Hey Hippy! South Dakota Dovetail.

[quito]

What do you think? Out of Place?

Went to check out a nearby estate auction yesterday. I really didn't plan on attending, I just wanted to scope it out. Turned out the farmer had a frame of 9 points that he had found over the years, mostly small beat up pieces glued into a shadow box. AND there was this! Well, that meant I was staying. 6 hours later I owned it.

Opening day of Pheasant season kept some of the competition that I know away, and fortunately there was nobody there with any real interest in these artifacts, so it went pretty well for me. :-) I visited with the retiring farmer that found it for a while, he never really hunted for them, just picked them up when he stumbled into them. He pointed toward the west, and said he found it just a few rods out in the field. This was about one mile from the Big Sioux River.

I've only had one st charlsey looking piece in the past from our area, it was KRF as well, but much smaller, a collector in Mt Pleasant owns that one now.



It's 4 1/4", and made of Knife River Flint.

 

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[larson1951]

that's nice
you sure come up with some heavily patinated pieces of KRF
real cool

larson1951

 

[quito]

that's nice
you sure come up with some heavily patinated pieces of KRF
real cool

larson1951

LOL!!! Well, I just love that stuff Steve!!!. Hard to beat the blue hued white patina stage in my opinion.

 

[coteau]

Ohh my that is one heck of an acquisition!! There's been a couple dovetail finds in ND believe or not..

 

[quito]

Ohh my that is one heck of an acquisition!! There's been a couple dovetail finds in ND believe or not..

Thanks coteau!

I believe it, that is where the other one I had came from. Sent that one to Jeb, he wouldn't type it, just said is was definatly St. Charlsey though.

Joel

 

[GatorBoy]

Nice one!
I really like the blue that K.R.F. takes on when it passes the white stage.
One of the pieces Larson so kindly sent to me is very blue.

 

[quito]

Nice one!
I really like the blue that K.R.F. takes on when it passes the white stage.
One of the pieces Larson so kindly sent to me is very blue.

FYI
The blue comes as it starts to whiten, the whiter is gets, the less the blue tint, it will eventually patinate to solid white.

 

[GatorBoy]

Ahh.. I have pieces with very thin patina that is white.. the one with the thickest patina is blue.. I just assumed it was the other way around.

 

[old digger]

Beautiful acquisition! Don't you wish you could find one of those ever time you went out hunting.

 

[quito]

Beautiful acquisition! Don't you wish you could find one of those ever time you went out hunting.

Thanks Digger! I just wish I could find something every time out, and i'd be happy to find something comparable to that one just once.

 

[quito]

Oh, and it's mighty translucent too!

 

[Buckleberry]

Wow, incredible and in great shape...out of the area I'm thinking, but not unheard of....

 

[quito]

Wow, incredible and in great shape...out of the area I'm thinking, but not unheard of....

I agree, I agree, and I agree.

Thanks Buckleberry!

 

[monsterrack]

A super fine point I would have jumped on that also

 

[justonemore]

Rarer that side of the Mississippi, but they are there. Makes it all the more special. NICE!

 

[joshuaream]

I'm not Hippy, but I still appreciate a great dove! The notches are classic early archaic punch notching, and beautifully executed. What a great piece (and the first one I've seen.)

That piece would be a great piece for publication in either Central States or Prehistoric American.

You'd be surprised, but those suckers are a lot older than thought. Several years ago people realized that we had to calibrate C-14 dates based on the ammount of carbon in the atomosphere. They worried about it for paleo stuff, and many high plains types were calibrated properly because they came from multicomponent sites that produced paleo through early archaic. They didn't really worry about it for the archaic pieces in the midwest until more recently.

At Indiana site 12hr520, St. Charles points dated to 10,000 to 9300 RCYBP, a couple of other sites exend the end through about 8,800 RCYPB. To put that into context, Folsoms were gone by 10,300 RCYBP (so the oldest Dovetail missed Folsom makers by maybe 300 years.) Agate Basins in your area date to 10,500 to 9,900 RCYBP, so they could have overlapped at the quarry with a Agate Basin or Hells Gap maker. Most of the solid Eden dates are right around 9,500 to 9,200 RCYBP, or solidly older than an Eden. The range of the entire Cody Complex falls pretty much in line with St. Charles & Thebes complex, but St. Charles is probably a couple hundred years older at the begining of the range and stayed on for a few years later (just a longer tradition in the Ohio River valley.)

If that point could talk, it would be a hell of a story.

 

[joshuaream]

Sorry, a couple of spelling errors in my first post and a mildly bad word. That is an exciting piece.

 

[SouthernGirl]

Beautiful!

 

[quito]

Thanks Joshua!

I appreciate your opinion every bit as much as Hippy's. I addressed the thread toward him because I know he is informed, he collects them, has a few real gems himself, and we've met on a few occasions.

Your post was very informative, and I really appreciated your input. I did suspect this point was a bit special, and I do intend on trying to get the finder to put a little something in writing for me to aid in preserving it's provenance. First one you've seen as in from here? the material? Both?

Oh, and the new honey crop is in ( buckwheat and clover) and as good as ever.

Joel

 

[quito]

Beautiful!

Thanks Southern Girl. Yes, it is.