Divers and Diving

[itmaiden]

Since we have so many divers on this forum, it would be nice to learn a little more about diving, diving conditions, the underwater zone, currents, and whatever else you have a question on.

My first questions :

What is the greatest depth you can safely dive for treasure ?

How aggressive are sharks and other sea creatures towards divers ?

itmaiden

 

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[Whittman]

The depth / safety thing is relative. A lot of it has to do with technology, training, and experience. There are some that commonly dive to depths that others would think insane. As far as sharks and marine life go; they have never been an issue here in the Northeast. I've been diving over twenty years and have only seen a handful of sharks. I have friends that have seen Great White sharks off of NJ, and despite crapping their pants, were not otherwise bothered. I'm sure many of you see them more down South mostly because the visibitly is generally much better. I've seen many when diving off NC.

 

[itmaiden]

That is interesting as I was just reading of how bad the sharks are off NC. Also of a news article with a nuisance and aggressive white shark that is making human attacks off of NJ.

Of course, we have warmer water here in Florida, and the number of shark species is unbelievable. It seems that off the Treasure Coast the sharks have been more aggressive in recent years.

Some salvage operators do not seem to like the deeper waters much. Shallow water is easier and I can understand that. I want to get a deeper understanding of diving issues to not only appreciate the risk and hard work of the divers (and I do not think they are often rewarded as they should be), but also in order to assist salvage companies with leads for items of interest.

Human safety is always foremost in my concerns.

I want to better understand the needs of divers, their equipment, and how to better ensure their safety. I don't fully understand the why's to my intense interest or need to know other than I feel there will be a time when I will need this information.

Thank you for responding. I hope many of the seasoned divers that visit this board will respond and tell us a little more about themselves.
I am always fascinated by their posts as well as their humor.

itmaiden

 

[rumracer]

That is interesting as I was just reading of how bad the sharks are off NC. Also of a news article with a nuisance and aggressive white shark that is making human attacks off of NJ.

Just curious were you found the nj article. Was it online, and if so do you have a link?

Kevin

 

[itmaiden]

It was on one of the Internet news sites, but I didn't save it. Could have been yahoo news.

I'll see if I can locate it for you.

itmaiden


Just curious were you found the nj article. Was it online, and if so do you have a link?

Kevin
[/quote]

 

[itmaiden]

Kevn,

I didn't find the NJ article, but here are a number of interesting links on shark attacks in Florida and elsewhere.


http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/fish/sharks/statistics/GAttack/mapFL.htm

http://www.wftv.com/news/16167250/detail.html

http://www.sharktimes.com/index.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,158931,00.html

http://www.semp.us/publications/biot_reader.php?BiotID=195

Other info:

A Florida man became Volusia County’s second shark bite victim of the year.
The unidentified 20-year-old was surfing late Monday afternoon when a shark grabbed his right ankle leaving him with some puncture wounds. He’ll live, but still…

Last month, a 17-year-old girl received the honor of being the first shark bite victim of 2009 when she was bit on the foot while surfing south of the south Jetty on March 19.

FYI: April is a prime month for bites because of murky water, good waves and lots of bait fish in the surf.

Recent Florida Attack, Carlin Park area off of Jupiter
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/florida/AP/story/1009799.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,151905,00.html

itmaiden

 

[itmaiden]

Diver Orientation

When diving for shipwrecks, artifacts or for pleasure, it seems like orientation/direction would be a big issue under the water and that it would be easy to get "turned around" or lost.

If diving for artifacts, it seems like it would be hard to keep track of where you have been already in a single dive. While archaeological grids do help, it must seem daunting sometimes to try and keep up with where you have been and where you need to go.

Can you help everyone understand how divers keep from becoming disoriented in the water ?

itmaiden

 

[itmaiden]

Maybe the scuba divers never re-surfaced to tell about it.

I have heard that with surfers they resemble a seal which sharks love to eat. And when you think about it A surfboard with feet dangling off to each side does.

With waders, just think they are "in the way" of where the shark was foraging to begin with.

Swimmers ? Maybe their feet stink !

I really do wonder if anyone has done a study on body odors and shark attacks. Wet suits cover up body odors.

itmaiden

They do make underwater compasses. :P


ps. How many of those shark attacks were on surfers and folks splashing about in the surf zone and how many were scuba divers?

 

[Hangingfor8]

In the case of the Volusia county (Daytona Beach) shark attacks it's more a case of young sharks in dirty water looking for bait fish. Surfers just happen to love the waves just south of Ponce inlet. The problem with that is that the sharks do to. The locals call that area "Shark Shallows". I've lived in this area most of my life and I've seen literally thousands of sharks. Sharks in clear water rarely attack for the simple fact we aren't a food source to them. The main things to remember with sharks are.... #1 Don't swim in dirty or unclear water. and #2 If you see large schools of bait or birds diving on bait you better avoid that area.

 

[itmaiden]

So if someone could map out a debris field before a diver enters the water to recover artifacts, is that map going to be very helpful ?

itmaiden

They do make underwater compasses. :P

I've know I've already covered and area when I start seeing all of the holes I hand fanned out previously.

 

[Skull and Crossbones]

I salvage dive here in SW Florida and here are some thoughts.

Depth - bottom time is a function of depth, training, controlled breathing and type of air mixture. Simple rule, the deeper you dive the shorter the bottom time. Nitrox extends your bottom. The deepest that I've been down is 90 feet on straight air, but the bottom time was limited. You'd like to avoid any decompression dives. Controlling your breathing extends your bottom time. If you're exerting a lot of energy fighting currents or lifting objects you burn through your air.

Sharks - Generally not a problem. But it depends on sea conditions and the type of sharks. I see nurse and other "docile" sharks all of the time. I leave them alone and they leave me alone. The more aggressive sharks in my area are Bull, Lemon, Hammerhead, and Tiger. When i see these sharks i keep an eye on them, don't make any aggressive moves and am ready to leave the water if they are showing aggressive tendencies. Murky water and diving early in the morning or later in the evening are a little more dangerous since the sharks are more active feeding during these times and the murky water make it hard for the sharks to differentiate you from food. Most of the "attacks" are sharks taking an exploratory bite and then the sharks move on.

Other thoughts, the SW coast of Florida is generally shallow compared to the east coast of Florida due to the distance the Continental shelf extends out. Water in SW Florida is clearer in the dry season. Rainy season has not yet begun so the clarity is still good. Once the rain starts the water coming out of the rivers murks the coastline up from Fort Myers north. Hope that helps.

 

[FISHEYE]

Shark is best cooked over a open flame.Baby sharks less then a foot are the best eating.

If you are afraid of sharks,just carry a big Bang stick with you.When i lived in hawaii i had a 10 gauge bang stick.I had to use it several times.I still have a ring in my right ear at times from the last time i killed a shark next to a coral head.10 gauge will take a sharks head clean off.Now i carry a Glock

 

[itmaiden]

Yea, Fisheye, find me a waterproof "bang stick". The most I can handle is a 410. The kick is a little rough on my shoulder.
Kind of hard to manage the bang stick and my tools at the same time.

Do they make floatable grills ?

itmaiden

Shark is best cooked over a open flame.Baby sharks less then a foot are the best eating.

If you are afraid of sharks,just carry a big Bang stick with you.When i lived in hawaii i had a 10 gauge bang stick.I had to use it several times.I still have a ring in my right ear at times from the last time i killed a shark next to a coral head.10 gauge will take a sharks head clean off.Now i carry a Glock

 

[aquanut]

Sharks are not really a concern. Skull gave you the clearest explanation with regards to them. If memory serves me right, I think the last time a Scuba diver was killed by a shark was 10 years ago in the middle keys by a suspected Bull shark. The fact that Florida is the shark attack capitol seems related to the fact that the Black Tip sharks feeding in the Spring and Fall on migrating fish close to shore are mistaking surfers and swimmers for food in waters that have become murky. (Murky waters usually = surfer type waves).
I've gone in the water, right beside Deepsix with a school of Black Tips swimming nearby... we figured since the water was clear and we were at least the same size or bigger they wouldn't bother trying us out. The only time I was interesting to a shark was when one of my treasure hunting buddies grabbed the tail of a nurse shark. He had signaled me over and the next thing I see is one pissed off shark heading straight at me! Well, I was timing my punch to it's nose, because that was the only quick plan I could come up with...As some of you know, distance and sizes are exaggerated half again under water, so my punch went off a bit prematurely. Luckily it was enough to (scare? confuse? amuse?) the shark so it turned and swam away. When we got back on the boat I told my ?Friend? to never do that crap again. It was all he could do to stop laughing and tell me that my eyes had gotten as big around as coffee cups!
I didn't believe him...
Aquanut

 

[itmaiden]

I understand that diving is best at high tide as the water is more clear as it is coming in. I have also read that is when sharks usually like to feed also.

Also, I notice that on the Treasure coasts the waves can come in from 3 different directions at once, and there are conflicting currents at the inlets. Are currents very strong at deeper depths ?

itmaiden

 

[diverlynn]

itmaden,
I have been working off the east coast for several years. I have never seen a shark during the day working a site but we do not swim to or from the boat (we work shallow water wrecks) before sunrise or sunset. That's feeding time. We do see Spinners in the eairly morning when we are getting the blower ready to go into the water.
I was the Dive Master for the Volusia County Marine Research Dive Team for 5 years, crewed as dive master every weekend for 3 years diving the artificial wrecks off Daytona for 20 years and have seen only maybe 10 sharks total in that time and usually during the migrating season or just nurses sleeping. They are there but very shy.
New Smyrna Beach and Daytona are known for their shark bites only 'cause the sharks mistake the movements of the surfers for bait fish. I love to dive off this area but I am not comfortable getting waist deep off the beach.

diverlynn

 

[itmaiden]

Spinners are pretty interesting to watch. Good education here and appreciate it. Diverlynn, how long will your recovery time be before you can get back out in the water ?

itmaiden

 

[diverlynn]

I am good to go NOW, just waiting to get the get-go to be back aboard the Polly L. Looks like two weeks.

Diverlynn

 

[FISHEYE]

I heard thru the grape vine that current divers on the polly L are worried that they wont get thier pay.

 

[diverlynn]

You didn't hear it from me. Maybe you could clarify that statement.

diverlynn