History of the 1715 Treasure, question?

[mad4wrecks]

Ray, I don't think I will be able to make it on Aug. 2nd as I am currently involved in a salvage operation.

I believe those artifacts were found on the 1622 Santa Margarita down in the Keys.

However, the gentleman on the left, salvor Greg Bounds, is currently working the 1715 fleet and is a contributor to this forum (GOHO is his alias). He lives in the Sebastian area.

 

[ourhistory153]

Thanks! John Jones has agreed to be interviewed.

That was my concern that naming this the First Annual Treasure of the 1715 Fleet at this time would be a mistake as
this is the height of the treasure hunting season. The First Annual might be better named for a seminar after the season
was over and there are new stories to tell. So maybe Fall time might be better. When I did my research on the Satellite Beach
exhibit on July 1st 1965 , I read that after a couple days of exhibit time everything was put away under lock and key. I'm still
searching the archives but I believe they did a full public display later in the year that may have had some media coverage.
It would be nice to find some old CBS footage for my Youtube collection.

As I said in the beginning of my posts, I'm a historical writer that dabbles in this subject of the 1715 fleet treasure and not a
treasure hunter than dabbles in history. I'd like to find common ground where the historical community can work in synergy
with the treasure salvage industry and help each other. I told the reporter that I think treasure stories are a great way to get
the general interested in history. Like they say in the movie "National Treasure" with Nicholas Cage.

"What is is about treasure that makes history so fascinating?"


BTW: My new book was reviewed in last Sunday's Florida Today. Titled, "Images of America: Cape Canaveral" .
It was in the Life section. I thought Cathy Mathias wrote the story well.

http://www.floridatoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2008807200305

I think the Link will be good for a couple more days.


Good hunting. "Today might be the day!"

- Ray_Osborne

 

[Patrol]

Yes, Menendez was cruel and what he had done was not condoned and was considered barbaric by the rest of Europe at the time. But you failed to mention that the French were on their way to wipe out Menendez when their ship was blown off course by a storm and wrecked near Canaveral. They were walking on their way back to either their fort in Jacksonville or to attack the Spanish when met by Menendez at Matanzas. Times were tough then and it was said that Menendez had barely enough food to feed themselves no less than a large group biligerents who would have wiped them out if given a chance.

Te

 

[Overeasy]

Wow, Madwrecks and the rest of you guys, very very interesting. I've always felt that the region had so much more interesting history than was indicated. But maybe having a roadside marker every 100 yards up and down A1A might not be a good idea. LP

 

[ourhistory153]

Ray, I don't think I will be able to make it on Aug. 2nd as I am currently involved in a salvage operation.

I believe those artifacts were found on the 1622 Santa Margarita down in the Keys.

However, the gentleman on the left, salvor Greg Bounds, is currently working the 1715 fleet and is a contributor to this forum (GOHO is his alias). He lives in the Sebastian area.

Yes you are right, they are not 1715 but rather an earlier wreck in the Keys that Blue Water Ventures was working on.

The treasure fleets are an amazing story. Correct me if I am wrong but there was some 10 billion dollars worth of gold
and silver transported by Spain from the New World during a period of 300 years. Spain really had their act together as not
only was treasure coming from the New World but also the Far East.

BTW: Does GOHO log onto TN here?

 

[ourhistory153]

Getting back to history. It was mentioned that the French and Spanish were literally at each others throats yet
Philip V of Spain was actually from France. The king of Spain during 1715 was in fact French and began the first of the
Bourbon dynasty in Spain. (according to Wikipedia)

On page 14 of my book I talk about Pedro Menendez. He was supposed to have had a watchtower fort in the local
area called "Santa Lucia de Canaveral." Although many historians believe that this fort was closer to Sebastian.
Does anybody know anything about this at all? I'd like to collect some more data on it if available.

 

[Salvor007]

Santa Lucia de Canaveral was mentioned by Lyons in that lecture he gave at the McLarty about 10 years ago.
(I re-listened to the tape this Monday). It is supposed to be on the north side of the Cape. Historian/conservator Doug Armstrong found some French artifacts on the Mosquito Lagoon and this was discussd as well. Those artifacts are in the McLarty museum.

 

[ivan salis]

I plan to attend and am will to add my knowledge of both the french who had forts up in my area (jacksonville /amelia island nassau county area) and of some interesting info and insights into the 1715 fleet verssels and events as they unfolded. Ivan

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

The Indians took gold coins and reworked them. Im sure you already know about the face like medallions found in ancient Indian mounds. This one is well known from Chokoluskee but many similar ones have been found on the East Coast as well.

An ex-TN member Pegleg claims to have found some gold coins near a Sebastian Indian site. He left us with this picture.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I believe the remaining Ais tribe could have easily killed off the 1715 survivors, like all the others before, but instead chose to help them.. My question would be why?



It only hastened their demise. They had no immunity to Old World diseases. Most of the surviving Ais tribe were shipped to Havanna by the Spaniards. Some Ais survivors assimilated into the Seminole tribe coming down from Georgia. I believe the last Indian chief, with Calusa blood, died in 1849. He was scalped and hung in a tree in the Everglades by the US Army.

 

[ourhistory153]

The treasure seminar went well today. Tom Funk the archaeologist gave a interesting and amusing look at underwater archeology. I did a video clip that I plan to upload at my Youtube account. We had close to 70 people at the seminar. A lot of 'gold and silver' too.

A reporter who was supposed to be there couldn't make but still wants to write the story. If you were there and have a sentence or
two perhaps he will weave it into his story. You are welcome to send me a quote if you like to see it in print.

 

[wreckdiver1715]

Ray, I enjoyed your seminar once again. However, this was my first op pertunity to hear Tom Funk speak, and discuss the project that he and his team have been working down off Melbourne Beach. I guess I am now convinced that they have indeed discovered one of the missing 1715 fleet ships. This only leaves 4 remaining ships missing. I guess I need to look harder!
I also had the pleasure of meeting some of our fellow TreasureNet members at the seminar. It was indeed a pleasure to finally meet Ivan, Mumzie and Nudles.
I look forward to reading your new book on Cape Canaveral. Thanks again for an educational and entertaining morning.

Tom

 

[ourhistory153]

Ray, I enjoyed your seminar once again. However, this was my first op pertunity to hear Tom Funk speak, and discuss the project that he and his team have been working down off Melbourne Beach. I guess I am now convinced that they have indeed discovered one of the missing 1715 fleet ships. This only leaves 4 remaining ships missing. I guess I need to look harder!
I also had the pleasure of meeting some of our fellow TreasureNet members at the seminar. It was indeed a pleasure to finally meet Ivan, Mumzie and Nudles.
I look forward to reading your new book on Cape Canaveral. Thanks again for an educational and entertaining morning.

Tom

Thanks Tom, is it okay if give your comments to my reporter friend? I learned a few things myself. Especially how to do things better
next time. Tom came up with some good tips for us 'coin shooters'. I'm glad I had a chance to meet some of the TN folks here and
some folks related to the original Real Eight members. ie Dan Thompson.

 

[wreckdiver1715]

Sure Ray, no problem!

Tom

 

[ivan salis]

well according to Ubilla's pilot major of the fleet account afterwards as he was questioned --the reason the 4 "missing" vessels were not with the main fleet was that a day BEFORE THE STORM HIT THE MAIN FLEET 4 VESSELS TOOK A MORE NORTHLY TACK (note -- THESE VESSELS WOULD HAVE BEEN THE FASTEST ONES IN echevevz fleet --(were they sent after the french vessel grifon which had broke ranks and was sailing away from the fleet? trying to get her back into the fold --the french vessel had been forced to sail with the fleet to prevent her from leaking out the fleets numbers and location to raiders) the 4 missing vessels were reportly the french galera "prize" vessel EL CIERVO --(loaded with 96 tons of brasilwood) the NAO class SAN MIGUEL (loaded with tabacco from havana) and two patache class type smaller vessels by most accounts folks say their was 12 total vessels -the french ship griffon and 11 "fleet" vessels ---- 7 wrecked vessels were found at or near the main wreck sites ---so with 11 total vessels in the fleet 7 + 4 = 11 vessels ---the more northly tack would have these vessels father up the coast when the later 2nd storm hit them as it beat its way up the coastline headed northward. ---one of the 4 could be the vessel rex's group has found off of melborne--very likely --- at least thats my take on it at this time--- Ivan

 

[ourhistory153]

Sure Ray, no problem!

Tom

I reviewed the video tapes I made. I guess you can't judge some expressions but some people looked bored when the musician sang his song "Silver and Gold."

Did you like the ballad?

Music and culture is a good way to preserve history. IMHO

 

[wreckdiver1715]

I liked the balled very much, catchy little number!

Can you provide info on how to obtain a copy of his CD?

Ivan, I agree! With the discovery of the Melbourne wreck, providing it proves to be from the 1715 fleet, that would leave 4 missing ships remaining.

Tom

 

[ivan salis]

folks today are unused to voice only singing without major bunch of noise being made by a support crew . -- singing without "help" takes a lot of skill -- the old songs and ballads often do preserve historical storys quite well but many folks today fail to properly understand things like that , esp if their only "focus" is learning about the 1715 fleet --to better be able to find the gold on the beaches or seek out a wreck --- folks that are hard focused on things like that care little for anything but the "facts" that they seek --- its a form of "tunnel vision" if you will.-- Ivan

 

[ourhistory153]

The Indians took gold coins and reworked them. Im sure you already know about the face like medallions found in ancient Indian mounds. This one is well known from Chokoluskee but many similar ones have been found on the East Coast as well.


An ex-TN member Pegleg claims to have found some gold coins near a Sebastian Indian site. He left us with this picture.

These are good pictures. Yes, I am very familiar with these tablets. First time made out of gold though. I can't seem to copy them or
save the images. Can you send them to me as files?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Right click on image,
Save Picture As...


Yes I can send you some links.

Too bad the TN member that allegedly found the reworked gold and silver has passed away.
Here is Pegleg.