DeLeon observations..

[bibelot]

I picked up a used NEL Storm 5 pin off fleebay that turned out to be junk I guess, who knows? Can't turn the Silver umax over sensitivity of 5 without unit oscillating. Put it on the Outlaw and cant quite get it to ground balance. It's a little negative and as you approach null, the machine goes silent, nothing at all. With all metal preset at full, there is no way to turn it down to 50%. Contacted NEL directly, they said "contact dealer". I contacted dealer and they tried to help, took serial number and said it was 3 years old, forget it. Basically if it's under warranty, they'll send you a new one, but when two year warranty runs out, tough luck. They offered to sell me a new one at a discount which I appreciated, but ain't no way I'm pouring more money into NEL. I made a mistake, but won't risk following it up with another one. I've used many NEL coils over the years on my Fishers and never had a problem, but the way I was treated on my first attempt at a repair, forget it. I'll never buy another foreign coil again.

I broke the connector off my 11x8 RSD coil from Tesoro and they fixed it no charge!
ymmv

Steve, ground balance it at 50% sensitivity or less and then once ground balanced, crank the sensitivity up to hunt.

 

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[steve1357]

Steve, ground balance it at 50% sensitivity or less and then once ground balanced, crank the sensitivity up to hunt.

How do you ground balance at 50% when all metal is fixed at 100%? That's what NEL says do but they ignored my question "Contact dealer"

 

[bibelot]

How do you ground balance at 50% when all metal is fixed at 100%? That's what NEL says do but they ignored my question "Contact dealer"

That is a very good question, confirms my reason for thinking it would not work well at all with the Deleon since there is absolutely no ground balance capability at all, same as your silver Umax . I was thinking the outlaw could ground balance in all metal with less sensitivity, but I guess not ? The Nel runs hot on my T2 after ground balanced at 50%,I never tried to run it without the proper ground balancing procedure though. Well that sucks ! I love the target separation and tone clarity of the Nel on my T2.

 

[steve1357]

That is a very good question, confirms my reason for thinking it would not work well at all with the Deleon since there is absolutely no ground balance capability at all, same as your silver Umax . I was thinking the outlaw could ground balance in all metal with less sensitivity, but I guess not ? The Nel runs hot on my T2 after ground balanced at 50%,I never tried to run it without the proper ground balancing procedure though. Well that sucks ! I love the target separation and tone clarity of the Nel on my T2.

I'm hoping we see more Tesoro 4 pin coils from Tesoro. That 12x10 concentric 5 pin is awesome on my Silver, the 12x10 4 pin widescan just didnt much more for me than the 11x8 RSD. A 15" like Fisher's would be nice from Tesoro. And a 10 or 11" "Mojave" coil...lol

 

[doggoneitdignit]

Deleon observation, one just sold used on eaby $265 US what a steal.

 

[Vern2]

Deleon observation, one just sold used on eaby $265 US what a steal.

You got that right! What a steal, what a deal.
I paid $509.00 for mine, and I wouldn't sell it for that. Scouts honor.

 

[doggoneitdignit]

I believe you too Vern, can't believe someone would let it go and sold for that, last ones sold were for 330.00. If I owned one starting bid would be 330.00 at least, depends how used it was and don't think it was that used.

 

[Stoof2010]

I got mine for like 275 but I factored into the end cost of 350 for UPS shipping to Tesoro and $50 for the checkup. Standard for any factory set GB unit. Plus it was acting weird when I got it. So in the end I got it into tip top shape and had it set to my Troy coil.
But for that price you can't beat it.

 

[doggoneitdignit]

Sometimes I get the carrots ^^^^^ on some areas, but mostly no. That machine runs best at sensitivity between 5-8. I'm thinking you're overloading because either your threshold is too high and/or your sensitivity is too high. Just a thought. But my 7" coil is smaller than the stock coil.
But I'd start back with the stock coil and setting the threshold at a slight hum and the sensitivity at 8 and trying that before anything else.
That machine runs best with the coil it's been tuned to. I sent mine in and had it set for that coil. So I recommend trying to set it up with the stock coil with what I suggested above first.
When I first got mine I ran my sensitivity really high and it didn't work well.
Many don't think so, but that's a very powerful machine. If you run it's something faint, you can turn it up. but for general searching you'll do best not running it so hot

Sorry don't mean to take away from the Deleon post here, but I needed to look at this thread again from what Stoof mentioned, back on my settings on the Vaquero and GB I had set my 6 sensitivity to to begin with getting no hits on my 5.75 coil then I tryed right near 10 without trying 8 first and increased my threashold higher then work my way up to 10 instead, did this off the bat a few days ago after the ground is wet I will try this again with my Vaq as explained for the Deleon, two different frequency machines yes but re-looking at how you explained it I forgot to try this.

Here is my post below on how I turned out but like your approach here instead, again was thinking this and what got me from sensitivity 6 I was getting no hits on my 5.75" coil until i cranked the sensitvity up to near 10. Again I started with 5.75 coil not my deeper 11x8 stock to start with here, so maybe the higher setting helped it even at 14.5-14.7 KHz here..I was breaking up higher so think your right try 8 first then increase makes sense, even as Terry Soloman has mentioned, I think I was following Scannerguy here on depth to go 10 to begin with no hurt of course but some of those deeper singles in wet signals imagine experiencing some falsing on some items. Always good to experiment.

Check out my response on this if you like and thanks for posting this earlier too.

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/tesoro/538051-vaquro-ground-balance.html

 

[Vern2]

Just a note about Tesoro coils. Before I ordered my much loved 5.75 concentric, I talked with Allen first, at Tesoro.
He said maybe 1 in 20 coils have to be tuned to the machine.
If you are buying a Tesoro coil made for your Tesoro MD.
He said he was not sure of the correct percentage, but it doesn't happen very often.
Buying used could lead to a Boogaloo.

 

[Stoof2010]

Sorry don't mean to take away from the Deleon post here, but I needed to look at this thread again from what Stoof mentioned, back on my settings on the Vaquero and GB I had set my 6 sensitivity to to begin with getting no hits on my 5.75 coil then I tryed right near 10 without trying 8 first and increased my threashold higher then work my way up to 10 instead, did this off the bat a few days ago after the ground is wet I will try this again with my Vaq as explained for the Deleon, two different frequency machines yes but re-looking at how you explained it I forgot to try this.

Here is my post below on how I turned out but like your approach here instead, again was thinking this and what got me from sensitivity 6 I was getting no hits on my 5.75" coil until i cranked the sensitvity up to near 10. Again I started with 5.75 coil not my deeper 11x8 stock to start with here, so maybe the higher setting helped it even at 14.5-14.7 KHz here..I was breaking up higher so think your right try 8 first then increase makes sense, even as Terry Soloman has mentioned, I think I was following Scannerguy here on depth to go 10 to begin with no hurt of course but some of those deeper singles in wet signals imagine experiencing some falsing on some items. Always good to experiment.

Check out my response on this if you like and thanks for posting this earlier too.

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/tesoro/538051-vaquro-ground-balance.html

No worries. But for my vaquero I don't run lower. I run that things high as I can without it chattering. Running lower seems to help with Deleon but should be ok to crank the vaquero. The Deleon has analog circuitry teaming up with digital processor so I think that's where running lower helps.

 

[Stoof2010]

Just a note about Tesoro coils. Before I ordered my much loved 5.75 concentric, I talked with Allen first, at Tesoro.
He said maybe 1 in 20 coils have to be tuned to the machine.
If you are buying a Tesoro coil made for your Tesoro MD.
He said he was not sure of the correct percentage, but it doesn't happen very often.
Buying used could lead to a Boogaloo.

I agree. You don't always have to tune the machine to the coil. Whole reason behind me and others saying that is that for a factory set GB machine for it to run at it's best, the machine has to be set to the coil. Not the other way around.
I don't doubt you do well without sending it in, but all that is meant by that is to make it run at it's very best, you have the machine set to it. Sometimes you have no noticeable performance lost.

 

[doggoneitdignit]

Ok sounds good Stoof, I was thinking for the Vaq the same thing just don't own a 10Khz machine yep makes sense thanks for that seem to work pretty good for me always good to have a second opinion.

HH.

 

[Vern2]

I agree, Stefan. Please remember, while I love to comment, I am still in pre-K.

 

[bibelot]

Deleon observation, one just sold used on eaby $265 US what a steal.

I wonder why they opted to put the old donut coil on it when selling it ? the stock coil probably fetched another $100 or more unless he kept it for another 5 pin machine.