How much color in samples before really digging?

[G-bone]

Yodels all...

So my question to every one is....
when you go out sampling a new area - how much color do you personally need to see from any given spot to make the decision to really work that area another day?


Went out again yesterday to the place I sampled last week.
I got about 5 specks from an area that looked promising so went back yesterday and gave that area some time.
Cleaned up the bedrock real good and moved approx. 8 unclassified buckets worth.
Actually ended up with less than my sample from the week before.
No skunk, but was kind of expecting more than than that.
Not complaining as it was an awesome day, but got me thinking about future testing.

Cheers

G

 

[goldenIrishman]

That's a tricky question many to to answer G-bone as there are a lot of different factors to consider. Travel time, terrain, required equipment etc etc etc all come into play for us. Being limited to 2wd keeps us out of some of the rougher areas around here but not too many. For us it mainly boils down to can the deposit make us enough money to show a profit. You have to do a lot of testing in an area to get a good idea of its potential. Each deposit is different so each one has its own factors as to when to call it quits on that site. I've seen questionable deposits turn out to be very good in the long run and what seemed like a great deposit run dry after a very short time. It's a gamble with any deposit. Any prospector/miner has to decide when to call it quits when digging just like they do on processing the gold out of the materials.

 

[brianc053]

G-bone, I don't have a specific answer to your question but I did want to share that I had a similar experience up in New Hampshire a few weeks ago. I test panned around 3 or 4 areas of a gravel bar, and then I dug about 2 buckets of classified material from the spot that produced the most specks. I ran those buckets through a small stream sluice. When I cleaned up the sluice I was disappointed by the results, because when I extrapolated out the specks from the one pan across two buckets I figured I'd have scores - and maybe a few hundred - specks. I did not get that from the sluice, and felt like I could have found more gold just panning.

In my case I believe that when I test panned I was getting very shallow flood gold, but when I dug the buckets I dug deeper (not that deep, but not just the first 3 inches of material) and it may have been because of this that I didn't get as much out of the sluice. I also may have been running my sluice too "hot", i.e. at too high an angle with too much water.

Do you think you may have had this sort of issue (too deep or using a sluice/different method in production vs. sampling)?

- Brian

 

[goldog]

A dollar.

Specks add up to nothing. A half grain is a $ in my book. Here in SoCal it's hard to cover gas unless you're in walking distance. :€. I can get a dollar in the wash ten mins away, drive thirty mins to a lower average but higher potential area. (You've joined me here.) Or 60 mins to a higher average, higher potential area (EF) and expect $2-5. Maybe a long hike in would up that, but my body really can't handle that.

Mind sharing what general area you're working. Just so I can help with the assessment of course.

BTW. We'll be up at the claim moving rocks again soon. You're always welcome to come up.
Economically I should stay home. But the draw isn't money. The farther I go the more it costs. All that said

 

[goldenmojo]

Many times you will find that you will automatically go to where the most gold you are going to find in an area is. You work it until something says its time to stop. If you return you find you left very little gold to be found there.

 

[G-bone]

Good points all. Thank you.

 

[RookmanGold]

How many colors?

"when you go out sampling a new area - how much color do you personally need to see from any given spot to make the decision to really work that area another day? "

I will respond to the "personally" above... i.e. for me how much do I need to see.... I should say at the outset I am not doing it to make profit, so might differ in thoughts from some of those above.

For me its all about understanding the jigsaw of the location, if I get color in any pan its always a good thing ... in general though I expect to see between 3-7 specks in a pan. I will then place it together with all the other factors: where is it in relation to a bend?, how "tough" is the gravel?, Are there other Big boulders nearby? Is there also black sand in the pan?.. and then finally, but most importantly, do I feel inside that its worth digging?

From experience if it feels right then its worth digging and I have never been disappointed. I should say straight away that "disappointed" doesn't just relate to gold find. If I dig down and sluice for a few hours I always end up with much more understanding of the general makeup of the river, layers and bedrock - which always helps to point to the next location.

Hope some of that makes sense...

Good luck

 

[Hoser John]

Economic viability is my mandate. I must make enough to pay for the day and delight in the experiences is pure bonus. Specks do not make it, pickers pay. John

 

[Goldwasher]

Many times you will find that you will automatically go to where the most gold you are going to find in an area is. You work it until something says its time to stop. If you return you find you left very little gold to be found there.

This right here!!!!!!!!! It can be a downright curse sometimes!!!

Then a few weeks later you've cleaned another pocket elswhere and are on the move again. Your gut and your memory put you fifteen feet away from a good crack you hit a while back, but never hit cause the one in between sucked. And it starts all over



"never leave gold"....."gold is where you find it"..........the angel on one shoulder ...the devil on the other!!

 

[meMiner]

It is a good question and one could write a book and not give a complete answer. I will provide my comments for what they are worth.

Let me rant first: It drives me mad watching the TV shows with large machine operations, where the narrator says something like "after stripping 20' of overburden in the massive cut, it is all down to one pan". What!!?

For even the smallest operation, you need to sample quite a bit. Find out where the gold is and where it is not (ie find the pay streak - upper limit, lower limit, width, depth, etc). Then do the math on how much overburden you need to remove (dead work) to get at the gold and how much gold is in the pay streak. In some places, the overburden will be too great to justify further pursuit of economic gold or the pay streak too sparse or spotty, with the methods available (to you). Next, at that point (not before), you customize your operation (for effectiveness) and move to production where testing confirmed it is viable (for you). For clarity: sample, sample, sample; math, custom production. When in production, you keep sampling to confirm that you are still on economic gold and also test your tailings to make sure you are not losing too much of it. The earlier math will tell you what you should expect in returns and it is a personal matter whether or not those particular returns are good enough (for you - a personal decision). I know fellows in Alberta who can only get specs and they look for consistent 30+ specs in 14" pan sample(s) before setting up a high banker. Even with that small flour gold, they can do well. Better yet for them, are locations with 80-100+ specs in a pan. In many creeks in British Columbia, the gold can be larger (aka nugget effect), so even one good piece constantly in pan(s) can indicate a good spot to work. Usually, the 'banker setup for Alberta is a different than for a BC creek - - that is a general statement, as there are creeks in BC that are also mostly small gold. Size and shape of the gold being recovered is important when looking at recovery methods. Anyway, the idea is to calculate how much gold is there, for your method of recovery, and how much that material you can move in a day - - figure out if that is acceptable gold for you.

That said, let me address a few of your statements in bold (separates our two conversations):
I got about 5 specks from an area that looked promising so went back yesterday and gave that area some time. If they are truly "specs" (eg. 200 mesh), then 5 is not great for a hand production operation. You would need to move too much dirt to accumulate gold. Rule of thumb - it takes 40,000 pieces of 200 mesh to make an ounce.
Cleaned up the bedrock real good and moved approx. 8 unclassified buckets worth. I am sure you know, you will need to classify before running this material for fine gold, so you do not loose too much gold in your recovery system. Assuming you are using 5 gallon (full) buckets and they had the same material as your pan (so you are comparing apples to apples). FYI - There are about 40 buckets to the yard, so 8 buckets was about 1/8th yard. At the same time, there are about 150-200 pans to the yard (depending on the pan and how full).
Actually ended up with less than my sample from the week before. Possible explanations - different material, loss of gold (not recovered) either in the production run or from the cons.
No skunk, but was kind of expecting more than than that. Hoping or expecting? LOL Actually, this happens quite a bit to everybody, especially if the other factors are not addressed

 

[G-bone]

Hope some of that makes sense...

Good luck

Perfectly.
Thank you.

 

[G-bone]

It is a good question and one could write a book and not give a complete answer. I will provide my comments for what they are worth.


That said, let me address a few of your statements in bold (separates our two conversations):
I got about 5 specks from an area that looked promising so went back yesterday and gave that area some time. If they are truly "specs" (eg. 200 mesh), then 5 is not great for a hand production operation. You would need to move too much dirt to accumulate gold. Rule of thumb - it takes 40,000 pieces of 200 mesh to make an ounce.

The pic here shows what I sampled (circled in red) and the "specks" I got. The Yellow area is what I came back for.



Cleaned up the bedrock real good and moved approx. 8 unclassified buckets worth. I am sure you know, you will need to classify before running this material for fine gold, so you do not loose too much gold in your recovery system. Assuming you are using 5 gallon (full) buckets and they had the same material as your pan (so you are comparing apples to apples). FYI - There are about 40 buckets to the yard, so 8 buckets was about 1/8th yard. At the same time, there are about 150-200 pans to the yard (depending on the pan and how full).

This is the area the second time around after I cleaned up the bedrock.


I am using 2gal canvas buckets / unclassified (using a Bazooka Sniper) and the larger rocks were hand washed in the bazooka to make sure any little stuff was captured.
so for every 2 of the 2gal buckets (full) equaled 1- 5gal bucket.
hence, roughly 8 buckets....which sounds about right = I figure I ran about an 1/8 of a yard or more.
I also checked my tailing pile twice in the day and did not see anything.


Actually ended up with less than my sample from the week before. Possible explanations - different material, loss of gold (not recovered) either in the production run or from the cons.
No skunk, but was kind of expecting more than than that. Hoping or expecting? LOL Actually, this happens quite a bit to everybody, especially if the other factors are not addressed

It was a "hopeful" expectation!! LOL

 

[goldenmojo]

How are you cleaning up the bedrock? The reason i ask is with small gold it sometimes works well to flush the area with water and scrub it with a nylon brush down to a central catch point then snuff out all the material with a Turkey baster.

 

[G-bone]

Exactly how I did it Goldenmojo
only after all the scraping,brushing and flushing, I use a larger hand pump (in the last pic).
I would bring both buckets filled with fresh water and use the hand pump to flush the bedrock.
Worked really good to hold it up close to cracks and crevasses and give a good flush.
then suck it all up with the pump.

 

[G-bone]

The later bedrock pic was taken before the washing.
and pics I took of cleaned bedrock were blurry from water on the lens.
quite a few shots like that actually - arg.

 

[russau]

Phew ! I got to get another cup of coffee cause Im wore out from all the talk of work! Keep at it G-bone , persistence will take you to the spot!

 

[meMiner]

Nice looking spot. I did not realize you were sniping bedrock in my earlier comments. First thing I notice is how smooth some of the actual bedrock is, which does not make a good gold trap, but the place you were sniping looked worthwhile. The thing about sniping is sometimes (most times) a really easy and obvious spot has been done many times before, even in very remote locations. My advise (because there is gold there), is to move around a little bit and try to get into a deeper crevice on the gold path and see what it produces. Especially look for places that are hard pack (somebody else had not cleaned it out recently). Good luck.

 

[Goldwasher]

in areas that have smooth bed rock that are in gold producing stretches, work every crack and drop you do find. Just because its smooth doesn't mean gold doesn't move through. And when it does the gold riding along the bottom will drop and catch where it can. Also smooth bedrock still has cracks many have been pounded and closed up by years of abrasion. look close

 

[G-bone]

Thanks all!!

I think (and feel) the area is worth hitting again but spend another day of sampling with focus on the line I "might" be on.
Can't wait to get out again.

 

[GrizzlyGremlin]

Contrary to most people I find the smooth hard granite bedrock can be crazy good! Goldwasher is on point. Pick even the coat hanger cracks. If its not at least 6-8" deep just move on. Look for cracks near the high bank. Look for gravel or boulders hiding cracks. When you do find one clean the WHOLE thing. Much has been missed by others who only cleaned short sections. Picking cracks is the roulette of prospecting. It can pay, but its not an averages game. If I find anything flakey in the top 6" of the crack I'll beat it apart. You can tell from the material as well. Good cracks are like picking concrete out of it.