✅ SOLVED Identification Help

[intensecrasher]

Hello,
Can anyone help me identify the type of points these are? I have had these for a long time and want to learn more about them but I have no idea where to start without knowing what type the are.
Thanks !

 

[rockheadhunter421]

Where did you find them or what is the recorded locations for these? I already know from the material types they are out of my area. I will make guess on the last two pictured: the lance form could be a Scottsbluff? and the other a Quad? Those two stand out the most to me and look like they are in exceptional condition. Once you give a location, someone here should be able to give you a more definite answer. Really nice arrowheads!

 

[Neanderthal]

I mean no offense by this, but I'm assuming these aren't personal finds of yours? I say this only because they appear to be less-than-ancient.

 

[intensecrasher]

I mean no offense by this, but I'm assuming these aren't personal finds of yours? I say this only because they appear to be less-than-ancient.

No offense taken. These came from a family member. I am a collector and have many many artifacts but most all of mine are from the Mississippian period. Scrapers, triangle points and the like. I was told that these were found in the Texas Oklahoma area. Not positive about that. I did use a flash when I took the pictures. Why do they look modern to you? Just wondering because they do not appear to have modern qualities when viewed in person.

 

[rockheadhunter421]

I understand what you're both saying. I am not an authenticator but if I were to buy these I would be very skeptical myself. True paleo and early artifacts here where I'm from always displays rich deposits, usage/resharpening marks and is well-patinated. Like I said I'm not familiar at all with the materials shown here. If you want to know for sure, a trusted authenticator can definitely solve this for you. Hope all goes well!

 

[intensecrasher]

I would like to have them authenticated...I Just dont want to spend the 50.00 bucks or so each after shipping and everything else. Anyone know of a reasonable priced authenticator who is well established and trusted? I know about mineral deposits but I thought those were pretty much only viewable under high magnification? Not arguing with you...just trying to learn something new!

These were in a box with about 15-20 other points (not that that makes them the real deal) The points pictured are some of the better ones.

 

[Neanderthal]

No offense taken. These came from a family member. I am a collector and have many many artifacts but most all of mine are from the Mississippian period. Scrapers, triangle points and the like. I was told that these were found in the Texas Oklahoma area. Not positive about that. I did use a flash when I took the pictures. Why do they look modern to you? Just wondering because they do not appear to have modern qualities when viewed in person.

They are made incorrectly for the "intended" types and have numerous other issues as well. None of those points were made prehistorically in TX, OK and the material derived from elsewhere. If I had to guess, I would be willing to bet that the knapper was from southern Missouri. That's where most of the material is from anyways.

The first point is an attempt at a Hardin or Kramer and they appeared to use heated Peoria or Springfield Burlington to make it (neither of these points are found where that material occurs). The 4th (auriculate) piece appears to be made from heated material as well, which rarely happens. The 2nd piece may be rechipped rather than modern, but you still have the guilt-by-association thing. The third point is the worst of the lot. It is an attempt at a Scottsbluff, but it's made from heated material, the manufacturing on it is incorrect and the "patination" appears applied rather than acquired.

When looking at relics, you can sometimes dismiss a few anomalies - stuff happens. But when you see this many problematical areas..well, it tends to settle the doubts.

 

[Neanderthal]

Authenticating artifacts is included in my job description, but I don't do it commercially. For another opinion, I would suggest Jim Bennett, from Ohio.

 

[rockheadhunter421]

I have had some authenticated by Ben Stermer before. I believe he prices reasonably; however, I didn't get them done. I bought them, invested in them for about 3 years, and profited. I had 5 total and the outcome was successful. There is many more authenticators you could try also. As for the mineral deposits, I can see the rhyolite ones very well, most of the time w/o magnification. Chert/Flint arrowheads the corticated layer (cortex) may or may not be visible; it is basically the weathering rind or a thick patina. Then, you can have a glossy patina surface also. I don't know everything but maybe you can learn something new or better from another member here.

 

[intensecrasher]

Wow...OK thanks Neanderthal! Can you tell me how I can learn more about the process of identifying modern points? Like I said I have many authentic artifacts that I have personally found but I do not know how to tell the difference between a modern point and an ancient one. The only way I can tell is by guessing when an artifact looks to perfect. I've wanted to buy some points online to add to my collection as I live in a very unfriendly artifact hunting state. I haven't bought any because of the above stated reasons....I would really love to get an education on the subject. Just dont know where to start.

 

[intensecrasher]

Neanderthal, after reading what you said about my points...I think I will save my money and give them to my kids to play with!

 

[GatorBoy]

The best method I know to make sure you do not wind up with imposter artifacts is to stick to finding them yourself.

 

[Neanderthal]

I honestly wouldn't just toss them by the wayside or let them get damaged. Modern or not, they can be a very important educational tool. If you're ever
around Northwest Arkansas, drop by and I'll be happy to go over some points with you and discuss some of the things to look for.

 

[intensecrasher]

Maybe I will post some of my personal finds in this thread later tonight. I started collecting when I was 8 and am now 44. However, 20 of those years were spent in the military and I did very little hunting. Never the less I have an extensive collection.

 

[intensecrasher]

I honestly wouldn't just toss them by the wayside or let them get damaged. Modern or not, they can be a very important educational tool. If you're ever
around Northwest Arkansas, drop by and I'll be happy to go over some points with you and discuss some of the things to look for.

Thanks Neanderthal! I know a lot about artifacts from the area that I collected...Iowa and Minnesota but I would still have a hard time identifying modern stuff. I was able to find a couple of helpful articles online tonight! If I'm ever out your way, I give ya a ring!

 

[intensecrasher]

I like your site Neanderthal! I bookmarked you and like what I have read so far!

 

[monsterrack]

Welcome to Tnet Neanderthal is right about the points shown. I don't mean to say your items are fakes but they look almost to good. JMO the last two look has if they were made with a copper billet instead of antler, the new style of tools leave a very slight different flake pattern . They are still very nice points , I would not give them to my kids to play with, like Neanderthal said keep them to compare to stuff you know is real, the difference will jump out at you, when you learn to look at everything about a point.

 

[intensecrasher]

Thanks Monsterrack, I'll hang on to them and use them for comparison!

 

[curious kat]

...those are so perfect & pretty...and your photos are great!

 

[outlawatheart]

Wow Neanderthal didn't realize you had a site. Your welcome paragraph described us all... LMAOFR!! I was almost late to my own graduation do to rock hunting!!
Added to my fave's and looking forward to exploring your site. THNX.