ID and no tone ID. It will sound weird to you if you are used to only using multitones or full tones. Also, Gold Field uses a threshold tone, as well. I have a couple of custom Gold Field programs saved at different frequencies with and without IAR and use those for relic hunting in nasty hot dirt.

 

[renogeoff]

Great info guys. I just got a Deus, switching from years with Minelab, so I detect mostly by sound. (I have no choice anyway since I got the XP-Lite version) and right away I noticed my screw cap and rusty bottle cap finds skyrocketed (but also some great finds too!) so I am looking for any Lite settings or techniques to try. I dig most good signals right now to get my ears trained, and mostly use the stock "fast" and "deep" programs depending on conditions. The only tweeks I do on settings is adjusting the frequency. I did find that by turning 90 degrees and and swiping the target i can get a stuttering sound on the bottle caps vs a solid clean tone, but other times it still sounds great, until I take some dirt off the target and re-swing and then the choppy/broken sound kicks in and sure enough its a rusty cap or flathead nail. I have the v5.2 with the x35 coil.

 

[signal_line]

Great info guys. I just got a Deus, switching from years with Minelab, so I detect mostly by sound. (I have no choice anyway since I got the XP-Lite version) and right away I noticed my screw cap and rusty bottle cap finds skyrocketed (but also some great finds too!) so I am looking for any Lite settings or techniques to try. I dig most good signals right now to get my ears trained, and mostly use the stock "fast" and "deep" programs depending on conditions. The only tweeks I do on settings is adjusting the frequency. I did find that by turning 90 degrees and and swiping the target i can get a stuttering sound on the bottle caps vs a solid clean tone, but other times it still sounds great, until I take some dirt off the target and re-swing and then the choppy/broken sound kicks in and sure enough its a rusty cap or flathead nail. I have the v5.2 with the x35 coil.

Coil control is important. Put out some test targets and use some iron volume (not sure if you have that option), coins, rings, tabs, bottle caps, and do a wiggle over them then pull the coil off. Right at the edge you will hear some iron on the bottle caps, and some other squawk sounds on some of the other stuff. Just learn that. Coins and rings may give some. but over all very solid and clean edge. When hunting it is easier to hear the surface targets multi blips, then practice on them before digging. Might have to lift the coil some.

 

[Gare]

Just try this with your settings and readings and report back. Take the quarter and when the coil is close to it swing and get a reading, Then raise the coil 8 to 10 inches and see if the reading is the same. Then try the EXACT same thing with the bottle cap The numbers on the bottle cap will change as ypu raise the coiul

 

[signal_line]

Haven't tried this but it says you can use Gold Field program with IAR as an Iron Check for bottle caps. "IAR in the USA"

Deus Gold field secrets - XP Detectors

I tried this today and it give bottle caps a broken up tone with IAR set at "3", didn't try any other settings.

 

[Indy durtdigger]

Got several more hunts with the machine since this thread started. I see your point on the aluminum and alloy caps now and am glad that there aren't many in the parks I hunt. The one thing this detector does that drives me batty is even in 4khz it absolutely bangs on wadded up bits of tin foil like the old Ding Dong wrappers like it is its job until ya pop the plug and the perfect signal turns into a broken up wonky low tone. Gets an audible aaawe out of me every time. Given that my finds this year have sky rocketed in both quantity and quality I suppose I can live it though.

 

[lrgoodger]

Hunted an old hunted out park where I got barbers and indians, tons of wheaties and mercs with the Deus I. I could not believe all the pie top bottle caps the whites 6000D and Minelab Soverign had discriminated out. I could not figure out how to tell them on the Deus. I dug 10 of them in a 3 foot circle, but I also got the 3 wheaties they had been masking.

So, will I start digging up bottle caps to make sure they are not masking anything? It looks like it. One of those wheaties could easily have been a barber quarter.

 

[Iron Buzz]

Hunted an old hunted out park where I got barbers and indians, tons of wheaties and mercs with the Deus I. I could not believe all the pie top bottle caps the whites 6000D and Minelab Soverign had discriminated out. I could not figure out how to tell them on the Deus. I dug 10 of them in a 3 foot circle, but I also got the 3 wheaties they had been masking.

So, will I start digging up bottle caps to make sure they are not masking anything? It looks like it. One of those wheaties could easily have been a barber quarter.

The Deus II has a bottle cap filter, and also the multi-frequency feature alone helps by moving the IDs way down out of the high conductor numbers.

 

[Ism]

You can tell a bottle cap on the D1 (w/standard coil) without adjusting silencer by switching to a lower frequency.
If the TID stays the same or rises in comparison to a quarter, it's a bottle cap.

 

[pepperj]

The Deus II has a bottle cap filter, and also the multi-frequency feature alone helps by moving the IDs way down out of the high conductor numbers.

I have a site that produces silver/coppers but the area is layered with old caps. (steel)
What setting would you suggest to filter out-or just reject enough to skip them.
They seem to come up in the 80's if recall