Logging camp Winchester 1894 saddle ring carbine

[highnam]

I posted this Carbine in my first post on this site over four years ago, titled "100 year old Washington State logging camp finds".
I found this Carbine in the first week of a three year dig! Talk about setting the hook on a young md'er!
The camp suffered a fire in 1913 that burned a row of 14 bunkhouses, my family owned the property and we have roots that go back to the R.R. logging company. After this find I was fully prepared to pull every nail out of the burn site. The next 3 years produced hundreds of buttons from work clothes and suspenders of 30 different designs. The Carbine will always be my favorite "best" find.

 

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[kcm]

Wow, that's awesome! ...Forgive my ignorance, but what is in the image to the top right?

 

[highnam]

That is a piece of flow blue porcelain by Petrus Regout, "Atlanta"....found in the camp.
is that what your referring too?

 

[RustyGold]

Wow! Incredible! I would be in finder's heaven with that site? Thanks for the pictures.

 

[kcm]

That is a piece of flow blue porcelain by Petrus Regout, "Atlanta"....found in the camp.
is that what your referring too?

Actually, I was referring to the entire picture #3. Are they all variations of the same type 'thing'?

Ah, NOW I noticed the porcelain in pic #1 *lol* Guess my mind is elsewhere today!

 

[ecmo]

That's a lot of real nice finds.Verify of suspender clips real neat.I was however confused your title of 1896 Winchester or mfg.date of yours as per ser.#showing it made 1896 Winchester never made a model 1896,they made the model'95 which you have and a very scarce flatside model at that,meaning the side of the receiver has a flat side as opposed to a step in receiver of those mfg.after the first approximately500which yours is.The flatsides were made 1895-96 as opposed to my stepsided one mfg.ser.#dated 1917

 

[DirtyPockects]

Nice old find.

 

[highnam]

That's a lot of real nice finds.Verify of suspender clips real neat.I was however confused your title of 1896 Winchester or mfg.date of yours as per ser.#showing it made 1896 Winchester never made a model 1896,they made the model'95 which you have and a very scarce flatside model at that,meaning the side of the receiver has a flat side as opposed to a step in receiver of those mfg.after the first approximately500which yours is.The flatsides were made 1895-96 as opposed to my stepsided one mfg.ser.#dated 1917View attachment 1309504View attachment 1309504

I am interested for sure in any info I can get...serial numbers are not retrievable from rust.
The only reason I thought it was a model 1896 is because of the lever, the lever is not complete, but I thought that the upturn (nub) of metal on the lever. If it is a model 1895 and rare I would be super excited...any other way to tell?

 

[Bavarian Joe]

It looks like a Model '94 Winchester. There's no magazine box below the receiver like on a '95.

 

[ecmo]

highnam I am super embarrassed,just got you and Bavarian Joes notification,looked again at your photo and discovered I had not seen the forrest for the trees.Yours has a tubler magazine instead of the magazine attached to the lever.Baverian Joes very likely correct in stating mod.1894 but it could also be a mod.1892.I am going to attach a photo,I hope .One on the right you can see vertical locking bolts just forward of the hammer,the mod.1894 on left does not have that.Hope this helps!I feel like a real a**!

 

[highnam]

No worries ecmo...I appreciate the help from those more knowledgable than myself. It can't be easy to ID a rusty gun a such rough shape. I took a picture of the top of the Carbine to hopefully get some more info as to a model 92 or model 94.
Anybody know if a serial # could be retrieved by X-ray or some other technology? Probably a long shot, but how great would it be to know what day it left the factory.

 

[ecmo]

Boy that baby is pretty much toast.Trying to peer through the rust scales(assuming that photo was a top view op the receiver)I couldn't see any trace rectangular hollows of the vertical locking bolts so have to assume it was a mod.94.The model designation would have been stamped on the top tang.That 2" long tapered piece behind the hammer.The serial# would have been stamped on the bottom of the frame forward of the lever and just behind the forearm wood.All the ser.# would do is give you year of mfg.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Is there any reason not to use electrolysis on this piece?

 

[highnam]

Boy that baby is pretty much toast.Trying to peer through the rust scales(assuming that photo was a top view op the receiver)I couldn't see any trace rectangular hollows of the vertical locking bolts so have to assume it was a mod.94.The model designation would have been stamped on the top tang.That 2" long tapered piece behind the hammer.The serial# would have been stamped on the bottom of the frame forward of the lever and just behind the forearm wood.All the ser.# would do is give you year of mfg.

Thanks Ecmo! I'll go with model 94, because I don't see any trace of the vertical locking bolts either. I would love to buy a much later model to display with the relic one, but I wanted to make sure I was accurate with the right model. Does Winchester still produce a descent model 94? If not, what years did they produce a solid 94? Thanks Ecmo

 

[ecmo]

Yes the mod.94 is still made to this day but by Fabrique National arms of Belgium under licence of the Win.name as Winchester closed its doors in 2006.Finding a used one should be no problem as millions were made.President Dwight Eisenhower received serial# 2,000,000 back in the 1950's as a gift from Win.Just 1 1/2 week ago my favorite gun shop had a real nice unrefinished mfg.1960 for $450.If you just want a comparison one to the one you dug up you could get a well used/abused one for less.Also bear in mind if you wanted an older (say 19teens)in a saddle ring carbine as yours be prepared to pay at least double that $450 for one not real pretty to look at as the old Winchesters are very sought after collectables.Shop around,visit as many shops as you can.

 

[highnam]

Yes the mod.94 is still made to this day but by Fabrique National arms of Belgium under licence of the Win.name as Winchester closed its doors in 2006.Finding a used one should be no problem as millions were made.President Dwight Eisenhower received serial# 2,000,000 back in the 1950's as a gift from Win.Just 1 1/2 week ago my favorite gun shop had a real nice unrefinished mfg.1960 for $450.If you just want a comparison one to the one you dug up you could get a well used/abused one for less.Also bear in mind if you wanted an older (say 19teens)in a saddle ring carbine as yours be prepared to pay at least double that $450 for one not real pretty to look at as the old Winchesters are very sought after collectables.Shop around,visit as many shops as you can.

Thanks for the advice Ecmo...exactly the info I was looking for.

 

[ecmo]

Gl and HH

 

[Deerhunter24]

Most likely an 1894 Winchester. Man that would be awesome to find one like that...what a story that gun would tell if it could.

I'm wondering if you could use a sandblaster on the bottom part of the frame to uncover a serial number

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

you should use electrolysis

 

[ARC]

Is there any reason not to use electrolysis on this piece?

Agreed,,, I would immediately begin the process.

Any way to see the entire thing ? the butt end ?