Help on old coin

[Lord Verdigris]

Got this as a gift from my uncle today because he knew I liked coins. He knows nothing about it and had it for years. It appears to be silver and really old. Anybody have ideas on what it is or how old?

 

[grasshopper]

Can't seem to find anything. Can you make out any of the words, or perhaps a date?

All I can see on the front is verbum domini and manet in aeternum, which are two fairly common Latin phrases.

 

[BigWaveDave]

Does not look like any coin I've ever seen...maybe another Tnet member can ID it... very cool though

 

[Metal Magnet]

the latin phrase "verbum domini manet in aternum" translates approximately to "the Word of the Lord abides forever" and is a Lutheran motto. My guess is that this is some sort religious medallion. I think I see Carolus on the reverse.

 

[Lord Verdigris]

I can't find any date. The back says something like
"palatintus rhene carolus odovicis commes"
or close to that. Must mean the guy standing there somehow. It looks maybe like a hammered coin? Hope someone can help.

 

[Metal Magnet]

found this link from the British Museum.

I think most of the text reads
[h=2]Carolus Ludovicus Comes Palatinus ad Rhenum[/h]

 

[Argentium]

I'm not convinced that it's a coin - I'm leaning more toward a commemorative medallion of some kind , I think Metal Magnet is on
to something - also the full profile of the monarch or nobleman is rather unusual. I'm guessing this dates to the 17th or 18th
century and is obviously European - perhaps Italian or Spanish - Very interesting Piece !

 

[Lord Verdigris]

found this link: http://www.britishmuseum.org/research/collection_online/collection_object_details.aspx?objectId=3488653&partId=1&people=104556&peoA=104556-2-70&page=1

You may be on to something there! (:

 

[Lord Verdigris]

Found this but I can't read it. Might not be helpful. Maybe someone can read it?

 

[Prestigitation Digger]

An excellent piece! I hate to sound so vague but it is some type of token from the 16th to 17th century. It is done in an old wood engravers style and the mans armor would fit the 15th to 16th century. He looks to be armed with a early match light type musket and sword. This could be a medal or token commemorating the hundred years war or one of the many religious wars in europe. I am sorry I cant be clearer but as an example...just one of my books for civil war tokens is 400 pages and has over 2000 pictured examples. I hope one of our friends from Europe could maybe help us.

 

[Argentium]

Charles II Duke of Parma - ? (Related to the Bourbon dynasty - I think )- based on a Google search of Carlo Ludivico - The "medallion"
looks earlier to me than his dates - (late 18th C - mid 19th C.)

 

[grasshopper]

You may be on to something there! (:

Definitely. Wish the picture worked on the website (does it for you guys?). This one is a print, says it was an etching, and seems to have some of the same inscription as what's on the coin. I'm wondering if the artist(s) were commissioned to produce an etching for this coin? It says it's from 1646.... I'm no expert here but your coin looks real to me. You may want to email them at the link in the "feedback" section on the bottom of the page. I'm willing to bet they'll be interested and able to provide you with more information. Pretty cool stuff.


edit: I did some more searching...If you look on the British Museum website it says the etching was done by Wenceslaus Hollar, a Bohemian etcher (1607-1677). If you look on google it appears he did a bunch of etchings for other commemorative medals. They look fairly similar.

 

[Lord Verdigris]

Im glad for everyone's help trying to identifying it. So far it sounds like it may be something better than I thought. Maybe it's one of a kind. I hope the mystery gets solved.

 

[grasshopper]

Can you read what it says in the inner circle on the crown side?

 

[Bramblefind]

I couldn't find the exact one but it looks like a 1600s Simon Van De Passe school style gambling counter. Very collectible!

Here is some info-

http://www.ccgtcc-ccn.com/Silver Gambling Counters.pdf

examples of others---

mcsearch.info - The medieval & modern coin search engine

 

[grasshopper]

"Sometimes, however, very famous engravers would turn their skills to gambling pieces."

I wonder if these things and the guy I mentioned earlier are related...

 

[Lord Verdigris]

I think it may be this guy on the coin. It says the same thing that is on the coin in the small print under the portrait picture.

 

[grasshopper]

I think it may be this guy on the coin. It says the same thing that is on the coin in the small print under the portrait picture. View attachment 958832 View attachment 958831 View attachment 958833

Yes, I think this is the print the museum link was referencing.

 

[Argentium]

Bramblefind - the style depicted in one of the gambling counters you've pictured is amazingly close to the style seen in the original post !
Good job ! I think your spot on .

 

[Lord Verdigris]

"Sometimes, however, very famous engravers would turn their skills to gambling pieces." I wonder if these things and the guy I mentioned earlier are related...

I wonder if the guy you found and the one I found are the same guy? They say pretty much exact thing.