C.S.A. Buckle real or not

[confederate83]

Picked this up out of a large collection of civil war relics I thought the hooks looked good but I'm unsure about the stamping on the back please help

 

[AU Seeker]

According to this website it's a reproduction buckle, but it's origins is unknown.

Edit: I have posted the disclaimer from the website that the info below was taken from.

Fakes, CSA rectangle belt plate, Atlanta style, Confederate plates 084 to 101*

"This buckle came from an Idaho estate sale and someone has cleaned part of it, but you can still see age and batina on the back , and the center of the C It measures 1 7/8 by 2 13/16 one of the clasps is about half gone (see pic.) I believe it to be real, but will accept return incl. postage within 10 days I dont know what the writing on the back (things assoc. or thinnis assoc. ) means. I have been informed by mark that Things assoc. means reproduction from 1961"
ebay auction by roreyr, 8/11/06 "CSA confederate belt buckle things assoc. NR Idaho Item number: 230015267212"
Editor note. This is honest auction, seller noted that it is repro. I don't know if this is centennial repro (1960's) or it could be Hollywood (1930's).

Disclaimer
This is an investigative report or "blog" dealing with Civil War fakes, reproductions and replicas. Items are listed on this page because the possibility has been raised that an item may be a fake, reproduction, or replica of a Civil War piece. I cannot guarantee that any of these items are fakes, reproductions, or replicas, nor can I guarantee that any of these items are real. No warranties or representations whatsoever are made about the correctness, accuracy or completeness of any of the information expressed on this page. This page is provided at no cost to any of the readers, I finance 100% of the cost of this page, no advertising is accepted, no fees for use are charged, this is done as a public service to the Civil War collector. Owners or prospective buyers will have to make their own judgments about the information presented. I reserve the right to disclose the source of my information, and I reserve the right to withhold disclosure, such disclosure is entirely at my discretion. I make no restrictions as to the use of this information, feel free to download pictures, print the page, or reference any of the information shown. All information shown is considered to be an opinion only, the readers will have to reach their own conclusions. Owners of these items or similar items may disagree with the information presented, or conclusions proposed. If anybody wishes to re-butt, add to, or refute any of the findings on this page, send me your comments in writing, I will publish your comments or arguments, reserving the right to remove profanity, inflammatory language, accusations, irrelevant comments, or other language deemed inappropriate, at my sole discretion. Any information obtained may be used. As more information is obtained, it will be added to this page.

 

[confederate83]

I have seen this site one guy says real other guy says fake who do you believe

 

[woodstock]

Hey here's what I think is a good question and please tell me if it's not . Back during the Civil war I've read that there where many , many suppliers of everything on both sides . Can it be curtain that all these suppliers are cataloged with everything they made to suppy the troops ? I guess what I'm trying to say that maybe this one is a reproduction but couldn't there be others that a labeled fakes or reproductions actually be authentic pieces made during the Civil war by obscure makers from that time in our history ? Weren't local Blacksmiths were to numerous to keep an accurate account of everyone and everything they supplied ? To be a settler or farmer/rancher in the North or South made you a quire many skills to survive if going to a town for all your needs and things like Blacksmith skills must have been handed down from father to son or even your help . Could there be Civil War relics made to support troops that weren't noted in records or books ? I've made knifes all but myself and they had no makers marks and if I did mark them they still wouldn't be recorded anywhere . So is my scenario at least possible Just curious and I'd like other experts who do know weigh in on this question and it's possibility's . What you the experts think about my questions ? Happy Hunting ! Woodstock

 

[gsxraddict]

fake, proof is in the C.S.A they are not even the correct lettering style. The stamp on the back is the proof as well.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

It is absolutely a reproduction. Note that its body is as flat as a sheet of plywood. None of the actual civil war era Rectangular CSA beltbuckles were flat. Also, it is made of yellow brass, which is incorrect. The shape of the belt-hooks' body is incorrect. And, as Gsxraddict mentioned, no genuine Rectaangular CSA beltbuckles were marked on the back in any way -- no maker's-name, nor date. I mention "date" because fakes are often marked with a civil war year, such as 1861 or 1863, to give the (false) impression that it is really that old.

 

[taz42o]

Found this online, it was a response to a question about a buckle marked TA.

TA stands for Things Associates of Louisville, KY. They made reproduction plates in the 1960's for the Civil War Centennial. A friend has a CSA rectangular plate made by them in the original box. At first they stamped the back of their plates THINGS ASSOC. but then went simply to TA. They also first started out of Nashville, TN. I don't know when they stopped making plates.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Woodstock asked a bunch of (reasonable) questions, and concluded by saying:
> So is my scenario at least possible?

Woodstock, your scenario is correct, many manufacturers of civil war military equipment did not mark their products. So, to spot reproductions and fakes (which are two different things), we relic "scholars" have done micro-examination to observe and catalog subtle differences between the Original (pre-1866) relics and the later-made Reproductions/imitations/fakes. I listed several of those differences (which we call Authentification clues) in my reply above about finder Confederate83's reproduction CSA beltbuckle.

 

[confederate83]

Thanks guys it is unfortunate my gut said fake but just wasn't sure it does seem to be an uncommon repro I can't seem to find many around these days I know some of the bannerman repros are somewhat collectable